What training do you need to cruise?

[Brian Cope]

I have been sailing for about a year and a half in the Chesapeake Bay on a 25' McGregor I purchased. My plan is to upgrade to a 35' to 45' boat to live aboard or semi live aboard (in addition to a camper on a seasonal site) in a few years. I have taken a Boat US boating safety course. However, I learned to sail from reading, watching videos, and trial and error. I am pretty comfortable sailing, handling the boat, and basic navigation. I am just curious what training I would need. I don't want to pay for a basic course if I already have those skills. Is there a good place to look at the trainings available and compare what is available with what skills you need? Also, is there a basic that will be required to get insurance, use marinas, or enter other countries/areas?


Brian

[leecea]

I think you have two main issues 1) getting insurance, 2) feeling confident with the boat

For the second one, I'd at least suggest getting experience crewing on larger boats. I'd also suggest the ASA docking class (or some way to get practice with docking) as a larger boat with inboard engine will be different from the boat you have (which I think has an outboard).

Insurance is bit more of an unknown. Especially if you go from a 25 to a 45, that's a big jump. I don't know how you could get reliable information on what an insurance company wants.

You'll get lots of different opinions on the formal training. We did do the ASA classes and they helped us charter, which then helped us when we bought a boat. But others have learnt without classes.

[JebLostInSpace]

I'm of the opinion that formal training adds little real value for a cruiser. There's plenty of useful stuff in, say, ASA 101-104. But my opinion is that the useful stuff you learn in those classes is easily picked up along the way as you start cruising. These days, you can learn anything on YouTube.

Some bits, like knowing the rules of the road, are worth doing before you set out. But as you've already sailed a smaller boat on Chesapeake Bay, I imagine you already know those items.

Some bits, like learning to dock in a variety of conditions take time and practice. It might be nice to get some reps in docking somebody else's boat on somebody else's insurance, but it's not required. Be selective and only dock/undock in benign conditions while you're new. Then as you build confidence you can expand your capabilities. Same goes for sailing in different weather conditions, performing more of your own maintenance and repair, anchoring, etc. These sorts of skills are the ones that take too long to learn for an ASA or similar course to be of much help.

As leecea points out, you may have constraints finding an insurance carrier if you have no formal training. If that's the case, then you'll just have to do whatever the insurance company demands. I took ASA 101, 102, 104 as a college student in order to meet Sunsail's requirements for captaining a bareboat charter. So when I got my own boat and went shopping for insurance I already had those certifications. I can't really say whether the insurance problem would have been much more difficult without them. The fact that you have a (I assume) insured McGregor with (I hope) no claims against it might make more difference tot he insurers than any certification.

[Jammer]

I moved from a 26' to a 38' boat and have had no problems getting insurance. I've never taken an ASA class but have been in (mostly smaller) boats all my life, and spent a number of years traveling in an RV (but not continuously), which has a good deal of crossover from a systems and lifestyle standpoint.



People learn in different ways. I don't do well with classes, but some people find them really helpful.


I think the answer to the OP's question varies widely depending on the individual's background, personality, and the non-sailing skills.

[boatman61]

Certification only becomes important once you sail outside your own countries waters and then it should be of an internationally recognised standard.
Some countries require certification for their own citizens so they require a minimum standard for folks entering their waters.. Portugal and Spain for example.

[Wyo George]

Interesting question, but good to see.

I also sail a M25 and have no formal training. It’s not that I’m opposed to it. I’m a big fan of training seeing as how a large chunk of my income derives from teaching motorcycle classes, but I live on a mountain in Wyoming and there’s no schools anywhere close so I’m self taught.

I’ll mostly live a life of lake sailing, but I’d enjoy a few winter trips for things like visiting the Dry Tortugas, Abaco Islands, etc. and had wondered myself if I need to spend the time and money to fly somewhere and take classes.

[kavw]

First aid course, fibreglass repair, small engine repair, fishing knowledge, shore based navigation -non gps-, sewing…lots of skills where a few short courses can be very beneficial. As for the rest, just lots of sailing and short trips, keep pushing the envelope a little bit. Have fun.

[stormalong]

The best training would be crewing with an experienced captain. Sailing from point a to point b is more instructive than day sailing. Multi day trips will teach you about watch keeping, navigation and sail handling. Just a few days offshore will show you more of the real skills you need. Start with a short delivery and progress to longer trips. US to Caribbean and ocean crossings are completely different than day sailing or club racing.

