Half share cat in Caribbean

[Euge]

Hello all, I've been a member now for nearly a year and have received much joy in reading all contributions from members. I am blown away by how generous so many yachties are with their time and willingness to share and help with their knowledge. I have been sailing for over 35 years and in my twenties was privileged to worked on many famous boats such as Ticonderoga and Altair. It is now time to start spending more time on the water and was wondering if anyone can recommend or would consider owning a half share of a 45 footish catamaran less than 5 years old with a total budget of around $400K US. We have owned a few yachts over the years and currently have a small share in a Fontaine Pajot Lavezzi 40 here in Sydney. My wife and I are really easy going but do have high ecxpectations related to keeping the boat clean and respectful towards other owners. In a perfect world we would love to spend 2-3 months per year in the Caribbean for the next 2-3 years and then move on to another adventure. We would love to find another couple that would consider buying a boat in partnership. Now I know how hard it is to find a perfect wife but I found one nearly 20 years ago after many auditions around the world and she ended up living around the corner! I suppose we don't have to really get on because I would not expect to be on board at the same time but I would like to think we had the same standards and mutual respect towards each other.
Look forward to any contributions .
Cheers
Euge

[ranchero76]

Welcome aboard!
Wishing you all the best! I might consider something like this in the future, except it would be bigger cat (55ft+)
Good idea I think, but I also think it won't be easy to find good partner.

[Euge]

Originally Posted by ranchero76

Welcome aboard!
Wishing you all the best! I might consider something like this in the future, except it would be bigger cat (55ft+)
Good idea I think, but I also think it won't be easy to find good partner.

Thanks Ranchero76! It did take along time to find my wife but I figure since we don't have to really spend time together all we need to have is a mutual respect for each other and I reckon it could work.
Cheers mate!

[Palarran]

Hello Euge,
Maybe this might be of interest.
http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ip-174950.html

I still have the boat available all of July in the Aegean. We will be bringing it to the Caribbean in December and then it would be available January and February.
David

[eroc]

Shared ownership has a host of complexity and many advantages. After owning and managing a 36 ft charter keelboat on the Canadian west coast for 10 years, I did a major refit and sold 3 other shares, only 1 of which was to someone I knew well. He turned out to be the best partner, always doing his share and more. There was a mechanism within the agreement to facilitate a buyout which was eventually applied to an original partner who ran the boat aground, contaminated the fuel tanks and left the rest of us to deal with the fall out. It worked as follows, partners can make a buyout offer they are willing to live with as sellers should the individual to whom the offer is made feels the price is too low. He has the option to buy the others out at that price.
We always did our own haulouts usually with all 4 partners in attendance and maintenance including engine service etc. We limited insurance coverage to $1,500 deductible for which the skipper in charge was responsible. One of the nagging issues was individuals who valued their time much more than they felt the time of others was worth and left the boat with maintenance or repair issues that had to be dealt with by the next party. You really don't want to start your trip by changing the oil, finding a place to fill empty propane bottles, empty a full holding tank or repairing the windlass.
On the upside new friendships were made as were trips with more than one partner on board where I enjoyed the luxury of taking a nap with the confidence of having a partner at the helm who knew the boat and had as much invested as ourselves. One other stipulation was that no one was allowed to encumber the boat by way of a loan against it.
Another upside was justifying the best upgrades since we were only paying 2 bits on the dollar. Some subsequent ownership transfers were made, in some cases to people I already knew and who had accompanied us on the boat prior.
A this point there are plans to circumnavigate Vancouver island with a crew change about mid way around, another advantage since it broadens the range of exploration without re-tracing the outward journey.
Good luck with your project, if it was a less pricy and shared more ways I might be interested. My wife says there is a limit to the no of sailboats I am allowed to have an interest in. Since a rebuild of a H26 for big northern lakes has just been completed something may have to go before the next project.

[Madehn]

i had a similar "buyout " arrangement with an airplane that i owned in partnership- it worked well for both of us. We did ours on a handshake - did not really know each other prior -- with something as expensive as you are looking at, i would suggest a strong written agreement including what happens if one partner dies or becomes seriously ill. The AOPA has an aircraft partnership agreement online that could be adapted to a marine environment with a little boat. Our handshake agreement also included that we always left the tanks full and the oil fresh if it was close to the changing time. we talked about major upgrades ahead of time and never had a disagreement in the 7 years we partnered. Part of our ability to get along was that i mainly wanted to fly on the weekends and he wanted to fly during the week- we only had one scheduling conflict the entire time and settled it by flipping a coin with the understanding that the loser would automatically win the next conflict.

[Palarran]

Good information Eroc. The only issue I'd have with the buyout offer is that if you have 4 partners and want to buy one out, if he feels the price is too low, he has to buy 3 other shares out. I'd rather just make it easy to have a minority partner get out all together.

The benefit of being able to go one way and a partner go the other way for return is probably one of my biggest. It gets difficult to make it long distances when you have to return the boat to a specific place.

I also don't think a lot of big boat owners know for sure how much it's going to cost to maintain the boat. We average 10% of the purchase price per year on insurance, storage, and maintenance/upgrades/refits. Then factor in the time value of money and unless your going to use the boat for over two months straight, it's cheaper to charter than own.

