Please help a sailor make the switch to power.

[Salty Cracker]

Originally Posted by Ken Z

Sounds like you need a trawler. Diesel, I prefer twins, but single is fine. There are some out there that are refit, plus but cheap, depends on how hard you want to work. They ALL need work.

I think you're right. I still have a lot of studying to do but that seems to check a lot of boxes.

Originally Posted by ranger42c

You might rummage around over on trawlerforum.com, a sister site. More power guys -- of various persuasions -- there.

-Chris

Ah yeah, thanks.


I'd like to pass on a question my son asked me and get some feedback please. Now obviously the HP's and tankage are bigger than a sailboat but do the standard production motor yachts/trawlers have the range for a run to the leeward islands out of Bimini? Now I'm not asking COULD it be done But rather is this something that is commonly and regularly done? And I'm talking only about range. Not ocean-worthyness.

Originally Posted by CassidyNZ

We were thinking a while ago now..

Point well received. So far, we are in the "what would it be like" phase of discussion. So I'm gonna ask some questions, do some studying and perhaps charter one next year.
My next thing to figure out is ongoing maintenance costs compared to a similar age/condition and LOA S/V.

[sailcrazy]

Following. At almost 76, and having sailed from The Philippines, to Phuket, to Turkey, to Genoa, to the USVI...we're approaching that point in life.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Salty Cracker

I'd like to pass on a question my son asked me and get some feedback please. Now obviously the HP's and tankage are bigger than a sailboat but do the standard production motor yachts/trawlers have the range for a run to the leeward islands out of Bimini? Now I'm not asking COULD it be done But rather is this something that is commonly and regularly done? And I'm talking only about range. Not ocean-worthyness.

Most boats that are capable of handling that kind of run would have the range to do it. Worst case you do a little island hopping for fuel. On my own boat, I figure that with good reserves, my planning range is ~150 nautical miles on plane, ~350 nautical miles at low speed. If I had modern diesels and the same tankage, I'd be looking at more like ~275nm and ~850nm. As long as you're not trying to go fast, finding boats with 500+ nautical miles of range isn't hard. And there are plenty that will go 1000+ before it's time to stop for fuel.



Generally, as powerboats go up in seaworthiness, they tend to also gain fuel range as one is often not very useful without the other.

[ferrailleur]

Thanks ArmyDaveNY for the music reference..... I love the Blues and I love sailing!

Originally Posted by ArmyDaveNY

I have known several sailors who went from sail boats to trawlers, and were very happy with the change. They told me that the cruising was similar since the speeds were similar, and the fuel consumption was also close. Because of this their planning process was not much different.

Good luck with what ever you go with!

The bold and italicized phrase reminds me of a Howlin' Wolf song!

[darylat8750]

I made the switch about 10 years ago. I have a Ocean Alexander 42'6" on deck Ocean 44. Twin 120HP Ford/Lehman diesels. 3 gallons an hour at 7.5 kts with 550 gallons of fuel gives 1000+ range with very comfortable reserves. 250 gallons of water + water maker. Furuno navigation package with radar, autopilot, AIS and dual coms.

Walk around Queen berth aft. Head with separate tub/shower. V berth forward with wet head. Nice galley with an apartment size refrigerator. Washer/ dryer and pantry where the lower dinette used to be. Way more living space than any sailboat I could afford.

I've crossed between Fl. and Isla Mujeres several times. (Roughly 460 nautical miles) Any power boat at displacement speed will have some angle and size of waves that will cause an uncomfortable motion. We can usually improve the ride considerably with reasonably small course changes. The planing type hulls that I have made that crossing on have exhibited a noticeably sharper and less comfortable motion than our boat. The real limiting factor on my boat is the amount of glass. I would not go on any crossing that was so long that I couldn't have confidence in the weather.

The aft deck is large and makes a great "back porch". The biggest expense I've had is the canvas work I've had done. I did paint it myself and that was a huge project. I'll try to attach a picture.

Boats similar to mine could be bought for less than the ops' budget. Remember that you will not have the sail and rigging expenses that come with a sailboat.

