Another Toilet Thread - MSD questions

[WanderIVth]

We're the proud new owners of a 1999 Lagoon 410. It currently has two jabsco manual toilets with 15 gallon holding tanks in the bathrooms behind a panel. There is quite the smell inside the bathrooms/boat.

We would like the toilets to run as closely to household toilets as possible. We're not going to go the composting/dessicating route because we eventually want to sell this and brokers have told us to avoid those for that reason.

What I would like to do is to switch from the twin 15 gallon tanks in the bathrooms to a larger tank in the midship port locker. The anchor locker is on the starboard and has the freshwater tank in it, I want to put the wastewater tank in the other one. This would allow me to put a small amount of storage in the heads where the old holding tanks are and to move the tank outside the interior of the boat. I also want to have electric toilets.

From what I've seen, the lectrasan type systems require 40+ amps. We're on 30 amp plugs so I'm guessing that won't work. Also, when we're out at sea, I don't want them to use heaps of electricity.

I saw the Ahead system, but it doesn't talk about electricity load. Does anyone have any recommendations for how to get this plan in action?

Thanks in advance.

[Lepke]

I almost put the Ahead system in my current boat and had a similar system on a remote farm. Depending on where the tank is located, above or below the waterline, you may not need a pump. The only power is a small air pump that injects air into the sewage. Probably 5 - 10 amps of AC and could be DC.

If the tank is above the waterline, gravity moves the contents from section to section and finally overboard. The land system put out clean, clear water, tested daily for a year to get approval. Chlorine wasn't needed. No smells anywhere in the process.

In my boat I went with Incinolets because of the increasing no discharge zones and no plumbing or tanks.

[WanderIVth]

Originally Posted by Lepke

In my boat I went with Incinolets because of the increasing no discharge zones and no plumbing or tanks.

How much power do those use?

[Kelkara]

Originally Posted by WanderIVth

From what I've seen, the lectrasan type systems require 40+ amps. We're on 30 amp plugs so I'm guessing that won't work.

I have no answers for you, but when you say "we're on 30amp plugs" I'm guessing you mean AC shorepower? Isn't the lectrasan 12V DC?

[WanderIVth]

Originally Posted by Kelkara

I have no answers for you, but when you say "we're on 30amp plugs" I'm guessing you mean AC shorepower? Isn't the lectrasan 12V DC?

Yes, on AC shorepower we're on 30 amp, but I don't understand how any of that works, honestly. I just know the lectrasan said it pulls 50 amps at nominal voltage for the 12V version. That's all jibberish to me.

[Kelkara]

Originally Posted by WanderIVth

Yes, on AC shorepower we're on 30 amp, but I don't understand how any of that works, honestly. I just know the lectrasan said it pulls 50 amps at nominal voltage for the 12V version. That's all jibberish to me.

OK ... well, you've got some learning to do ... even if you contract out all your electrical work to professionals, it will still be worth at least learning the difference between 120V AC shorepower and 12V DC battery power.


I don't know any details about the lectrasan, but they were designed for boats your size, so if you want one ... it can be made to work ... talk to your electrician, it sounds like you won't be installing it yourself.

[WanderIVth]

Originally Posted by Kelkara

OK ... well, you've got some learning to do.

Agreed. Which is kinda why I'm asking. When I pull into marinas they're all shocked that I'm 30A and not 50A. So when I read that the amps pulled by something is 50, even knowing the inverse relationship between amps and volts where wattage is concerned, it seems reasonable to ask about the amp usage with the system and compatibility with the setup I have.

[Kelkara]

Lots of good info on basic electrical in other threads, I don't want to derail this thread too much. Someone has a list of good links I'm sure they'll post.

But to keep it simple to get power you multiply volts and amps ... something that uses 50A at 12V has the same power as something that uses 5A at 120V.

So when you're running on shorepower (120V) a device that uses a lot of (12V) DC current from the battery, will only use 1/10 of the AC shorepower current supplying your battery charger ... but it works both ways, when you are running on batteries (12V), a device that doesn't seem to use much AC current will use 10 times as much DC current supplying your inverter from the battery, so can drain the battery quickly.

Batteries, if properly wired, can deliver a very large current - but only for a short time before they need recharging ... on shorepower you are limited to 30A, but it will last for ever, as long as you keep paying the bill.

Hope this helps a little bit.

[WanderIVth]

Originally Posted by Kelkara

Hope this helps a little bit.

It does. Thank you.

[peghall]

It appears that you really need a "marine sanitation systems 101" lesson. (none of us were born knowing this stuff)..and I'll be glad to help you sort out what's available, what will best suit your needs/wants and how it all works. I've found that talking instead of typing makes that a lot easier to do 'cuz the answers to one question always result in followup questions.

So if you'd like my help, shoot me an email (just choose the email option instead of PM when you click on my name) and I'll reply with my phone number. We're still in virus stay-at-home mode here and I've run out projects that needed doing (and some that didn't), so I can be available just about any time you are.

Btw...the Ahead system is a Type II treatment device for boats 66'+...way more complex than you'd need.

--Peggie

[WanderIVth]

I don't have an "email" option when I click your name.

[peghall]

You may not have sent enough posts yet to be a "trusted poster." But that's ok...I just sent you an email...unless I forgot to hit send...<sigh>

--Peggie

[WanderIVth]

Originally Posted by peghall

You may not have sent enough posts yet to be a "trusted poster."

--Peggie

Email sent. Thank you!

[mvweebles]

First, pick up Peggie's book from Amazon. Spend some time reading it before you give her a call. She's incredibly generous with her time, but you will absorb more if you spend a couple hours reading her book and thinking about your installation.

I went through a similar mental calculus equation last year. Had I placed similar emphasis on house-like operation as the OP, I would have gone with Raritan Elegance heads. For holding, there are a couple options, Electra Scan (sp?) being one. For odor remediation, straight PVC pipe where possible, and/or Raritan hose where flex is required. I forget the model of hose, but it's apparently very odor impermeable did a sustained period.

Peggie will probably recommend holding tank placement to keep the run between heads as short and direct as possible. Listen to her.

Good luck

Peter

[peghall]

We spent close to an hour on the phone this morning and I think everything is lot less confusing to him now. And he will order my book...Thanks for recommending it! I'll let him tell y'all what he decides to buy.


--Peggie