Spectacular Med Mooring Screwup

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Update:

I was just now inflating my dinghy on the foredeck in preparation of going out to the buoy with another line, when a new boat came in and moored up.

Conditions are similar to what I had -- a bit less wind, but still significant.

This boat is a Beneteau First 50, so blown around by the wind more than my boat, so I suppose the challenge was about the same.

There were two on board. The skipper did exactly what I did -- approach in reverse and angled a bit to aim the stern more into the wind. The difference is that he came in FAST, without stopping next to the buoy as I did.

I am a big believer in "Slow is Pro", but sometimes you need fast for more steerage and control -- here is one big fat case for that.

His crew clipped on the long stainless Baltic style buoy hook, with his bow line on the other end of it, flawlessly, and paid out the line so that at no time was a force exerted to rotate the bow. Meanwhile the skipper kept moving in FAST, so fast that he almost bashed into the quay, and needed full power at the last moment to avoid a crash. But he didn't bash into the quay, and he got in safely on the first try!! He had another crew on the quay who took the expertly thrown stern line, cleated to the windward quarter, and got it on in a flash. Then the bow man took in the bow line. There was a bit of running and shouting, but damn -- it was a fine performance.

I'd take them over beers if I had any on board.

I would not.....those are the cowboys who usually fail in spectacular fashion

[JPA Cate]

I have appreciated this discussion. I think Pete and Pelagic's solution is by far the most seaman-like for the conditions--20 k on the beam. Pfui!

About unexploded munitions, New Caledonia had teams going down to eliminate them, by making them explode one year when we were there. Various parts of the lagoons would be closed for a day, while those operations were continuing. So, I don't know how dangerous unexploded stuff is on the bottom--presumably someone with greater knowledge about the subject than me does, though-- (I've wondered could my anchor striking one of them set it off?), but I was pleased to learn that it was no longer a hazard to navigation.

Ann

[Stakaman]

Med mooring ,single handed !!! ,without the anchor ,from a buoy 30 meters of the dock,with 20 coming from the dock ? I think it was wrong decision from the beginning and doomed to fail whatever the maneuvers you performed.
Walk away , give your self time to think other option ! Lessons learned every day for all of us....

Tender idea was nice and under the right condition should have better results!

I live at med and med mooring is my thing but the way you planed it specially single handed ;no way

Even when you have the help of the anchor to keep the bow straight , with 20 from the side you need more thrust and speed to control the stern especially when you bow is kind of pin down from the chain which makes you stern swing much easier from the wind !many of you don't like it, but with 20s and limited space that's the only way it goes
And med mooring is much more tricky when the wind is coming with little angle from the dock

Ken get windlash control to the cockpit(best upgrade I have done ).. 160 ft pile of chain propaply want work every time and is risky at many harbors (not for the bombs [emoji41])

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

That was my first thought also Pete but as we were not there, perhaps there was not enough swing room at the Bouy, which if there was, your method would still be my preference.

Reasons
Boat sits bow to gusty weather away from any damages while you are busy setting up shore line
Quiet unobtrusive maneuver and better control as you approach the other boats and pier.
Simpler maneuver with stern lines already in place to pick up and secure.
People ashore will see what your intent is and some helpful soul may already have a dingy in water to take your long stern line

Reasons for not going alongside
Solo person still dependent on shore help in strong wind
Wind gusting and blowing off the pier making tie up stressful
Murphy's law... another boat arrives just as your tender is touching the water

There is an easy trick to avoid damaging the stern quarter.

Make an outboard slip loop at a midship cleat and run slack mooring line thru that so as to pull boat away from pier before slipping loop and turning.

Working from buoy just seems more conservative.

Hot tip; wow this thread is full of them! Thanks! That's a really great one. Never occurred to me.

As to working from the buoy -- sure, if there's room to swing, AND if I have a line long enough. These buoys are maybe 50 meters (!) from the quay. I don't have a lot of lines that long on board -- maybe one anchor rode.

As to coming alongside in strong wind -- I DON'T need outside help as long as there are cleats with horns or bollards, rather than those stupid rings which are common in the Baltic. But these quay -- in the military harbor and intended for superyachts, which can't fit into one of the yacht harbors -- has great massive horn cleats which are perfect.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

I would not.....those are the cowboys who usually fail in spectacular fashion

I'm not sure --

Could be you're right. Or on the other hand, could have been very skillful helmsman going as fast as he could -- right up to the maximum speed astern which he could catch the boat with full power ahead -- to minimize the risk that he would get blown off the way I did.

In any case, it worked -- he never touched the quay, never got blown off, and got on safely on the first try.

"Slow is Pro" 99% percent of the time, but oh that 1% . . . Maybe this was just that 1% case?

