Adler Barbour Refrigeration - Cycle Time

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Frigoboat Info

Good to hear you solved the power problem, Skip.
What you are attempting is not a standard spillover installation. If you have a single box, and a horizontal bin evaporator with a lid mounted high in the box, then that is all you need. Inside the evaporator will be the freezer and the rest of the box will be a refrigerator. Installing a spillover fan in the door of the evaporator is both unnecessary and self-defeating, as it will allow cold air to escape from the evaporator, through the blades of the fan, even when it is not turning I suggest you de-power this device and put some masking tape over the fan opening to stop the cold air escaping. The thermostat probe should be mounted in the box, at about mid-height, and on a wall not under the evaporator, then set to 38-40F as a fridge thermostat.
I think you'll find that if you make the above adjustments, you will have much better results. Using a Merlin compressor speed controller on this type of installation not only results in less power consumption, but ensures super-cold temperatures in the freezer.

Thanks FI. My initial trials I did just hang the temp sensor in the main box set at 40F and it seemed to be working fine. However did not measure temps inside the bin to verify good freezing there and just went forward with the spillover plan assuming it would be necessary. Will go back to original setup and see how it goes.

I do have the Merlin controller and it works great. Would have to look at my notes but if I recall, I'm running at min speeds with a draw around 3 amps. Based rough measure of 44-48 amphours used in a day I guess I'm running just a little over 50% duty cycle. Ambient temps have been 80-95 high daytime. Haven't measured the final cu ft in the box since I modified my original design somewhat but estimating 9-10 cu ft.

One suggestion. The door attached with bungee cords is probably good for vertical installations but not so good for a horizontal. The instructions I received for installation of the bungee weren't very clear so maybe I've got it wrong, but I can see heeled over the food in the freezer would easily push the door open and come flying out. Something with a hinge and a latch would be a good upgrade.

So far I'm thrilled with the unit. Meeting my expectations for power use. The connections and installation was trouble free. Hope to be that way for years to come.

[Frigoboat Info]

So if the Merlin is running at the lowest speed and the box is getting too cold, I'd say you were in a pretty good place right now! Now you just need to get the control issue sorted.
Thank you for your comments on the lid attachment. It is definitely not desireable to install hinges or anything else to the evaporator, and that is why the bungee is used. Hinges tend to sieze in the damp environment of a refrigerator, and any hole drilled in the evaporator is a potential leak down the road. The bungee has proven to be very successful, but you may have to adjust or adapt something if you find the freezer contents wanting to liberate themselves when the boat is heeled. Just don't even think of drilling any holes in the evaporator.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Frigoboat Info

So if the Merlin is running at the lowest speed and the box is getting too cold, I'd say you were in a pretty good place right now!

Yes indeed. Happiness is a cold frig.

Originally Posted by Frigoboat Info

Now you just need to get the control issue sorted.

Should be a simple fix. Maybe a little tinkering with settings, temp probe location and such. Will let you know how it goes.

Now I have a leftover spillover. Anyone in the market for a barely used one? Maybe mount it down in the box somewhere to keep the air stirred up and cold from settling in the bottom?

Originally Posted by Frigoboat Info

Just don't even think of drilling any holes in the evaporator.

Well, now that you bring up that subject. When I got ready to mount the evaporator with 4 supplied standoffs and screws I found two empty holes on the top/front edge of the evaporator but none on the top rear except the two with rivets holding the rear cover on the bin.

I called the vendor who was surprised to hear there were no mounting holes and did suggest that it would be safe to drill a couple of mounting holes in the flat areas on the evaporator, avoiding the obvious channels for the refrigerant. I elected to (carefully) grind off the two rivets holding the the cover and used those existing holes for the mount.

So I guess this brings up two questions. First, was my bin missing mounting holes or is removing the rivets the way to mount it? The instructions were totally silent on this issue and had no diagrams or photos showing where the mounts should be used.

Second, if one carefully avoids the obvious channels in the evaporator is it guaranteed total death and destruction of the unit to drill a hole through the Al? Even if an inch or more from the channels? Does refrigerant penetrate the layers of Al outside the channels?

[foggysail]

GEEZ, I remember the Adler-Barbour I installed in my old Hunter 30. First though, I sprayed foam completely around the recessed old "ice box" on the counter. I also took the top which was nothing more than a piece of 3/4" plywood with covered with the same formica as the counter top and insulated it. I glued 2" of ridged foam to the bottom, covered that with 1/8" of wood I glued together and fiberglassed the entire bottom of the lid.

Even with all the insulation, the refrigerated box demanded an on time of about 4 minutes and an off time about 6 minutes. And of course the freezer bin seemed to always need defrosting.

As bad as the AB was, it was a God send from carrying ice! Today we enjoy an 8.3cuft self defrosting refrigerator in our dinette area. Further I just installed a self defrosted 4cuft MicroFridge (minus the microwave) in our aft deck area. That machine is fantastic and both fridges are QUITE! FOUR EACH 145 WATT SOLAR PANELS MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE when it comes to power consumption. I am a power pig!

[tamicatana]

FWIW, I think it was The Boat Galley where I saw a suggestion to isolate the freezer (somewhat) by putting a bit of styrofoam between it and the larger compartment, let me see if I find it... some articles, there are others:

How to Improve Refrigerator Efficiency
How to Store Food on a Boat, Part 5: Refrigerator Organization

[Frigoboat Info]

Originally Posted by skipmac

Yes indeed. Happiness is a cold frig.


