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22-05-2014, 18:21
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#76
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Central California
Boat: Catalina 30
Posts: 880
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Why did YachtVids not want to show the launch vehicle and the boat as it entered the water? I wonder what we would have seen in that sequence as the stern of Boden entered the water?
Okay, new speculation: Maybe the launch
vehicle got a flat tire or 4.
__________________
Bill
...........................................
You can't buy happiness, but you can buy ribeye.
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22-05-2014, 18:39
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#77
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Back in Northern California working on the Ranch
Boat: Pearson 365 Sloop and 9' Fatty Knees.
Posts: 10,466
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
I know I'm going out on a limb here but when a $10M yacht is going down a ramp and it lists only 5 degrees, wouldn't you want to pull it back up and see whats up?
Last time I hauled in California, the idiot had my boat in the straps listing 10 degrees. I made him stop and correct. He said to me... "Oh don't worry, I do this all the time". My reply... "Humor me and correct it".
__________________
"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: Wow - what a ride!"
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22-05-2014, 21:15
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#78
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Paradise
Boat: Various
Posts: 2,427
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celestialsailor
I know I'm going out on a limb here but when a $10M yacht is going down a ramp and it lists only 5 degrees, wouldn't you want to pull it back up and see whats up?
Last time I hauled in California, the idiot had my boat in the straps listing 10 degrees. I made him stop and correct. He said to me... "Oh don't worry, I do this all the time". My reply... "Humor me and correct it".
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Call the launch off until another day. I would have stopped sooner with the low tires. But then I would have suggested a crane and sling for a boat I knew wasn't completed yet.
Oh and this one was listing more than 5 degrees. Oh but then what does it matter if you're going to close the doors anyway? What is one more debtor?
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22-05-2014, 21:21
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#79
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Back in Northern California working on the Ranch
Boat: Pearson 365 Sloop and 9' Fatty Knees.
Posts: 10,466
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
I meant by the time it started listing...STOP! Pull it back up. In Kona,Hi., there was a boat mover who use to dive on all his jobs, putting them in and out of the water.
__________________
"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: Wow - what a ride!"
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22-05-2014, 21:29
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#80
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Paradise
Boat: Various
Posts: 2,427
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celestialsailor
I meant by the time it started listing...STOP! Pull it back up. In Kona,Hi., there was a boat mover who use to dive on all his jobs, putting them in and out of the water.
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I agree....when in doubt, don't. First sign of a problem, you stop. Well, unless you have some other reason you feel you just must do it right then regardless of the risk. So many things in the launching though that were missing versus what you'd expect.
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23-05-2014, 08:57
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#81
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,109
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
You might find this interesting and telling of the owner influence, especially due to the size and costs of this yacht.
Boat Name: Blood Baron, hailing port unknown.
Lloyd
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB
Glad to see someone comment on the impropriety of him disclosing that report. As to ego, should have read his blog yesterday when he was claiming unlimited captain. Apparently someone encouraged him to remove his credentials. Could it possibly be there were exaggerated?
Ultimately I see him mostly as irrelevant though. He wasn't a naval architect and my understanding that the only one involved was internal to the builder. Ultimately the boat rolled and sunk and whether fault of the boat or dollies it was within the responsibility of the builder. If Northern was taking build, design and architectural instructions from this captain, then that wasn't defensible and I doubt they were in fact of the captain's bravado. But he lost me when he disclosed that document. Now, had he disclosed it in private as part of the negotiation and under order to do so, that's different.
This is a case of one or more huge mistakes on the part of a builder, a builder struggling to remain alive. Now the closing can't reasonably be blamed on some catastrophic accident out of their control. First it was in their control. Second were they not insured? Less than one day and they announce that's it? That shows a problem far beyond this incident. But consistent with Northern's history of the last several years.
Part of what I find most amazing too was the boat was tilted more than normal. They noticed and stopped. Then they continued? Why so desperate to launch at that moment?
I feel deeply for the employees and for the boat buyers who are now sitting with millions paid and no boat to show for it. I believe four boats in that situation.
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23-05-2014, 09:26
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#82
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Marine Service Provider
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,109
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
In the video as the stern moves back, you can see what appears to be air pushing water. As the boat was moving so slowly, it couldn't be anything else.
Also, I have a first hand report, that one of the stabilizers struck bottom. Which caused the initial instability. This makes sense. Look how far forward the stabilizers are, they are in very shallow water, which is then exacerbated, as the stern starts to float.