I have not taken any ASA classes. IIRC, they are based on preparing you for chartering which does not allow overnight sailing.

[sailorboy1]

If it going to happen, it gong to happen out there! - Captn Ron

I was reminded of that yesterday when the head sail attachment strap pulled apart and the sail started dropping down in 20+ knot wind. No training helps you with that type of fairly common type of thing. Once you have the sailing and anchoring basis down just go cruising and slowly increase your comfort level for conditions as you go. Reading does help as you at least have a clue as to what to do when things go wrong.

The next training is mechanical and electrical maintenance as cruising is doing boat work in exotic and new places.

[Rackman]

I would say, just buy the boat and sail it. Try to crew on someone else's boat in between sailing your own boat. Courses are good, but nothing is better then just doing it. As far as insurance, I went online to Progressive and got insurance instantly.

[Gard]

I'm going to get into trouble for saying what I am about to say.

You need absolutely zero formal training! Any person could take a large sailboat with zero experience and learn as they go around the world (slowly) - and quite successfully so.

I presuppose of course that one takes ample safety measures, i.e. in terms of calm and predictable waters, good forecasts, ample space in all directions around the boat (as well as under and over) - and being careful. I also presuppose a keen interest in researching what skills and competences one needs, and setting targets and to practice rigurously
. A good place to start is to look at the curriculum for various formal training courses. Get books, search the web, take free online tests, download and try apps, buy maps and protractors, watch YouTube, reed forums, etc, etc.

Also, go out of your way to make friends that has more experience than yourself. Strive to get to go sailing with them. Ask to help them with maintenance of their boat. Ask for help. Be curious - ask other sailors all sorts of stupid questions. Go on as many boat's that you can, maybe even rent a few. Diversity is good!

As you gain experience you can take on greater challenges and risks. You can rely on your experience and knowledge and not simply luck.

I disagree that formal training has little value. But theoretical knowledge won't get you very far - no matter how much you've got. It is when you take that theoretical knowledge and practice it IRL that knowledge becomes actual competence.

Sailing across the Atlantic may not teach you as much as you could have achieved in a fraction of the time. How many times do you tack, hoist sales or dock? Make a point to go out in the time available to you to actively go about practice skills you will benefit most to improve on, not just to sail from A to B. In a weekend you can practice far more dockings and different docking scenarios than you can in a whole season of just regular cruising. That is how a noob that truly goes for it can gain more competence in a single season than some aquire in a lifetime.

Don't take everything I say literally, and take any of it with a pinch of salt. You will benefit from any formal training and sources of knowledge. I to will help you to figure out what you need to practice, and to understand what you are experiencing. Practical experience can replace formal training, but not the other way around. The dynamic is in the combination.

[Sailer_Med]

I'm going to be outlier here..I think training is very useful. I'm not talking about in the classroom training! I mean on the water courses in a vein similar to the RYA practical coursework. The reason I recommend practical coursework is that it gives you the chance to not only learn from your own mistakes but to learn from other's mistakes. You'll learn more faster.

Of course sail, you'll learn some things just doing it if you are open. You'll also learn from youtube, but the problem with youtube is there is a fair amount of advise that is completely wrong.... Not saying class instructors aren't wrong, but at least you can have a discussion.

I don't think you can make enough mistakes on your own to learn at the same pace as a practical class gives. ��

[JebLostInSpace]

Originally Posted by Sailer_Med

I don't think you can make enough mistakes on your own to learn at the same pace as a practical class gives. ��

I dunno, I can make mistakes at a pretty astonishing rate.

[wholybee]

Very little, and depending on where you are possibly no formal training is required by rules or law. I believe however, that at least some level of training is very important.

Sure, you can learn as you go, and many do. But learning as you go only teaches you how to sail, navigate, and day to day "practical" stuff. It doesn't teach Colregs, required safety equipment, how to use that equipment, how to recover a MOB, etc.

All of that can be covered in a short amount of time without very much formal training, but I believe you do need at least that much formal training to be safe to yourself and others you encounter.

[Adelie]

Welcome.

I would suggest updating your profile with your general location and your boat make & model or “Looking” in the "Boat" category. This info shows up under your UserName in every post in the web view. Many questions are boat and/or location dependent and having these tidbits under your UserName saves answering those questions repeatedly. If you need help setting up your profile then click on this link: https://www.cruisersforum.com/forums...ml#post3308797

I would happily help more if the link above is not enough.