Looking For Ideas - May Give Up

[KenJubilee]

Originally Posted by Chotu

Hi Everyone,

I’ve been gone a while after some health issues to take a break from boats mentally.

I’ve realized a few things.

I’m in need of a break from working on boats. I’d sure love to go sailing and cruising again, but I have a lot of hours to go before that can happen. Also, RV travel has been pretty nice. I was able to have similar feelings out here to those boats provide. Cooler temperatures, fresh clean air, peace and quiet, safety and security.

So I’m contemplating the unthinkable. Selling my boat.

I will never, ever be able to afford a high performance catamaran at the level of the one I built. That’s the tricky part. I’m looking to work on some business ideas if I do sell, so there is a slim chance I could make enough to just buy one... BUT... the construction of production boats isn’t as high quality and most have double layers inside the hull. As in, the interior is made of layers you can’t get to that mold grows behind. I have a lot of problems with boat mold after decades of living aboard. So I’m not even sure I could buy a production boat in the future even if I could afford one as high quality as the one I built because of mold issues. Yes, all boats have mold. It’s the “boat smell”

The only other thing I can think of is just mothballing the boat and then hiring people to help build it. I suppose that could even be done starting now, but I ran into yet ANOTHER problem. The marina I asked to stay at to do heavy construction on the boat has changed. It’s not allowing you to even run tools outside on your boat anymore. Not even a buffer on a production gel coat boat.

They just came out with this new rental agreement that prohibits you from working on your boat, says it’s not their fault if the marina damages your boat, it is your fault if you damage anything at the marina, you need comprehensive insurance coverage and proof of it, that random strangers may wander onto the dock and board your boat, stealing things, , etc etc. it’s certifiably insane. There no way I can sign the agreement. The agreement also locks you in to the marina for a year at a time.

So on top of all this, I don’t have anywhere to work on my boat or store either at this time.

What should I do?

I just feel so utterly defeated on this topic.

I have had mold issues that were overwhelming, I met an engineer that recommended Chlorine Dioxide. ClO2. It’s a 2 part mix that when mixed, releases the ClO2 int the atmosphere. It has a life of about 3 hours and is neutralized by sunlight, so best to treat at night. It was used to eradicate the anthrax spores in DC after 9/11/2001. Yes it will kill active mold, mildew and spores, roaches, vermin. Obviously no one can be on board when treating.

Good luck

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Here in Europe we expect our vehicles to do that to the litre..

If you are happy to camp out of the back of a subcompact car...sure. You can find cars like that in the states, too.

But really, long term traveling, there is no need to be doing 1000miles per week.

It's kind of like cruising boats that get 3-10MPG...no one really worries too much because you don't travel that many miles at a time.

Last winter we did 8000miles over 8 months with a fuel bill of around $2100. Double or triple that for European fuel prices and it's still far from a deal breaker. Plus distances in Europe are shorter negating a lot of the miles.

Of course, the current setup is far too big for Europe. The European campgrounds are set up primarily for a small class C motorhomes. Of course, they tend to be horribly underpowered. We had a campervan in the German Alps and on what I would consider a modest grade, it was struggling to maintain 45mph.

[goboatingnow]

The European RVs I see here in Greece mainly originating in Germany Bulgaria etc. Seem big to me , often pulling a big rib trailer as well

Class C motorhomes are actually bigger then class B

Class C campers can be quite big.

I’ve a few EU campers based on fiat or Ford LWB vans. Plenty powerful.

The main thing that limits the size of Eu motor homes is the < 3.5 metric tonnes weight limit of the standard B licence. Above that a HGV ( C) license is needed.

Class A RVs in Europe tend to need HGV licences. ( c1 or C )

[sailorladd]

I sympathise and completely hear what you are saying.
I built my boat from the keel up, and have cruised her around the world, always maintaining her and hauling out whenever needed and doing all the work, either alone or with the help of my twin brother.

Some years ago I did a complete rebuild inside, gutted out a lot of the furniture and spent a year (in the water) rebuilding the interior, and I rebuilt the wooden mast (at my home) and made it six feet taller, I redid all the rigging, installed a new bigger diesel engine, etc so I can relate to what you are going through. I have been at it for over forty years.... I too am tired, so very tired of working on boats. I now have a friend living on board and helping to pay for the slip fees.... I am strongly thinking about selling her.

I have also done RVing and I do like the ease and hassle free moving about from one place to another, although trying to compare sailing and driving around on land is not quite the same thing, but there is a feeling of peace and security and freedom in both..

I have always been one to follow my heart... you might consider that too, embrace it actually, and rest assured that we all have only so much time on earth....

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

The European RVs I see here in Greece mainly originating in Germany Bulgaria etc. Seem big to me , often pulling a big rib trailer as well

Class C motorhomes are actually bigger then class B

Class C campers can be quite big.