Next up they powered the engines trying to move it into deeper water, and the prop thrust torqued the hull further in the direction of the instability.
Lloyd
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB
Well, it did sink as far as it could and did take on water. Just shallow there and, of course, the sinking was after the roll. One question is did it have water ingress before the roll. The door to the engine room was open. You have one side lower than the other, then add water to the lower side and that sure messes the ballast up even more. But these are all things that we'll have to wait for the answers on.
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23-05-2014, 09:37
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#83
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 25,480
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic
Unfortunately I don't think the Owner has any choice but to salvage his probably 87‰ paid for boat.
Company is now going under administrative control. Supply Creditors are now clambering to make sure they have been paid.
If Stage Payments are for specific milestones (like main machinery installed) then Owner now owns that portion.
Second or Third stage payment would have been at keel laying and hull # registered on behalf of Owner.
Contract should have Builder Force Majure conditions that protect Owner from situations just like this.
So hull # rights revert to Owner
Best thing now would be for Owner to hire some key employees from Yard to salvage and finish yacht in water.
I don't buy that design is fatally flawed. Just that Yard took ridiculous risks to launch on the cheap.
Hopefully Insurance/Escrow will cover about 70% of completion costs
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I'm not even sure the "owner" owns the machinery etc. There may be liens on the engines. Does it work like contracting on land? You need to get material releases prior to making payment.
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard
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23-05-2014, 09:40
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#84
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cruiser
Join Date: May 2010
Location: SF Bay Area; Former Annapolis and MA Liveaboard.
Boat: Looking and saving for my next...mid-atlantic coast
Posts: 6,197
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingCloud1937
Also, I have a first hand report, that one of the stabilizers struck bottom. Which caused the initial instability. This makes sense. Look how far forward the stabilizers are, they are in very shallow water, which is then exacerbated, as the stern starts to float.
Next up they powered the engines trying to move it into deeper water, and the prop thrust torqued the hull further in the direction of the instability.
Lloyd
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Certainly looks that way
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23-05-2014, 10:14
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#85
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 3,524
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
I agree that there's lots of opportunity for arm chair quarterbacking here.
But I expect Nordhavn wishes they had done some things differently when a new Nordhavn 56 motorsailer was dropped on ship unloading (sure, it was certainly the ship crane operator's fault but one wonders what Nordhavn's staff was doing at the time?)
Vessel Assist Salvages Launch-Accident Nordhavn 56 Motorsailer | OceanLines
One obvious difference was after the accident - Nordhavn was financially stable
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23-05-2014, 10:44
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#86
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Abaco, Bahamas/ Western NC
Boat: Nothing large at the moment
Posts: 1,037
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Simple answer: that "Thing" was so fugly King Neptune took one look at it and did it in!
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23-05-2014, 10:51
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#87
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Paradise
Boat: Various
Posts: 2,427
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlF
One obvious difference was after the accident - Nordhavn was financially stable
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Actually a difference before and after. Nordhavn was stable. Northern insolvent.
Oh and another. To my knowledge Nordhavn didn't already have a large number of lawsuits pending against them in Superior Court as Northern does.
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23-05-2014, 11:50
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#88
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Long Range Cruiser
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,822
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlF
I agree that there's lots of opportunity for arm chair quarterbacking here.
But I expect Nordhavn wishes they had done some things differently when a new Nordhavn 56 motorsailer was dropped on ship unloading (sure, it was certainly the ship crane operator's fault but one wonders what Nordhavn's staff was doing at the time?)
Vessel Assist Salvages Launch-Accident Nordhavn 56 Motorsailer | OceanLines
One obvious difference was after the accident - Nordhavn was financially stable
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Not only was that years ago.... 2009, but on a small boat, insignificant to Nordavns main production line... Nordhavns flagship is now 120 feet long, with a bevvy of other boats larger than 56.
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24-05-2014, 14:33
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#89
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Paradise
Boat: Various
Posts: 2,427
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
The boat has now been moved successfully by barge and crane (held by a sling as will not remain stable in it's current state) to the barge dock just north of Anacortes Marina and has been hoisted out of the water to land.
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24-05-2014, 14:48
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#90
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 6,619
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB
The boat has now been moved successfully by barge and crane (held by a sling as will not remain stable in it's current state) to the barge dock just north of Anacortes Marina and has been hoisted out of the water to land.
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When you say it will not remain stable, I'm assuming that's because it requires a great deal of ballast that hasn't been installed yet?
I wonder why they would launch the boat if it didn't have enough ballast to even sit upright on it's own?
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