RYA Yachtmaster ocean equivalents

[jonesie]

I'm looking into doing my RYA Yachtmaster Ocean, or the equivalent.
Does anyone know the equivalent standard in ASA or CYA?

[LTDsailing]

There really isn't an equivalent in the ASA / CYA systems. The biggest thing that sets the RYA Yachtmaster Oceans apart is that it is a professional certification. By just adding on the required STCW courses, you have a license that will allow you to run boats as a paid captain anywhere in the world (with a few minor exceptions).

If you are just looking for the equivalent knowledge and have no interest in using your license professionally, you could do the ASA Coastal Navigation (105) & ASA Advanced Coastal Cruising (106) which roughly equates to Yachtmaster Coastal certification. You could add on ASA Celestial Navigation (107) & ASA Passage Making (108) which would roughly equate to Yachtmaster Offshore. Add in an ocean crossing where you do celestial navigation the entire way and you are close to Yachtmaster Oceans.

We offer Advanced Cruise and Learn courses that cover ASA 105 & 106 as well as Advanced Catamaran Cruise and Learn courses where we add in Cruising Catamaran (ASA 114). There are a few schools offering ASA 107 / 108 - we hope to be offering this in the near future. But none that I know of that are offering their students the chance to do an ocean crossing as part of the course.

Let me know if you have any questions I can help with regarding the ASA version of the training.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by LTDsailing

(...)

By just adding on the required STCW courses, you have a license that will allow you to run boats as a paid captain anywhere in the world (with a few minor exceptions).

(...)

Yes.

The exceptions being where the RYA refused to recognize equivalent (Italian, Spanish, German, etc.) certificates which in turn resulted in many countries refusing to accept RYA as commercially qualifying on boats flagged in these countries.

RYA Ocean is still great if you want to work on a UK, Aus, NZ, etc. boat.

b.

[jackdale]

Are you looking for a a commercial ticket or a recreational certification?

[jonesie]

probably recreational, but I'm also thinking of commercial, depending on what I can find and what the cost is

[Flcapt]

There is a nice table of approximate Equivalents here
https://info.sailingvirgins.com/blog...ou-need-to-get
It is hard to compare A USCG License as it is Merchant Marine and would more accurately aligning with the British MCA CoC Merchant Certificate.

[Time2Go]

Originally Posted by jonesie

I'm looking into doing my RYA Yachtmaster Ocean, or the equivalent.
Does anyone know the equivalent standard in ASA or CYA?

For what’s it’s worth
I crew on sailing boats all over the world for owners from
many different countries.
RYA Yachtmaster Ocean is the Gold Standard
just blows away ASA. ( can’t comment on CYA)
Very high standards
not that easy to qualify for. Good luck
I stopped at Coastal Skipper/Tidal and that opened up
lots of crew opportunities.
I have no plans on going commercial but if i did
and wanted to operate in the US,
Coast Guard Captains License would be the ticket
Cheers
Neil

[Snore]

Originally Posted by jonesie

I'm looking into doing my RYA Yachtmaster Ocean, or the equivalent.
Does anyone know the equivalent standard in ASA or CYA?

ASA training is garbage to marginal. I have done deliveries for people who did ASA 101/103/105 in a week and then 114. Most had no real idea how to trim a sail, or reef. Fav quote, "It wasn't windy enough for us to reef, so we just sailed around." Really?!?!?!? So the quality of the ASA training really depends on the instructor and size of the class.

One of the reasons I stopped teaching in schools is the pressure to grind out the classes. When I did a 2-3 person class the students learned A LOT. When the school packed the boat, not so much. Hence my departure from teaching.

I hold a 100 Ton USCG License and am the first to say 60-75% of the people with a license have marginal open ocean skills.

In November I did a transatlantic with a crew of two guys who both held USCG 100 Ton Near Coastal Licenses and were ASA instructors. Their lack of knowledge scared me! When I am explaining how to shape a jib to an ASA INSTRUCTOR who as a license- something is wrong.

My suggestion is to get the ASA or CYA or RYA, it impresses insurance companies. Then go out with a competent delivery captain or hire him/her onto your boat to polish your skills.

[Flcapt]

I agree that the Certificate does not guarantee competency. What the students learn is greatly affected by the particular school/instructor combination. Many of the ASA schools won't teach with more than 3 students on a boat and will not do the one week concurrent multi cert package. It actually flies in the face of the ASA guidelines as days underway are supposed to be accumulated before attempting the next level. It is an imperfect system.

It is also driven by the Student. If a student thinks they can go from novice to competent independent sailor in a seven day course then they are looking for an easy out in the first place. My open water NAUI PADI class took eight weeks and had about 30 hours in a class room and about 40 hours in the water. That same certificate is offered in 2 1/2 days by some dive shops. The ASA School I have worked with has no problem not giving out a certificate at the end of a class. They start the conversation with "completion of the course is not a guarantee of graduation". They do work with the student until the skills have been earned. Even if that takes many weeks.

The ASA curriculum when taken to heart and applied and practiced is a good basis for the life time of learning that should follow.

As a 500GT USCG Master with an All Oceans Endorsement, I have also felt the frustration of under performing "professionals". I don't know the answer. Why are some boat builders rubbish and successful while others are brilliant and barely solvent? Why are so many licensed electricians poor at their jobs while others are so good at theirs? I will say that competent boat owners recognize the pretenders almost immediately and don't employ them. But then, not all boat owners are competent them selves.