[darylat8750]

Here is a picture.

[Salty Cracker]

Originally Posted by Squanderbucks

...single diesel, twin cabin and mostly a displacement type hull.

That and two toilets would about suit us fine. Like I said, it'll be three of us and soon just my wife and I.

[Salty Cracker]

Originally Posted by darylat8750

Here is a picture.Attachment 232783

She looks real pretty out there. I just poked through a few online. 2-3 people could be very comfortable on something like that.

Originally Posted by darylat8750

I would not go on any crossing that was so long that I couldn't have confidence in the weather.

Certainly that's a personal calculation anyone would have to do for themselves but would you mind sharing what your metric is? Either here of in a PM?

[MikeHoncho]

Do you want us to use the Ol’ Yeller technique where we scream at you to leave and we cry as you walk away?

[mvweebles]

Originally Posted by garychurch

Full time live aboard for a family of four on $150,000 for a power boat?

That’s going to be a tough challenge given a good size power boat large enough for four that doesn’t need major work would be in the neighborhood of $350,000 to $500,000.

Good luck.

Finding a trawler for under $150k? Easy. On this site about a year ago was a single diesel Defever 40 trawler for sale in Florida. Sellers had spent the prior 2 years cruising from California to Florida via the Panama Canal. Two solid staterooms, one in bow(v-berth) and an island queen in aft stateroom.

Asking price was $50k. There are plenty of decent 40-ish foot trawlers in the under $100k range.

For sale by owner on TrawlerForum right now.

Grand Banks 42 $150k

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...ad.php?t=55727

Kadey Krogen 42. Ocean capable. This boat has been from Alaska to Florida. $175k

https://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...ad.php?t=56070

There is also a nice 37 foot monk trawler for about $75k.

Peter

[darylat8750]

Salty Cracker,
My weather decisions are really based on our comfort. Long before safety is threatened I would be puking and my wife would refuse to get back on the boat. Obviously we are basically coastal cruisers and will never go trans Atlantic or Pacific. That said, weather forecasting is much better than it was even a few years ago. I've been a commercial pilot for more than 50 years and understand weather patterns pretty well. Eastbound out of Isla Mujeras at 7 knots even early in the spring can be done safely by watching the fronts and folowing behind the right one. You still can't get impatient. A few years ago I was all set to go and was going to buddy boat with a friend. I damaged my davits and missed the wx window my friends made. They said it was smooth as a small lake all the way. My wife and I fixed the boat and waited a month and a half before another opportunity presented. So the bottom line is I avoid weather that could be sustained high winds. I particularly avoid situations where there is likely to be a large directional change of significant wind like after a frontal passage. With the windows on the house a series of 15+ foot breaking waves would be very scary if not tragic.

[Ifitsworthdoing]

I’m also working on finding the best retirement solution - albeit with my first boat. Has to be a catamaran as my wife has spinal fractures and needs a stable platform. I’m not keen enough on sailing to go down the route of certifying as a sailing skipper, and am also wary of the issues with low bridges and overshadowing solar panels that a mast and sails create. As a retiree I am planning to cruise extensively but with plenty of time to do so, so want to keep my fuel costs as low as possible and be able to go into protected biospheres and the future green economy hence planning on a diesel electric hybrid propulsion setup. As for socialising aspects (which are obviously of huge importance to retirees and liveaboards), we feel much more connected with trawler/cruiser and sailing crowds than with the owners of gin palaces and speedboats - hence our solution will lie in converting a sailing cat to into an eco power cruiser. Kite sails will even offer sailing options in the absence of a main mast ...

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by Salty Cracker

I'd like to pass on a question my son asked me and get some feedback please. Now obviously the HP's and tankage are bigger than a sailboat but do the standard production motor yachts/trawlers have the range for a run to the leeward islands out of Bimini? Now I'm not asking COULD it be done But rather is this something that is commonly and regularly done? And I'm talking only about range. Not ocean-worthyness.