Well, now that you bring up that subject. When I got ready to mount the evaporator with 4 supplied standoffs and screws I found two empty holes on the top/front edge of the evaporator but none on the top rear except the two with rivets holding the rear cover on the bin.

I called the vendor who was surprised to hear there were no mounting holes and did suggest that it would be safe to drill a couple of mounting holes in the flat areas on the evaporator, avoiding the obvious channels for the refrigerant. I elected to (carefully) grind off the two rivets holding the the cover and used those existing holes for the mount. This is from section 6:5 of the Frigoboat Installation and Instruction Manual: Do not attempt to cut, trim, or drill holes in any evaporator for any purpose. Holes may be drilled in the base of B-type evaporators, as this is a separate piece of aluminum.

So I guess this brings up two questions. First, was my bin missing mounting holes or is removing the rivets the way to mount it? The instructions were totally silent on this issue and had no diagrams or photos showing where the mounts should be used. See above. We now supply the Bin evaporators with these mounting holes pre-drilled.

Second, if one carefully avoids the obvious channels in the evaporator is it guaranteed total death and destruction of the unit to drill a hole through the Al? No, but pretty close! Even if an inch or more from the channels? That is a really tough baked enamel coating, and one slip of a drill bit ....... Been there, done that! Does refrigerant penetrate the layers of Al outside the channels?

Any hole or cut that is not totally sealed is a candidate for corrosion to set in and creep inwards between the two sheets of aluminum. This can take upwards of a couple of years to start leaking refrigerant.

[Frigoboat Info]

Just a thought, Skipmac, but I'm assuming that you have the lid on the evaporator set up so that it lowers down to open, and not upwards.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Frigoboat Info

Just a thought, Skipmac, but I'm assuming that you have the lid on the evaporator set up so that it lowers down to open, and not upwards.

Correct. I did think about both options for about a nano-second but opening up failed because: less secure, have to hold the lid up to get something, blocked visibility into the bin.

If I may go back to the mounting for a minute. Since the bin I have had no mounting holes in the rear then the proper way (only way?) to mount it was to remove the rivets?

Since you mention the potential for corrosion and failure now I'm a bit worried. When I ground off the heads of the rivets I think I scraped the enamel finish slightly on the top of the bin. Not inside the hole but on the surface. So have I created a future failure point? Should I drop the evaporator and try to paint or seal over that scratch? I do have some Al epoxy primer I could paint on.

[Frigoboat Info]

The instructions do say: "Holes may be drilled in the base of B-type evaporators, as this is a separate piece of aluminum." Most installations are horizontal, where the lower holes are not so important, but all newer Bin evaporators now have holes pre-drilled in the base to expedite installation. I'm sure you're OK with your holes as they are, but it won't hurt to add a dob of epoxy next time you have some mixed up.

Glad to hear your door installation is correct. Adler Barbour have/had their door swinging upwards, which made it harder to access the contents, and easier for them to fall out.

[Frigoboat Info]

Oops. I hit "Send before checking content. Most Bin evaporators are installed VERTICAL, not horizontal as I had stated.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Frigoboat Info

The instructions do say: "Holes may be drilled in the base of B-type evaporators, as this is a separate piece of aluminum." Most installations are horizontal, where the lower holes are not so important, but all newer Bin evaporators now have holes pre-drilled in the base to expedite installation. I'm sure you're OK with your holes as they are, but it won't hurt to add a dob of epoxy next time you have some mixed up.

Glad to hear your door installation is correct. Adler Barbour have/had their door swinging upwards, which made it harder to access the contents, and easier for them to fall out.

Seems like I do most things in an unusual way, hence mounting my evaporator horizontally (yes caught the correction).

I did see the OK to drill in the base but for my horizontal mounting, drilling a hole in the base would have required an L bracket to screw vertically into the ceiling of my box so liked the rivet hole better.

[sailorboy1]

[QUOTE=Frigoboat Info;1296328.
It sounds like you need to investigate the resistor in the thermostat, and if it is not set to run the compressor at full speed, then it should be removed or by-passed and a speed controller of some sort installed.

The Frigoboat Merlin has a speed indicator LED.[/QUOTE]

How do I investigate this???? If I have to tear the thing out I might as well replace it with some type of digital control.

Does the Merlin replace the old thermostat? Point me in the direction of what parts I need and I will read up about them on your website.

[Frigoboat Info]

Don. If you specified that you were to be installing a freezer or spillover system when you or your installer ordered your system, you would have been supplied with a dedicated freezer thermostat, other wise you would have been provided with a refrigerator version. I don't know what distinguishes the two types visually (it used to be a blue dot on the knob), but maybe some A/B person can chime in with that information.
If you unscrew the thermostat housing and look into the back side you will see the resistor in line in one of the wires. If you can let us know what ohm value that is, we will be able to ascertain what speed the compressor is set to run at.
The Merlin does not replace the thermostat. It is an automatic compressor speed controller and simply mounts on to the Danfoss controller that is attached to the compressor. Details can be seen here: Speed Controllers for Danfoss BD 35/50 Compressors

[Richard Kollmann]

Don L, On Adler Barbour units sold as CU100 or CU200 thermostat is sold with evaporator. Speed resistor is located in one of the wires about one inch from thermostat and it is so small it will be a small lump in heat shrink wire cover. Its value and type are identified in part number on plastic cover label R for refrigerator F for freezer and last three numbers are speed resistor ohms 1500 will be for max speed of 3500 rpm.