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Old 19-01-2017, 04:27   #346
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

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Originally Posted by Celestialsailor View Post
Like Captain Ron said..."If anything is going to happen...it'd going to happen out there.
"Out there" isn't very far.
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Old 18-02-2017, 18:44   #347
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

Sorry to add to a long standing thread but I thought I would add my experiences.

12 years ago I was looking at boats. It was the first time I was seriously looking to get back into sailing from the mid 80s and I didn't know Jack back then so I was really out of the loop and knew it. That is what drove me to find a forum; I think it was SailboatOwners.com, because I am of the belief that just about anything I want to know can be found on the internet if I try hard enough and use the right filter.

I had lots of odd questions like what to do if you are at sea and a hurricane develops and you are in it's path. I got all kinds of stupid answers but some actually tried and some really helped. I tried to ignore the condescending ones but they did play on my mind a lot. Now I had no intention of sailing around the world then, I had planned on doing that when I retire in the 2030s, but I did plan on doing a lot of sailing in the Gulf of Mexico...long trips.

Those negative responses were not much help. The ones who tried to help with real advice did. It led me down a path of learning proper seamanship. Between the help I got on the forums and the good advice I got from my dock neighbor (Charlie) and the books I read, I believe I've developed into a pretty decent captain. I've sailed 30,000 ocean miles and half way around the world since then and living my dream. Will start the second half of the world trip next year and I can't wait to get going.

I really appreciated the helpful advice on the forums but I usually stay off them these days because I am tired of the unhelpful nasty people on the forums too. To those of you who have helped me in the past like Stu Jackson, I thank you.

So the next time a newbie is asking 'odd' questions, put yourself in their shoes before you speak. Think of how you would like to be told 'no' before you do so. Be helpful. Explain to them why it is not a good idea. Newbies don't understand and need you to help them learn.

I look at Charlie as my mentor and I couldn't have done it without him. Maybe after I complete my second around the world trip I will settle down and mentor somebody myself. Maybe even open up a cruising school for free to help slow down these mistakes at sea.
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Old 18-02-2017, 18:48   #348
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

Good on you, mate!
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Old 18-02-2017, 18:52   #349
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

Nice post FrankinGray!
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Old 19-02-2017, 08:56   #350
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

And if you look at it another way -

You can pay back the good part of that experience by sharing it with those of us who are sailing in your wake. I know I have asked stupid questions, but have always appreciated those here who pointed it out a little tactfully. Every day we see people who write it "Hello, been lurking here for years and.." No one wants their head handed to them for being a beginner and too often it is.

I've learned a lot here. Hope you post again!
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Old 15-03-2017, 00:54   #351
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

good on ya', FranklinGray!
I'm not alone though in objecting against some (many?) newbie's inclination to cut short having to go through sailing/navigation/etc.-literature by asking forums
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Old 15-03-2017, 04:45   #352
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

For the life of me, I just can't imagine why so so many people who come to a forum where prople can learn about cruising, get annoyed when people ask questions and try to learn about cruising. Maybe they were born knowing everything or something.

I learned to sail before the internet, but if I hadn't, I could sure see being turned off to the whole notion by some of the responses I read here.

Good to remember what my dad always told me. No matter how long you live, you will have never have met your last ass hole.

I'm 59 and I've been sailing since I was 14 and I sure don't know everything.
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Old 15-03-2017, 05:06   #353
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

my point is:
anybody venturing to sea & just seeking quick & easy answers displays imho the wrong attitude: thoroughness & application of oneself & a deep interest is the key to succes, asking "what is the best time & the best boat to sail to the south pacific?"-sort of question shows a superficial there-can't be-all-that-much-to-it attitude that imho is not to be encouraged.
but maybe this is my out-of-time-austro-kraut-throroughness...
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Old 15-03-2017, 05:30   #354
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

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my point is:
anybody venturing to sea & just seeking quick & easy answers displays imho the wrong attitude: thoroughness & application of oneself & a deep interest is the key to succes, asking "what is the best time & the best boat to sail to the south pacific?"-sort of question shows a superficial there-can't be-all-that-much-to-it attitude that imho is not to be encouraged.
but maybe this is my out-of-time-austro-kraut-throroughness...
Well, what would be an example of a properly worded question that wouldn't set you off?

Part of my job was training people under me in the skills I already had and I soon learned that one size does not fit all when it comes to imparting knowledge. I heard a lot of different people asking a lot of different questions a lot of different ways. You berate one student and all of a sudden, no one one has any questions. That is not classified as a success.

Asking questions is an important part of how teaching works. If that is something you can't handle, that is fine. But, do everyone a favor and just lurk. Don't be stealing people's sunshine. We need more people boating.
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Old 15-03-2017, 05:44   #355
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

...not the wording, the attitude!
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Old 15-03-2017, 05:58   #356
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

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...not the wording, the attitude!

How does the reader determine attitude of the writer on the internet?

Its extremely difficult.

Another point you appear to miss is that if the person was learning from a revered nautical tome, properly bound and with some Admirals name on it you would probably compliment the learner. Wouldn't you?

But the same learner using the latest up-to-date techniques from current experienced sailors is wrong just because its in the internet? Is it?

In this weeks "Paddleboard across the Atlantic" I was roundly criticized for saying it was a dumb feat that should not be replicated. However, I do endorse people to grab a proper sailboat and get the hell outta Dodge with limited knowledge.
Look at all those of the nautical book printed on paper who left the USA in the 1970s without being able to use as extant and had to learn on the way. Or die by their inacuracy.

For us to impose 'attitude' on someone takes a deep knowledge of the person, in deed. And it's usually not an objective opinion. Your presumption of someones attitude is likely to be tainted by your prejudices... we all do similar.


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Old 15-03-2017, 06:16   #357
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

seems to me, Mark, you don't WANT to understand what I mean...
I'm sure you've come across the sort of questions I write abt...
but we'll let it lie!
pax!
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Old 15-03-2017, 10:02   #358
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

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Originally Posted by Group9 View Post
For the life of me, I just can't imagine why so so many people who come to a forum where prople can learn about cruising, get annoyed when people ask questions and try to learn about cruising. Maybe they were born knowing everything or something.

I learned to sail before the internet, but if I hadn't, I could sure see being turned off to the whole notion by some of the responses I read here.

Good to remember what my dad always told me. No matter how long you live, you will have never have met your last ass hole.

I'm 59 and I've been sailing since I was 14 and I sure don't know everything.
Legit questions are fine. The ones that say I don't have a pot to piss in or a widow to throw it out of, which $5ooK boat should I buy gets a little old, as an example. Asking which $5K boat would be fine. JMHO
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Old 15-03-2017, 11:03   #359
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

I learned a lot on forums, even though I was sailing long before the internet came around. I love discussing sailing on forums - I am often a student and at other times a teacher. I can't imagine a better way to learn than by getting your bearings on a sailing forum and asking lots of questions.
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Old 15-03-2017, 11:38   #360
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Re: When we shouldn't encourage people to "just go"

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I learned a lot on forums, even though I was sailing long before the internet came around. I love discussing sailing on forums - I am often a student and at other times a teacher. I can't imagine a better way to learn than by getting your bearings on a sailing forum and asking lots of questions.
I actually see it the other way around. There is no better way to learn something, than answering questions. This does not apply much to me yet with sailing, I'm still a novice.
Everything in life that I'm good at, I got that way by teaching. Novices see things from a different angle that you may not have thought of. Answering their questions forces you to look at it from a different way as well.
I don't remember who said it but... You don't truly understand something unless you can explain it to a six year old.
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