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by grossifs

Hi. I m italian and Med mooring is the only way we do it... I ll try to explain which manouvres we do. First of all if you have wind either coming from your port or starboard the FIRST thing you have to know is that you must somebody helping you on ground. If tou don t things may became soon very difficult. Let s say U have it. Going stern 2 you need to fix FIRST your stern. Prepare a line from the site from wich the wind is coming and make a.cleat hitch. Arriving to the moor launch the line and a.s.a.p make ir fix to the ground. Turn the wheel to same.side pf the wind and power the engine. This will move your bow or at least keep it still till you will pick the bow line and fix it. Give as much ppwer as U can to have the bow turn in to the wind direction. That s it. I don t know.if O madr myself clear causr of my poor "nautical" english but I hope so... fair winds

Thanks for that, and I think I understood --

But you're talking about buoys with lazy lines, right? (What we like to call "slime lines" ).

Speaking of different variants of bows-to or stern-to mooring -- I really like the way they do it in Kiel, and maybe some other German harbors --

They have piles instead of buoys, and ropes running from the piles to the shore. Throw your bow lines over the piles are you come in. Hold on to the side lines and push off if you need to. Very safe and good.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

I have appreciated this discussion. I think Pete and Pelagic's solution is by far the most seaman-like for the conditions--20 k on the beam. Pfui!

About unexploded munitions, New Caledonia had teams going down to eliminate them, by making them explode one year when we were there. Various parts of the lagoons would be closed for a day, while those operations were continuing. So, I don't know how dangerous unexploded stuff is on the bottom--presumably someone with greater knowledge about the subject than me does, though-- (I've wondered could my anchor striking one of them set it off?), but I was pleased to learn that it was no longer a hazard to navigation.

Ann

I can't imagine there is any significant risk of setting off an old bomb with a small boat anchor. I'd be much more concerned about fouling the anchor it, or on all the old debris on the bottom.

[buzzstar]

The simplest lesson out of all of the seems to be, Stay out of the Med unless you live there.

[Pelagic]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I'm not sure --

Could be you're right. Or on the other hand, could have been very skillful helmsman going as fast as he could -- right up to the maximum speed astern which he could catch the boat with full power ahead -- to minimize the risk that he would get blown off the way I did.

In any case, it worked -- he never touched the quay, never got blown off, and got on safely on the first try.

"Slow is Pro" 99% percent of the time, but oh that 1% . . . Maybe this was just that 1% case?

Hi Dockhead, maybe you were just adding a bit of hyperbole, but Full Astern, Full Ahead is totally unnecessary and is a cowboy move in that scenario.

Full throttle means if some linkage breaks, your screwed..... Never back into a dead end at full speed... You can have astern steerage at much less speed giving your lineman a chance to stop you.

I agree there are times when you needs to use your throttles such as hard astern to make use of your transverse prop walk to help swing the stern around in a tight space, but that is not a dead end.

Twin screw powerboats can walk sideways with judicious throttles and rudder....no problem!

The closest I have come to needing full throttle entering a slip is med mooring super yachts when their is insufficient space for you to fit.

Usually due to sloppy slack lines of the two boats on either side and a side wind closing in so you can't fit.

Add Murphy's law where its an off service weekend and there is only a cook or stewardess on duty watch on both boats and you are on your own.

Then, I lay both anchors and set so my stern stops at the too small gap between thier bows

I slowly run ahead dragging the chains forward,

then back up at half throttle
then use full ahead so my prop wash opens up the gap and now still moving slowly astern I wedge in between the widened gap fender to fender.

This with engineers standingby to apply brakes to windlass if something goes wrong.

The rest of the procedure is somewhat like a lady wriggling into a corset... Not pretty, but interesting[emoji4]

Once the other crews adjust their lines, we all fit.

[danielamartindm]

Wind and current can make a fool of any man. Humility is advised for all sailors. Lots of great tips here in the replies

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

Hi Dockhead, maybe you were just adding a bit of hyperbole, but Full Astern, Full Ahead is totally unnecessary and is a cowboy move in that scenario.

Full throttle means if some linkage breaks, your screwed..... Never back into a dead end at full speed... You can have astern steerage at much less speed giving your lineman a chance to stop you.

I agree there are times when you needs to use your throttles such as hard astern to make use of your transverse prop walk to help swing the stern around in a tight space, but that is not a dead end.

Twin screw powerboats can walk sideways with judicious throttles and rudder....no problem!

The closest I have come to needing full throttle entering a slip is med mooring super yachts when their is insufficient space for you to fit.

Usually due to sloppy slack lines of the two boats on either side and a side wind closing in so you can't fit.

Add Murphy's law where its an off service weekend and there is only a cook or stewardess on duty watch on both boats and you are on your own.

Then, I lay both anchors and set so my stern stops at the too small gap between thier bows

I slowly run ahead dragging the chains forward,

then back up at half throttle
then use full ahead so my prop wash opens up the gap and now still moving slowly astern I wedge in between the widened gap fender to fender.

