Greta hitches a ride on La Vagabonde

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by daletournier

Your kidding yourself if you think a 45ft modern catamaran is green...

Compared to what?

[rodgoult]

So to all those criticizing Greta for being 'shrill' etcetera, and to those who claim that scientists don't agree on the problem (98% of them do), I have two questions:
1. Could you deliver a speech as she did to an International Conference in a foreign language?
2. Do you have any real understanding of the scale of the problems the changing climate is creating and which Greta's generation is going to have to contend, seeing as most of the current crop of (generally) elderly world leaders appears not to care?
I suspect the answer to both questions is probably a resounding NO.
I have the utmost respect for this young lady and what she is doing - and I would have even if she were wrong.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by boat_alexandra

Fantastic news: Thanks to vagabonde!

Will be a tough passage this time of year: hope for fair winds.

Greta understands she must control her own actions. She understands the power of sail!

There really are no excuses for motoring. It is polluting and you can sail everywhere without doing this. It is injustice to those who don't motor.

Hoping vagabonde steps up. When they get a chance after the passage to remove any engines or stoves that consumes fossil fuels!

It doesn't appear that Greta really understands the amount of fossil fuels that went into manufacturing & now operating La Vagabonde. Multiply by two actually for a big catamaran with two diesel propulsion engines and a (likely) large capacity diesel generator, to say nothing of producing two large hulls made from GRP. Maybe someone can calculate how the economies of scale of a single seat on an airplane compares. Besides, I doubt youTube images of Riley sweating it out in a rowing dinghy trying to tow La Vagabonde out a channel would get a lot of 'Likes'.

Originally Posted by Singularity

The irony to me is taking a ride on a late-model boat in a world where perfectly capable boats of yesteryear are rotting away because of essentially aesthetic concerns of younger people. Not particularly consistent with the reduce/re-use/recycle concept. I'd have much preferred to see her in a plastic classic.

Irony indeed. The market for such older classics continues to dive which means more & more are winding up getting scrapped. The lead from the keels gets recycled, but all the FRP winds up in landfills. For the cost of a new or newer boat, many of these plastic classics could be restored.

Originally Posted by daletournier

Your kidding yourself if you think a 45ft modern catamaran is green....but what ever makes you feel good.

So obvious that no add'l comment necessary.

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

...vast majority of Asperger people do terribly in school, for a couple of reasons, one is a school is very much primarily about social pressures and interactions and about indoctrination of children into society, and only secondarily about edification, so of course an Aspie won’t do well in school because it’s primarily about social skills, the football player and the cheerleader are the school leaders, not the smart kids.
Then also schools teach to an idiot level, so that 99% can understand, if your in the top few percent you understood it before the school tried teaching it, and to have the same things taught over and over is mind numbingly boring...

Agree 100% with this.
Normal IQ kids: earlier social maturity, earlier hand-eye coordination, more wired to adopt social norms/fit in even if social norms are illogical/idiotic
High IQ kids: later (if ever) social maturity (age 21+), later hand-eye coordination, wired to do what makes sense, not wired for nonsense groupthink
Both groups test at the genius level at age 5. Normal IQ kids regress to average in our education system and high IQ kids more often fail out (as described above).

There are conspiracy theories on why the US education system changed in the 1950s and 1960s in a manner that requires linear thinking (which is quite slow, inefficient, and not natural to high IQ types). Anyhow, here's a 12 minute video by Sir Ken Robinson that is an excellent review of the past/future education system, mentions the inanity of diagnosing ADHD so routinely: https://youtu.be/zDZFcDGpL4U

[Morgali]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Asperger’s is not a learning disability.
People with Asperger’s will have an average or above average IQ.

i didnt want to post that.

[250224]

Originally Posted by rodgoult

and which Greta's generation is going to have to contend, seeing as most of the current crop of (generally) elderly world leaders appears not to care?

Most of Greta's generation don't care either. It's not done with eating vegan, voting green and some demonstrations (vegetarian meals are a good start though).

Obama was quite a young leader, but he wouldn't have dared to enact real changes. The consequences of real adjusting would be (too) severe, see my links above.

[Crusty Joker]

I am a global marine ecologist, diver, biologist of sorts that is working toward the return to sailing. I appreciate this topic and personality on this forum. I appreciate this forum for its generally informative and less restrictive acceptance of posts. Truly, the forum is helpful. Ecology, environmentalism, and environmental health are not exchangeable terms. Nor is this topic limited to those who are pro or anti energy or petroleum. This topic is one we need to follow and address daily like we brush our teeth. We need to be willing to be informed and above all, CHANGE our behaviors to fit the best understanding possible for the way forward. We do not get a second chance at the operation of this garden we call the EARTH. Stay wet and by that I mean with clean healthy waters. By the way, I have worked with many high functioning people who may be described as in the syndrome. Find them a useful place on your crew! You may find that you still need a nerd or star gazer. Even a poet obsessed with word choice. I am located in Santa Monica Bay and my cohort lives, works and was educated in Cochin, India. PhD Benthic Marine Ecology. We are just tools for the bacteria we will eventually feed. Enjoy your part of the garden. You inherit what you create. Keep your garden gates open for visitors with knowledge. I do. We were not tossed out of the garden, we left it because we were embarrassed.

[joelhemington]

Originally Posted by intervivos

I have a feeling the outcome for La Vagabond will be just the opposite. People who like sailing shows to get away from politics will leave...along with their dollars. The young radical folks will flock to the the show and watch a few shows, until the next hip topic takes off.

Take a look at the comments on this "news" article. Absolutely brutal.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art....html#comments

Bring this back to sailing, not sure I would want to sail a light performance cat in the atlantic this time of year....I hope stardom hasn't clouded their judgement and this ends badly. Do they even have AIS? Couldn't find them....

