Sneaking the Holding Tank Overboard

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by sabray

3 miles at at 6 knots that's a 1/2 hour. If your inland the pump outboard and marinas are around. I could see an ohh god the tank is full but mostly in the us no reason for pumping overboard while near the swimming holes and back creeks

Only true if the land is a straight line. From my mooring it takes 3+ hours to get to 3 miles. And that's 2.5 hours from the nearest swiming beach.

[Astrid]

I wonder how the US came up with the 3 mile limit as a distance. I mean this seems a looooong way from the nearest land to discharge a 20 gal holding tank. Given the amount of water this represents it is a hell of a dilution factor.

The 3-mile limit has nothing to do with the USA, and in fact came into acceptance in the first quarter of the 18th century well before the founding of the United States. It was accepted that territorial waters extended out from shore to the distance a large coastal artillery piece could shoot. This became the standard territorial limit until 1982 when UN agreements extended the seaward limit to 12 nm for territorial claims. The old three mile limit remained for waste disposal however, and when written up had in mind large vessels such as warships, liners and other large vessels whose waste disposal was of considerably greater quantity than us boaters. However, in US waters and many others, we sailboaters and the like are included in the laws, even though they were not created specifically with us in mind.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Astrid

The 3-mile limit ... came into acceptance in the first quarter of the 18th century well before the founding of the United States. It was accepted that territorial waters extended out from shore to the distance a large coastal artillery piece could shoot. This became the standard territorial limit until 1982 when UN agreements extended the seaward limit to 12 nm for territorial claims...

That’s what I always thought, but see this
➥ http://www.jstor.org/pss/2195021

http://www . jstor.org/pss/2195021

[Astrid]

Thanks Gord for the clarification.

[rwidman]

I look at the fish and the dolphins and have to wonder where they "poop" ?

Around here, the boat ramps don't have restrooms or outhouses. My slip is close to the public boat ramp. We see people climbing down their swim ladders to relieve themselves in the water. We sometimes see a line of people waiting their turn in the woods .....................

[daddle]

Originally Posted by rwidman

I look at the fish and the dolphins and have to wonder where they "poop" ?

You don't look close enough. Dolphins playing at the bow often cycle the overboard pump. Big brown streak. I imagine the males try to tag their following buddies....being advanced mammals like us.

[Bash]

I've done a lot of scuba diving with sea lions. Not uncommon to have a alpha bull drop a load right in front of me. With many marine mammals, pumping out is a sign of aggression and/or hostility.

Cruisers, arguably, are marine mammals as well. (All the better reason to use the pump-out station?)

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by Astrid

The 3-mile limit has nothing to do with the USA, and in fact came into acceptance in the first quarter of the 18th century well before the founding of the United States. It was accepted that territorial waters extended out from shore to the distance a large coastal artillery piece could shoot. This became the standard territorial limit until 1982 when UN agreements extended the seaward limit to 12 nm for territorial claims. The old three mile limit remained for waste disposal however, and when written up had in mind large vessels such as warships, liners and other large vessels whose waste disposal was of considerably greater quantity than us boaters. However, in US waters and many others, we sailboaters and the like are included in the laws, even though they were not created specifically with us in mind.

The pollution controls really had little to do with territorial limits - they're based on MARPOL conventions, which were started to limit oily waste from being dumped near coastlines. The sewage limits were added later, and iirc large vessels can't dump untreated sewage closer than 12 miles. Treated/disinfected and macerated, they can dump in to 3 miles.

[GeoPowers]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

The pollution controls really had little to do with territorial limits - they're based on MARPOL conventions, which were started to limit oily waste from being dumped near coastlines. The sewage limits were added later, and iirc large vessels can't dump untreated sewage closer than 12 miles. Treated/disinfected and macerated, they can dump in to 3 miles.

Exactly. The U.S. is one of the few countries that has not ratified Annex iv which addresses the discharge if sewage. Presumably because it is covered under the Clean Water Act?

[sailorboy1]

well now that the thread seems to have wound down as far as postings and in poll responses:

According to the poll the majority "sneak" their holding tanks overboard. 17% do it regularly but this could be that some answered that way becasue they don't even have a holding tank. The middle 47.7% between never & always seems to suggest that they do it but think it over at least.

Of course like any poll you could play around with the results and spin it a lot of ways.

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

well now that the thread seems to have wound down as far as postings and in poll responses:

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

According to the poll the majority "sneak" their holding tanks overboard. 17% do it regularly but this could be that some answered that way becasue they don't even have a holding tank. The middle 47.7% between never & always seems to suggest that they do it but think it over at least.

Of course like any poll you could play around with the results and spin it a lot of ways.

As with any poll, there's no way to tell if you have honest answers or not. And because some of the options are illegal, there is good reason to be less than honest or not participate at all if you're using a variation of your real name instead of an anonymous screen name.

[off-the-grid]

Originally Posted by rwidman

And because some of the options are illegal, there is good reason to be less than honest or not participate at all if you're using a variation of your real name instead of an anonymous screen name.

That's true with posting in the thread, but is there even a way for the even the mods to see what people actually voted?

[osirissail]

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

. . . Of course like any poll you could play around with the results and spin it a lot of ways.

Which is why your poll is no less valid than the whole spectrum of the other polls we get bombarded with by the news media and various organizations. I like the one where the vast majority of Americans who were polled about "di-hydrogen oxide" thought it should be banned.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by rwidman

As with any poll, there's no way to tell if you have honest answers or not. And because some of the options are illegal, there is good reason to be less than honest or not participate at all if you're using a variation of your real name instead of an anonymous screen name.

Of course that's why it had a poll so people could vote without giving even their CF name. I learned a long time ago to not believe polls if I didn't see the raw data, but in this case everyone sees them. Enough answered honest I think; as I never thought people would vote for the "only at night" choice.

On the other hand it seems pretty paranoid here to be worried Big Brother is coming for you for this thrread.

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by Don Lucas

Of course that's why it had a poll so people could vote without giving even their CF name. I learned a long time ago to not believe polls if I didn't see the raw data, but in this case everyone sees them. Enough answered honest I think; as I never thought people would vote for the "only at night" choice.

On the other hand it seems pretty paranoid here to be worried Big Brother is coming for you for this thrread.

I have friends and dock neighbors who routinely empty their holding tanks in the river. I have others who go three miles offshore (about a twenty mile trip each way), and others would never do it (or have no overboard discharge) and have their tanks pumped out. It's a conversation I try to avoid.