I’ve a few EU campers based on fiat or Ford LWB vans. Plenty powerful.

The main thing that limits the size of Eu motor homes is the < 3.5 metric tonnes weight limit of the standard B licence. Above that a HGV ( C) license is needed.

Class A RVs in Europe tend to need HGV licences. ( c1 or C )

Class C can be bigger...they have some monsters 40ft units based on heavy duty truck chassis but the ones in Europe tend to be similar size to Class B. The big advantage is they tend to be a little wider and taller opening up the interior. They generally aren't much longer from what we've seen.

Occasionally, you will see smaller Class A or larger Class C but they seem pretty rare and a lot of places they would be difficult to park as the campgrounds aren't really set up for them. You almost never see a TOAD but with public transit so much better, it's usually not an issue.

We had a Fiat based Class B rented a couple times and it was OK if you didn't expect to keep up with traffic.

The 3.5ton limit is an important point. When you go to get your international driving permit, make them check the heavy vehicle box. Your standard US drivers license is perfectly legal to drive bigger than 3.5ton so long as it's not for commercial purposes. You may have to explain it to the lady filling out the paperwork but we've had no issue getting them to do it. We know two couples who (separately) ran into the issue as the police looked at the blank check box and said they weren't licensed for such a big RV.

PS: For those still following along....Class C is a van/truck front end with a custom house built by the manufacture. Class B is a full van converted to an RV (sometimes they will do a little modification to the body such as a high roof). Class A is a chassis where the manufacturer builds both the living and driving space (though it also includes motorcoach conversions)

[PirateFoxy]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

Class C can be bigger...they have some monsters 40ft units based on heavy duty truck chassis but the ones in Europe tend to be similar size to Class B. The big advantage is they tend to be a little wider and taller opening up the interior. They generally aren't much longer from what we've seen.

In the US often the smaller Class Cs are referred to as “Class B+” which isn’t official but helps to convey that it’s intended to be the smaller end of the Class C range and get you Class B type sizing but with better use of space. So that’s something to keep an eye out for in ads and so on, if someone is looking and being confused by “B+”. (You’ll want to actually check dimensions though as of course they can call anything they want a B+.)

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by PirateFoxy

In the US often the smaller Class Cs are referred to as “Class B+” which isn’t official but helps to convey that it’s intended to be the smaller end of the Class C range and get you Class B type sizing but with better use of space. So that’s something to keep an eye out for in ads and so on, if someone is looking and being confused by “B+”. (You’ll want to actually check dimensions though as of course they can call anything they want a B+.)

B+ is a Class C with the front overhang eliminated. The result is the van front blends more smoothly into the house and they look more van-like (hence the reference to B) but the body behind the cockpit is still built by the MH manufacturer not the automotive chassis supplier.

Popular with couples as they don't need the extra bed above the cockpit for kids.

There is no size implied. They can be just as big as other Class C RVs.

[PirateFoxy]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

B+ is a Class C with the front overhang eliminated. The result is the van front blends more smoothly into the house and they look more van-like (hence the reference to B) but the body behind the cockpit is still built by the MH manufacturer not the automotive chassis supplier.

Popular with couples as they don't need the extra bed above the cockpit for kids.

There is no size implied. They can be just as big as other Class C RVs.

All the ones I’ve seen are smaller. I’ve never encountered someone using B+ to refer to one of those giant Class C’s. Mostly it’s people talking about things like Leisure Travel Vans. 🤷*♀️

[merrydolphin]

And you know, there comes a time when you just get tired of boat work. Too much work and not enough sailing. When you are younger its easier to keep up with. I have gone back and forth a couple of times now from live aboard cruiser to Diesel motor home. And indeed there are parallels in many way. I have always been a believer that if you are not using your boat, SELL IT. It is a albatross around your neck. I just sold my last one (have owned 5 serious cruising boats and cruised them) and 2 diesel motor homes full time. And am now motorhoming. Will probably get something smaller, simpler, cheaper boat in the future. What ever you do, enjoy it. It you are not enjoying it? Well………..

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by PirateFoxy

All the ones I’ve seen are smaller. I’ve never encountered someone using B+ to refer to one of those giant Class C’s. Mostly it’s people talking about things like Leisure Travel Vans. ��*♀️

Both B+ and C run from around 20ft up to 30ft (before moving into the specialty models on heavy duty truck chassis).

When they first came out B+ did lean toward the small size but it's not unusual to see 30ft models. See below for an example:

https://www.rvt.com/Nexus-RV-Viper-2...86403-UX183244

30ft would be a hassle in Europe. I would cap it at maybe 25ft for ease of maneuvering and parking.

