Beneteau 38

[RKsailsolo]

Yeah, previous graphic I posted does suggest that (forgot galley) but since galley is plug n play components, you can have it your way. The design spec calls for all interior components to fit thru companionway. Drag video slider to 01:22 for just the galley parts http://youtu.be/D6o2WhUQ3Kk

[Cheechako]

Plug and Play: I wonder if they meant "Heel and.... duck!"

[RKsailsolo]

LOL Cheechako, anything's possible but her hull shape resists heeling so between that and well engineered fastening design, only time that stuff flies around is in the animated 3D video.

Do you still have your cat? When the admiral circled back to this after big cat hunting at San Diego, Ft Lauderdale, Annapolis & Miami, the Oceanis 38 is right there next to the Mahe Evolution for my target boat.

[RKsailsolo]

Wonder what the hull production number is up to since the debut?

[robert sailor]

RKsailsolo...all sailboats are resistant to heeling, I think what your trying to say is that beamy boats tend to have more initial stability however because of the reduced ballast they loose some of that stability when heeled past a certain point so when sailing them, reef early and sail them much flatter than some of the earlier more traditional designs. These new designs are cool, nice to see lots of variation in the market place. Benny is following home design fashion..the "Great Room" concept.

Polux, I get a kick out of your continuation of all Benny's are based on open 60 offshore racing machines just because they mimic the wide beam run aft. The fact that other than the odd chine here and there the rest of the boat bears little resemblance to open 60 racers.

[Dale Hedtke]

Oh my. I wonder what market Beneteau is after here? I'll bet the shower compartment is huge (which I don't think is good use of a volume on a cruising boat)
This just isn't a good interior layout for long term cruising. As stated above, there aren't anywhere enough hand holds, the galley will be awkward when people want to pass by the cook, and I can't imagine there's much storage space. (doesn't look like there is much space outboard of the seats, etc.)
The "mast" (compression post) is not a handhold to count on, nor is a bar in front of the stove to hang onto while cooking something that makes sense. Cooking in a seaway involves the cook doing a lot of leaning and wedging.
IMO, the interior looks like something IKEA would offer; I don't like the bland woodwork.

[robert sailor]

I believe sailboat design for production boats has made huge changes, some good, some not so good. I think it was accepted in the past that heads were small which made them safer at sea but like housing trends and the ladies desires we now have much larger heads. Same goes with galleys, at sea you wanted a galley that would be safe so you favored a design that would hold you in place with places to brace yourself. SS guards in front of the stove with places to hook on safety straps to hold you in place. Fridges were top loaded so that when you opened the door the contents stayed in the fridge.
Grab handles were built in overhead as well as waist level, all the furniture was built using wide rounded corners,
Floors were designed to be screwed down so they could not be flying missiles in a knock down.
Boats were designed with proper sea bunks and easy attachments for lee cloths.
Storage was maxed out at the expense of more open space.
Ports and hatches were moderate in size and number and the better boats used strong cast hatches not the weaker/cheaper extruded ones used today.

Some of the smaller builders still keep many of the old fashion details in place primarily because many of their customers are planning offshore trips with them.

The new production boats are simply a mirror of todays buys wants and needs

[Kevin84]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Funnily stacks of Benny's cross oceans, so perhaps their crew hold on better then you of something ( of course it could be that your concerns are merely preconceived and perceived issues )

Dave


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I never said they don't. I said I wouldn't feel comfortable below decks on that boat. Its not heeling I'd be concerned with. You can compensate for that as once you're heeled over, as long as you stay on that tack and trim, its a fairly constant angle. What I would worry about is a wave tossing you unexpectedly. Look, hitting a corner, whether rounded or not, is going to hurt. But the sharp corners on this boat could potentially cause more than just a bruise. They look like they could cut.

And in regard to your statement that maybe other people hold on better, hold on to what? There are so few handholds down there what are you going to hold onto?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Polux]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

...
Polux, I get a kick out of your continuation of all Benny's are based on open 60 offshore racing machines just because they mimic the wide beam run aft. The fact that other than the odd chine here and there the rest of the boat bears little resemblance to open 60 racers.

Perhaps if you understood how those hulls works you would have less "Kicks".

It is not only me that say that the hulls are from the same family. The ones that
design them say the same.

[RKsailsolo]

Looks like O38 interior designers rendered well proportioned head and shower spaces to me.

http://youtu.be/NCgSOGUD72Y

[RKsailsolo]

Open 60 similarities?

Controls lead aft? Sure.
"Perhaps one of the most critical focuses is on making all of the systems adjustable from the protected cockpit. It makes the Vendée much less dangerous for the skippers and puts them near the other controls."
http://www.harken.com/article.aspx?id=15613

Canting keels? not yet
http://www.farrdesign.com/news/Sea%20Change%20P1.pdf

Spade rudders, hard chine, etc..

Beam width lead aft maximizing underbody shapes.

[robert sailor]

Just take a look at the sail areas and the depth and weight of the keels and the construction of the hulls. "All" of the new production cruising boats are beamy and continue it aft, no matter the builder... all of them. It gives them huge cockpits and lots of extra room in the aft section interiors. The "like a n open 60" is all hype and if you want to buy into it great, by the way I have a great land deal for you in Florida!

[RKsailsolo]

Huh, Buy into what? Just a few similarities added. Hard to tell where your coming from, anti Benetau bias? Already have two FL properties, so no thanks.

Back to the boats...I think the Catamaran trend continues to carve up market share so production builders mount a response to go after this growing market, i.e., Marlowe Hunter buys up Performance Cruising, immediately updates tooling to expand MC105 to the new Legacy with more similarity to FP Mahe, Leapord 39. Oceanis 38 attracted me back to monohulls with ample cockpit space and open salon design. I can actually get close to the useable size AND retain a sensation of sailing without the multihull extra cost.

[Polux]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

Just take a look at the sail areas and the depth and weight of the keels and the construction of the hulls. "All" of the new production cruising boats are beamy and continue it aft, no matter the builder... all of them. It gives them huge cockpits and lots of extra room in the aft section interiors. The "like a n open 60" is all hype and if you want to buy into it great, by the way I have a great land deal for you in Florida!

I did not talk about the keel or sail area (obviously a racer is much more powerful) I talked about the Hull and said that the Hull of the Oceanis 38 is clearly influenced by the one of solo Open racers. They are a family that go fro the Imoca boats (Open60's) passing to 40class boats to the class 950 and finishing on the mini racers. All have the same family of hulls: beamy and with all beam brought aft.

Regarding all the new production boats having the same type of hull, you are not looking well. If you look at the photos I believe you will see what I mean.

The first is the Bavaria 37, the second the Sun Odissey 379 the third is the Oceanis 38 and then a class40 and a Open 60.











Regarding beam, the Bavaria has 3.67m, the Jeanneau 379 3.76m and the Oceanis 38 3.99m

Again, first a Bavaria 37 then a Jeanneau 379 then two images of the Oceanis 38 and a Class 40.











Finally, one picture of the Oceanis 38 going hard pressed upwind in stormy conditions (the boat should have been reefed already) and another of a class 40 going upwind in less demanding conditions.

[DDabs]

Don't want to really get off-topic, but at the Miami show I looked at the new line of Salona yachts, which seemed very on par with Beneteau and Jeanneau. Keel-stepped masts mounted to a steel frame, set up for more of racing than Beneteau/Jeanneau, but really beautiful interiors as well.