This with engineers standingby to apply brakes to windlass if something goes wrong.

The rest of the procedure is somewhat like a lady wriggling into a corset... Not pretty, but interesting[emoji4]

Once the other crews adjust their lines, we all fit.

Maybe we misunderstood each other -- I didn't say they came in full astern. They didn't. They came in a a good clip with plenty of steerage -- maybe 3 knots, more or less. For me, that is a supersonic speed for approaching a dock -- I like about 1 knot usually, or even less if it's calm.

And I do use a burst of full power, ahead or astern, on occasion in harbor maneuvers -- if it seems to me that there is a risk that I won't make something or bump into something. Yes, it's a failure to get to that point, but I think it happens to all of us once in a while. Slow is pro, and I am proudest of my harbor maneuvers when I never use more than 1500 RPM.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by buzzstar

The simplest lesson out of all of the seems to be, Stay out of the Med unless you live there.

That's just like saying don't leave the house, it's dangerous outside.

[atlantical]

Its a situation where things snowball. I think everyone that sails has had them, I was even on a ship, all professionally qualified crew, fifteen crew, we got alongside, the ship was too far forward on the dock. The captain had been giving a seaman at the wheel steering orders, and last order he gave him, was hard a port, the as the deck crew (including myself) were struggling to warp the ship backwards along the dock, the captain told the remaining officer, and the helmsman to go down and help us. Due to the wind the winches were really struggling to pull this seventy meter vessel backwards along the quay, Captain got impatient and gave it some thrust to stern, it went backwards, swung the stern into the dock wall, (twin screw) the propeller hit the wall, and bent every blade on the propeller, we knew something was wrong as the stern of the ship had started to climb the wall of the dock.

Can happen to anyone, I saw the captain, and said to him "bad luck about that captain" he said to me "luck had nothing to do with it" true but just a tiny mistake that snowballed. Last steering order should have "midships the wheel" it wasn't given, then if a little more patient, (and perhaps less helpful to his crew" no stern propulsion, just let the crew work harder, then had we had more fenders at the stern (not normally needed) just the way it goes.

[Lodesman]

Dockhead,

Sounds like you tried the textbook Med approach, which works well enough if you have the lines measured correctly, or a couple extra hands to handle them while you're in the cockpit.

In the situation you mentioned, I might have chosen to gone alongside the quay, head into the wind, put a line out through a midship fairlead and back to a winch ready to pay out. Rig for the buoy on the opposite side. Put on just enough throttle to hold against the wind, and start paying out the dockline (use bow thruster too if necessary) to move the boat sideways out to the buoy. Snub the dockline, and casually pick up the buoy. Move dockline to the stern and bring her into position with lines only.

[accomplice]

I've made a fool of myself docking more times than I care to remember. You're a braver man than I for attempting a med-moor single-handed in that situation.

I certainly don't claim to be an expert, but I've come stern-to a dock in a strong cross-wind with little room to spare and had folks tell me I made it look easy -- perhaps they couldn't see me sweating. The key was the anchor 200' out and upwind and a windlass control at the helm. We have so much more windage at the bow that the wind pushes the bow off -- and the anchor rode, when taut, pulls the bow up pointing the stern off. Using this technique I've successfully steered our stern to a dock in strong cross winds -- although I needed a stiff drink afterwards. I think if I had to use a mooring for the bow, though, I'd try to do the same thing with a line from (or looped through) the mooring, to a snatch block near the bow, and fair back to a cockpit winch. Easing or tensioning that line would allow moving the bow up/down. If it starts to look like you're stern is too far off and there's no way to lift it up (by dropping the bow more), power forward and try again. Get a stern line to the windward neighbor as soon as you can.

Another option would be to put a second line on an upwind mooring run through a snatch block on the stern to another winch. Between the two lines, you can control the angle of boat as you back in. I haven't done this going into a dock, but have done it to get off a dock with my bow pinned in a corner and the prop-walk working against me.
This is one of those cases when having spare old halyards comes in handy.

I understand anchoring is forbidden where you are. A previous poster mentioned med-mooring in English Harbor. I was there last winter (the wind blows across the slips at the slipway). I watched boat after boat need to call a diver to free their fouled anchor when they wanted to leave. I started to wonder if the dive service was in any way responsible for all the lines/chains/anchors on the bottom. I was determined to try to get free without a diver. When we tried to pick up the anchor, we pulled a large (300-500#?) ships anchor and many lines with it. I sent a crew member out in our tender to attach a line looped from a halyard through the mess and managed to lift it free of our ground tackle. Once our anchor was back on its roller we cut the looped line and made our getaway. I'd have liked to have cleaned the harbor for the next guy, but it was a big, heavy mess down there. I'm sure the diver still has a good business.

Whatever docking mistakes you've made, I probably have done worse. I'm now dock-shy and, when I have a choice, only come up to a dock to refuel a few times a year.