[Bob_a_p]

I am also based in Sydney and would you be interested in this as an alternative to a half share cat in the Carribean?

I am looking for two or three people to jointly buy a French 40-45ft French catamaran April 2018 in Europe, spend five months sailing around the Med and then the Carribean starting from about late November.

The plan is then to go through the Panama Canal (April) cross the Pacific visiting the Galapagos Islands, French Polynesia (including Bora Bora and Tahiti), the Cook Islands, Niue, Tonga, Fiji and sell the boat in October 2017 before the cyclone season. This route is known as the 'coconut milk run' and is famed for its fair winds if done at the right time of year.

I think we can buy and equip a boat for $AU 350K. and sell it quickly at the end for $A290K. Loosing $60,000.00 But if we buy well and sell well and the currencies work well we could loose a lot less.

On top of this there are living expenses, visas, flights, customs, repairs, fuel etc.

I have done something similar, both times amazing experiences. I bought, sailed and sold a boat with co-owners in 2014 in the Mediterranean and in September 2011 I bought a boat in Greece and sailed it to Fiji where I sold it a year later in October 2012.
Long term boat ownership is an expensive luxury and does not suit my life style.

As a co-owner of the boat you will be able to hop on and off at various places during the voyage with your friends and family and also reserve sole use of the boat for certain parts of the voyage. The envisaged boat would be able to accommodate ten at a push but for the longer voyages six would be a lot more comfortable.

Co-owners are not necessarily expected to have sailing experience but they do need to bring a positive spirit, keenness to learn, a belief in the project and a willingness to get your hands dirty and to co-share the work load/responsibility.


Rob

[ranchero76]

Originally Posted by Bob_a_p

I think we can buy and equip a boat for $AU 350K. and sell it quickly at the end for $A290K. Loosing $60,000.00 But if we buy well and sell well and the currencies work well we could loose a lot less.

I like your Idea! However, "sell quickly" part might be the toughest one. I'm watching market for quite long time and know, how huge might become discounts when sellers want to sell quickly. And even then, in many cases it takes long time to sell the boat. And then, there's broker's fee on top (unless you'll be extremely lucky and sell it privately).

Ideal solution, in my opinion - find partner(s), when one (or one of them) wants to keep the boat after trip is over. Then all the details can be negotiated in advance, everyone will enjoy the trip, final buyer will enjoy discount (no brokers involved!), everyone is happy!

[Bob_a_p]

Both times that I sold a Cat I got the money within 6 weeks of advertising it, its about pricing and an awful lot of luck in being in the right place at the right time. You just have to be realistic about what discount/loss you are prepared to give for a quick sale.
Rob

[sheldon957]

I have just returned from the Miami Boat show, specifically the Miami Sail section.

I am in love with the new Leopard 45' boat. This is the newest, just released model. It was sitting next to the older 48' design, and it has slightly more freeboard and bridgedeck clearance than the 48.

There is a special for a new delivered boat with many desirable options for $549k USD. I will get the owners version, with the intracoastal 62' mast most likely.

The additional options I would add here in the US initially after delivery are watermaker, dive compressor, dinghy & motor, security system, AIS, enclosure on the elevated helm.

Delivery is for September 2017 and it would be a 2018 model. Very little would be done immediately after delivery as it will be sailed up to the Annapolis boat show, and then probably for the Miami Sail show I am guessing.

I had not considered a partnership, but as we are only planning to use it about 6 months per year, it may be beneficial. My wife & I are 60 and have been married for 42 years.

PS: Non Smokers ONLY!!!! This is an absolute for me. I don't care if someone says they will "only smoke on deck". They don't get on my boat.


Leopard 45 | Leopard Catamarans US

sheldon@stonehousesupply.com

[ranchero76]

Originally Posted by Bob_a_p

its about pricing and an awful lot of luck in being in the right place at the right time.

Lucky you, what could I say? And next buyer probably was happy too, getting good deal.

[Privleoplag]

Originally Posted by Madehn

i had a similar "buyout " arrangement with an airplane that i owned in partnership- it worked well for both of us. We did ours on a handshake - did not really know each other prior -- with something as expensive as you are looking at, i would suggest a strong written agreement including what happens if one partner dies or becomes seriously ill. The AOPA has an aircraft partnership agreement online that could be adapted to a marine environment with a little boat. Our handshake agreement also included that we always left the tanks full and the oil fresh if it was close to the changing time. we talked about major upgrades ahead of time and never had a disagreement in the 7 years we partnered. Part of our ability to get along was that i mainly wanted to fly on the weekends and he wanted to fly during the week- we only had one scheduling conflict the entire time and settled it by flipping a coin with the understanding that the loser would automatically win the next conflict.

I thought only folks from North Dakota still did business this way.

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Euge.

[Iaangus]

Euge, I could be very interested in your partnership Idea, this is something I have been thinking about for a few years. I believe the right type of partnership could work with the right people involved. I also think I am the type of person you are looking for in a partner. I'm going to send you a PM (private message) maybe we can discuss some details. IaAngus