I think if some one is truly looking for education (which is the Mission of the ASA) then they should interview a few schools and get a sense of how they approach teaching. And they should also know that the out come will also depend on their own input and continued desire to learn.

If their desire is to "hang paper" to please their insurance company or a charter company then they should seek the appropriate certification to check the box. If they are a serious boater they will also learn a lot while taking the class.

[ChrisJHC]

Originally Posted by Snore

One of the reasons I stopped teaching in schools is the pressure to grind out the classes. When I did a 2-3 person class the students learned A LOT. When the school packed the boat, not so much. Hence my departure from teaching.

I’m pretty sure the RYA sets a limit of 5 students per course.

Often made up of a combination of levels (eg Comp Crew, Day Skipper and Coastal Skipper).

Does the ASA not do the same?

[Snore]

Originally Posted by ChrisJHC

I’m pretty sure the RYA sets a limit of 5 students per course.

Often made up of a combination of levels (eg Comp Crew, Day Skipper and Coastal Skipper).

Does the ASA not do the same?

Chis,

Yes they cap the class. But an ASA 101 consists of people with no formal training. I don't want to rant- but try teaching 5 newbies in 15 hours of contact time +1 hour for test. Getting them to pass can be a feat!

[Uricanejack]

As far as I know there is no direct commercial equivalent US or Canadian certificate to the RYA Yachtmaster of any variety.

For recreational certification the CYA or Sail Canada advanced level course is the highest coastal and there is an offshore level as well which includes some basic Astro.

The ASA was developed in a similar format.

These course have no commercial use except for sailing instructor. I was a CYA instructor but only for the basic level.
Which is roughly equivalent to a Day Skipper.
I’m Canadian so not very familiar with American certification.

The lowest level of STCW certification available in Canada is a full commercial certificate as a watch keeping officer.
For which command endorsements can be obtained.
There are Canadian Domestic certificate’s for small vessels. Which are commercial licences with restrictions on both area of operation and size of vessel. Right up to unlimited size for the inland waters of the Great Lakes.

There are no unlimited area licence bellow the MCA equivalent of Class 4, Class 3, Class 2 or Class 1.

I’m not sure but I believe the US system is similar.

There is no Canadian or US equivalent to a RYA Ocean Yachtmaster.

Both Canadian and US commercial certification require much more documentation of Seatime.
Except for the very lowest levels

If you are Canadian. At this time RYA certification are not recognized for use on a Canadian Vessel.
However
Seatime accrued working on a vessel registered as a yacht in the UK, Dependant territory or Funny little Islands with an RYA certificate will probably be approved by Transport Canada provided the documentation meets required TC standard.
Ie must be days not miles.

I doubt if a RYA logbook filled out by the holder will suffice.
The information in it can be transferred to a Canadian Seatime Form. And a Seatime letter.
Which if endorsed by the owner and an owners representative. May be accepted.
Even a Discharge Book requires separate documentation of watch keeping time.

[Mel Quine]

Living in New England and being 62 years old and having gotten started with sailing just recently, I fear the clock is ticking on my ability to become a truly competent sailor. While I understand there is no substitute for hands-on experience, I do want to cram in some solid theory instruction and on water hours. Duxbury Bay Maritime School where I took my first classes, does not offer any certification. Also, working on a New England schedule leaves many months of the year where I am not gaining experience. Am investigating picking up some classes in the Mediterranean before the boats get into the water here in Massachusetts this year. Don't feel I have the luxury of time to make mistakes in terms of where I go to learn. If I want to be a skipper, are you saying I should not take ASA classes? They have many schools in the Med. I speak some French, but am not fluent, so English language instruction is essential. Is there a good forum for rating instructors/schools, or another method you might recommend? I have been in conversation with the Athens Sailing Academy.

Appreciate any guidance/input you can offer.

Warm Regards,
Mel

[sailingharry]

ASA is crap. But with that as starter, it does serve several useful purposes.

It does provide a solid formal foundation. If you approach it as steps on a road, and pace out the instruction, you could learn things you might never learn on your own. Just don't think that an ASA 104 makes you a Joshua Slocum!

The paper itself is worth an awful lot to people who have no idea how useless it is. Insurance companies love it. Charter companies, especially in the Mediterranean from what I understand, see it as a license to operate. I have a friend who has literally sailed around the world on his own boat, but cannot charter in the Mediterranean as he does not hold the piece of paper.

A serious problem with the ASA construct is the lack of a reasonable path for highly skilled sailors to get recognized. I should think that there should be a way to pay for one day of on the water validation. A competent instructor should be able to recognize competence in a skilled student and award certification in less than 6 hours of contact time.

Beyond the paper that ASA courses provide, there are also a multitude of better but less recognized programs. My wife has taken several courses from J-World, and they truly teach sailing.

But you asked about becoming a skipper. Beyond the ridiculous state mandated safe boater course, there is no requirement or standard at all to take out a boat. Learn a bit, get a friend to go out with you once or twice, and then start getting hours on the water. Stay local, watch the weather, be conservative. But there is no bar you have to cross before you can start doing those things.

[leecea]

There are RYA sailing schools in Gibraltar that will be in English. I have no experience with them so can't offer any recommendations.