In general, many can get there from here. Usually in hops, though, from one staging point to another.

-Chris

[mvweebles]

My 1970 Willard 36 Full Displacement trawler is powered by a 75hp Perkins 4.236 and carries over 400 gals of diesel. A sistership went from San Diego to Hawaii and burned 335 gals. Many 42-foot trawler style boats with twin engines carry 500 gals and burn around 4 gph at 7.5 kts giving them a range of over 800 nms. I did the Baja Ha Ha on a friend's Willard 40 with a fairly modern Tier II John Deere 4045 TA and we burned under 250 gals diesel from Long Beach to La Paz, about 1000 nms. And despite only doing around 7-1/2 kts, we were always one of the first 10 boats to arrive at an anchorage in a fleet of 160 boats.

So yea, many boats in this category have the range. Plenty of range. Getting from California to Florida is achievable - I plan on starting this trek in the next year or so. About 4500 nms; 650 engine hours, 750 gals of diesel plus a couple of oil changes along the way. About the same cost as replacing running rigging on a 40-ft sailboat.

Peter

[Group9]

We made the switch from a sailboat to a power boat a few years ago (I've actually switched back forth before).

We sold our 1990 Catalina 42 sloop and bought a 1973 Bertram 42 motor yacht. One of the big selling points was that it had recently been re-powered with brand new Yanmar 370 HP diesels.

My wife and I were about to hit 60 and had just returned from a year long cruise, where we had found ourselves motoring more and more, when we could have sailed. And, my wife has a degenerative leg condition (HSP) that made it harder and harder for her to work the deck at all as the years went by. We decided that when we went cruising again, it was going to be on a powerboat.

Things to know:

Costs: It costs a lot more to maintain the powerboat. Those turbocharged, after cooled, diesels, take a lot more maintenance that the little Yanmar 4JHBE we had on the sailboat. For instance, to change the oil in the 4 cylinder took about 6 quarts of oil. To change the oil on the 370HPers, takes 11 quarts (and there are two of them). Plus two oil filters instead of one. Another is that each of the 370's has seven anodes that have to be changed. Our 4JHBE didn't have any anodes to change (it took me a month to believe that when we bought it).

Fuel: We burned more fuel to bring the Bertram home from Kemah, Texas where we bought it, on a four day trip, than we burned in two years sailing Florida and the Bahamas on the 42 Catalina. It's a wallet shock to go from needing $100 to fill up the tank, to needing $1000 to do it. There are lots of powerboats out there that get pretty good mileage. Ours is not one of them. But, it has a deep v hull that can take a lot of slop and waves and shrug them off.

Unlike the sailboat, every route has to be planned for refueling. Our range can only be counted on to be about 500 miles under best conditions (415 gallons tankage).

Even the generator on the Bertram (8.8 KW) takes twice the diesel the generator on the Catalina (5.5 kw) used. There are a lot of electric appliances on the boat. The Catalina had one small and one large AC. The Bertram has three large AC's on it (and a full size refrigerator. We downsized the fridge on the Bertram to cut the KWs it used and can barely keep our batteries up with solar panels we installed on good sunny days. We had half the solar on the sailboat and could go weeks without having to crank the generator and charge them.

And, that's all money that could be used for eating out, staying at marinas, flying home, renting cars, etc. when you're cruising.

Luxury wise: Once anchored, there is no comparison in comfort. The Bertram is like a floating condo with a back porch.

Engine noise: I do get tired of hearing the diesels running all the time sometimes. But at lower speeds, 5-6 knots, the noise isn't that bad. Up on plane, 12-14 knots, it's loud (and our boat will only do about 16 knots WOT).

I guess the bottom line is, some days I really miss the sailboat, and some days I'm really glad we switched.

I do realize now, that we could have had everything we wanted, and still had more room than on the 42 sailboat, with a 32 or 34 foot power boat. I wished we had at least considered a smaller power boat, possibly a trawler with a single engine, mainly thinking about how much cheaper it would be to maintain and operate.

But, I'm not switching boats again. We'll have this one until the end.