[Dave9111]

FWIW, I have had vans, trucks (light, medium, and heavy) and tag trailers and fifth wheels and goosenecks. Still have several.

IMO, the best rig for roaming the US for a period of time (weeks to months) in great comfort is a pickup truck with a fifth wheel travel trailer.

They tow really, really well. They are really easy to connect and disconnect by yourself. They are easy to back up and very manueverable. They do well in crappy weather. Drop the trailer, take the truck, no big deal. Class A motorhomes are not practical. You can't park them anywhere. Converted buses have the same problem. So you need to drag a car along with your Class A so you can get around without the motorhome. Its a crazy idea. Motorcycles don't do well in crappy weather.

Very few people buy a second Class A. Class C's are only slightly better, but still too big to park anywhere. You can park a pickup truck in NYC. It won't be fun, but you can do it.


A used 3/4 ton pickup truck (work style with rubber mats) are much cheaper than the luxury pickups and they do the same thing. Plus white is a good color! If you have carpet in your truck and you put in rubber mats. Does the carpet matter? Most diesel pickups are no longer practical. Too costly up front. They require DEF. The numbers just don't work. Gas is the way to go.

Slide in pickup truck campers are pretty small. They can blow you all over the road. If they are heavy, the big ones require a 1 ton truck.



Regarding your girlfriends depression, I can relate. That can cause your own depression. You both may need help to deal with her issues. Depression is depressing! Seriously!

[LHolden]

Thanks to Chotu for this thread, and to everyone who’s pitched in. Chotu has obviously earned a lot of respect here. I’ve read thru it all so far, and it was a difficult emotional coaster ride. At 75 I can relate, and it has given me too, a lot to consider and reconsider. Thanks to all.

[Ringmaster]

Marina BS is one of the reasons why I sold my boat last spring.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Dave9111

FWIW, I have had vans, trucks (light, medium, and heavy) and tag trailers and fifth wheels and goosenecks. Still have several.

IMO, the best rig for roaming the US for a period of time (weeks to months) in great comfort is a pickup truck with a fifth wheel travel trailer.

They tow really, really well. They are really easy to connect and disconnect by yourself. They are easy to back up and very manueverable. They do well in crappy weather. Drop the trailer, take the truck, no big deal. Class A motorhomes are not practical. You can't park them anywhere. Converted buses have the same problem. So you need to drag a car along with your Class A so you can get around without the motorhome. Its a crazy idea. Motorcycles don't do well in crappy weather.

Very few people buy a second Class A. Class C's are only slightly better, but still too big to park anywhere. You can park a pickup truck in NYC. It won't be fun, but you can do it.


A used 3/4 ton pickup truck (work style with rubber mats) are much cheaper than the luxury pickups and they do the same thing. Plus white is a good color! If you have carpet in your truck and you put in rubber mats. Does the carpet matter? Most diesel pickups are no longer practical. Too costly up front. They require DEF. The numbers just don't work. Gas is the way to go.

Slide in pickup truck campers are pretty small. They can blow you all over the road. If they are heavy, the big ones require a 1 ton truck.



Regarding your girlfriends depression, I can relate. That can cause your own depression. You both may need help to deal with her issues. Depression is depressing! Seriously!

Wow , a petrol based pickup , towing a big “ caravan “, as a previous owner of a 3 litre diesel pickup , the “ gas” bill must run in mortgage territory.

Diesel has better torque too.

The particle filter isn’t an issue if the truck is worked hard.

[Dave9111]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Wow , a petrol based pickup , towing a big “ caravan “, as a previous owner of a 3 litre diesel pickup , the “ gas” bill must run in mortgage territory.

Diesel has better torque too.

The particle filter isn’t an issue if the truck is worked hard.

Its simple math.

Gas is about $3.00/gallon right now.
Diesel is about $3.60/gallon.

If you buy a new diesel pickup truck you will pay at least $10,000 more for the diesel.

If you Diesel gets 20% better fuel economy, figure out how long it will take to pay for the diesel. The math doesn't work. Back when diesel was less expensive than gas, it did. That was prior to the low sulphur mandates for diesel. Then factor in the cost of diesel injectors (they go bad). More expensive oil changes. The cost of diesel engine maintenance, etc.

DEF is required whether you run the truck hard or not. The truck is programmed to run the DEF cycle periodically. MPG during that cycle is really bad. Then you have to buy the DEF.

Moving 20,000 lbs of Class A or Pickup Truck and Caravan takes fuel no matter what. 9-10 mpg with a Diesel. About 8 with a gas engine on flat roads.

So drive 25,000 miles at 8 mpg = 3125 gallons @ $3/gallon = $9375 or
$780 per month.

In comparison, what kind of mileage does a 30 ft powerboat get? 1 or 2 mpg?

The truck and caravan is looking much better now! :-)