I wonder what all these global warming activists are going to do with themselves when we reach the next mini ice age, which is predicted to start in the next five years. A lot of humble pie I suspect. The climate of the earth changes from time to time, it's a natural occurrence that's been happening since the dawn of history (and before). While there's nothing wrong with reducing our carbon footprint, I find it kind of pretentious that we should think we can alter the earth's ever changing climate cycles.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by Singularity

Agree 100% with this.
Normal IQ kids: earlier social maturity, earlier hand-eye coordination, more wired to adopt social norms/fit in even if social norms are illogical/idiotic
High IQ kids: later (if ever) social maturity (age 21+), later hand-eye coordination, wired to do what makes sense, not wired for nonsense groupthink
Both groups test at the genius level at age 5. Normal IQ kids regress to average in our education system and high IQ kids more often fail out (as described above).

There are conspiracy theories on why the US education system changed in the 1950s and 1960s in a manner that requires linear thinking (which is quite slow, inefficient, and not natural to high IQ types). Anyhow, here's a 12 minute video by Sir Ken Robinson that is an excellent review of the past/future education system, mentions the inanity of diagnosing ADHD so routinely: https://youtu.be/zDZFcDGpL4U

A salient post and thought-provoking 12 mins.

[BobFord]

Does Greta plan to protest in person, to the real polluters ? China , India ,far East .

[TBW]

She is SIXTEEN for crying out loud!!
Sixteen!
Who among us did anything like this when we were sixteen?
She should get credit and support.
Nothing less. Nothing else.
TW

[Tortuga's Lie]

Originally Posted by blu3534

a "bit" offtopic...

"Why can't we do what's best?" you ask. -- Because it is EXTREMELY difficult, I would answer.

If you are interested, I could recommend these articles (from the renowned ecological footprint co-inventor):

- (Don’t Call Me a Pessimist on Climate Change. I Am a Realist) https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2019/11/...st-Face-Facts/ and

- (Memo from a Climate Crisis Realist: The Choice before Us) https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2019/11/...-Realist-Memo/

Now what?

No politician will be able/inclined to "sell" such things. I suppose almost no people would accept the consequences of an *effective* green deal (as in the 2nd article). Towards a population of 2 or 3 billion people, etc., you just can't say that.

In the shiny Greta blogger universe there most likely wouldn't be high-end racing sailboats any more and outremer wouldn't have spare money to sponsor youtube films. You'd hitch in a much more local circle.

Greta (and NGOs) might do no harm but they, imo, provide glitter. It is known that what we do is not sustainable and will worsen with population grow. It is also telling how 'social unrest' in Santiago leads to killing of the 'luxury' climate conference. Talk about priorities.

Nevertheless I wish for a save journey. And maybe it's better to do 'something' instead of sitting calm? I don't know?

Blu,
I do not disagree or argue about your statements or the articles (nice read by the way) but it is my hope that we as a human race will be able to be a bit more proactive towards protecting the Earth as much as we can. I too am usually a pragmatic person but I try to do what I can to shave off a little of my carbon footprint. I sold my BMW because of the poor fuel economy and bought a Camry that gets 38 MPG, I know, I know ......it's a gas engine (I didn't say I was perfect!); I keep my house at 66 degrees in the winter and use solar heat gain. In the summer, I have deciduous trees to help with shading to help lessen the load on the air conditioning. It's the small things that all of us can do to help out.
I fully understand that the major polluters in the World (China, India and parts of the U.S.) will still be major polluters no matter what we say here on this forum......but maybe, just maybe, we can make a small difference.....and if more and more people make a small difference, then we have a big difference. It's about changing expectations I think.

“We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win.” ----- JFK

[Scubableu]

Been there and got the T-shirt ! lol

[Morgali]

Originally Posted by joelhemington

The climate of the earth changes from time to time, it's a natural occurrence that's been happening since the dawn of history (and before).

What you have stated here is true, However, there is a fault in your logic. We have the ability to track climate changes, and see how they operated historically. When people talk about "climate change", they are talking about how human interaction with the planet in the form of consumption has dramatically raised the output of gasses and wastes that directly effect how the globe responds climatically.

We have, as a species, dramatically increased the output of carbon dioxide. This by itself is indeed probably not enough to change the global climate. However, at the same time, we have ripped down most of the systems the globe had in place to deal with carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, such as tearing down and burning flora on land, (trees and stuff), and dumping chemicals en-mass into the ocean which destroys the ability of the ocean to absorb enough CO2 to keep levels stable or in line with historic temperature swings.

Originally Posted by joelhemington

While there's nothing wrong with reducing our carbon footprint, I find it kind of pretentious that we should think we can alter the earth's ever changing climate cycles.

You are right, we do not have the ability to DIRECTLY and INTENTIONALLY change the global climate, or we wouldn't be having this discussion. The problem is, like locusts who scourge through a field of grains, we've over-consumed, over-reproduced, and now are literally consuming ourselves out of existence, and taking a helluva lot of innocent species with us.

I'm no greta, and I will probably be gone before this threatens my life directly, but it is real, and it is happening.

We are not out of the woods, by a long shot.

If you are interested in learning more about what I'm talking about, look up the following things, "Desertification", "Oceanic Acidification", and reversing desertification.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desertification
https://ourworld.unu.edu/en/reversin...with-livestock
https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2018/...ing-technique/
https://www.urbanfarm.org/2019/02/10...sertification/
https://nativeenergy.com/2017/11/how...-in-the-ocean/

[Exile]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Compared to what?

Check out a youTube channel called "How To Sail Oceans." With an engineless sailboat, he has to pick his weather windows & routes that much more carefully. I doubt he would avail himself of the option of a W-E Atlantic crossing this time of year in order to meet the schedule of some international conference.