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Old 01-04-2017, 11:51   #1
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Location: Alamosa, Colorado
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Significant trailer challenge...

Had a sailfish and a sailboard in years past. Needing 2-3 years of experience on a medium sized boat before going liveaboard at 40+ feet. Landlubbing life has insane property taxes...for one thing. Been off and on at "another board" for years.

Got the best deal and the worst deal at auction. The prize is a 1979 S2 with Yanmar diesel and original owner. Good bones but needs some work. A boat trailer was included, without photo, and I figured the trailer fit the boat. It does not.

The 26' S2 has a 4' draft and now weighs ~5700 pounds at dock. Bottom may have a "hundred pounds" of freshwater algae though. The EZ-Loader trailer is in good shape and rated for far more than the boats weight. It includes surge brakes, bearing buddies, and a 12' extended tongue. The problem is that it is not designed for a 4' draft.

The trailer relies on eight 1/2" x 6" x 21" steel plates and 64 rubber rollers to support the boat. Replacing the steel plates with 48" length costs about $1000 with shipping. Then some welding... Plus the return round trip to California from Colorado is close to $3000 all things considered. Plus you have the boat pull out and various other unexpected items. Getting out of hand.

Goal is to get the boat back to Colorado, a 1250 mile trip. Work on it for awhile then get an affordable slip in the Sea of Cortez. I'm a scuba driver so saltwater is where it is at. Even with the extended tongue, the 4' draft is not something that I want to launch very often.

Trying to figure some alternatives...other than cut and run.

Have two decent trucks so pulling is not the problem. With seven trailers and a few hundred hauls, I have learned a few things here and there.

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Old 01-04-2017, 12:36   #2
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

I bought a Catalina 22 with a fixed keel on Coronado Island Ca. a couple of years ago. I picked up a bass boat trailer for $150 in Az. and drove to San Diego with steel and my welder. It took most of the day and lots of backing the truck in and out to get it resting correctly on the trailer but we pulled it off in the end. I used 2x4's and a screw gun to build a temporary cradle because it was fast and easy to adjust. Once I got it sitting right I pulled it up in to the parking lot and welded 3-2"x4" .250 wall uprights on each side with a angle iron bracket bolted to the top. I then lag bolted the bracket to a doug fir 2x6 wrapped in outdoor carpet. By allowing the boat to rest on the board before I screwed it together it formed to the hull and made a nice bunk.
It had been sitting on a mooring untouched for about 18 months so it had growth hanging down lower than the bottom of the keel. It was hard work and garnered some weird looks from people passing the boat ramp but we made it back to Phoenix. All told I only missed 1 day of work. Left Phoenix Wed. evening. Showed up at the Marina 8am Thurs morning and was back on the road home after a quick dinner by 8pm.
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Old 01-04-2017, 12:48   #3
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

In many cases trailers with long boards for support rather than rollers are superior anyway. Is there a way you can add/modify so you have a some vertical channel iron or heavy angle iron bolted to the existing uprights that support long wood planks for longitudinal support on the hull? Pics would help a lot for sure. The sailboat should sit on the keel on the trailer, the supports are for stability not holding the weight.
Will the trailer configuration do this?
Another option is to buy (marine yard junk pile) an old wood cradle, or make one that sits on the trailer frame/ bottom. Bolt the lumber together, don't just screw it. use heavy stuff 4 x ?, use diagonals to support the upright members or even plywood gussets.
Typical longitudinal supports shown here. You need taller of course and probably only need one per side. They flex and self fit to the hull curve.
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Old 01-04-2017, 16:57   #4
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Yes.....nice work! Just not seeing how I could do this without being a welder myself. A very good welder at that. 26' boats may weigh almost twice as much as 22' boats? Though 26' may open up some more blue water opportunities... Pros and cons to all sailboat designs?


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Originally Posted by Oc1 View Post
I bought a Catalina 22 with a fixed keel on Coronado Island Ca. a couple of years ago. I picked up a bass boat trailer for $150 in Az. and drove to San Diego with steel and my welder. It took most of the day and lots of backing the truck in and out to get it resting correctly on the trailer but we pulled it off in the end. I used 2x4's and a screw gun to build a temporary cradle because it was fast and easy to adjust. Once I got it sitting right I pulled it up in to the parking lot and welded 3-2"x4" .250 wall uprights on each side with a angle iron bracket bolted to the top. I then lag bolted the bracket to a doug fir 2x6 wrapped in outdoor carpet. By allowing the boat to rest on the board before I screwed it together it formed to the hull and made a nice bunk.
It had been sitting on a mooring untouched for about 18 months so it had growth hanging down lower than the bottom of the keel. It was hard work and garnered some weird looks from people passing the boat ramp but we made it back to Phoenix. All told I only missed 1 day of work. Left Phoenix Wed. evening. Showed up at the Marina 8am Thurs morning and was back on the road home after a quick dinner by 8pm.
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Old 01-04-2017, 17:22   #5
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Yes.....supporting the weight with the keel seems quite logical. Looking at my EZ-Loader, that doesn't appear to be their intention. The original buyer had a 27' swing keel that the trailer would be ideal for.

Fabbing a wood structure is a very interesting idea. Would take me significant time due to being a borderline perfectionist. Building it in a strangers lot may also present "challenges". Then you have the California lodging bill. It all adds up quickly.

With steel plates, I could get the boat on the hard and only have to drill numerous 1/2" bolt holes with cobalt drills. Have a lot of grade 8 bolts and nuts etc. Pretty comfortable with that concept. Still hoping that I can find some salvage level steel plates if I look hard enough.

Channel irons or stout angle iron would certainly work if the conditions are always good. The 4' draft and poor western highways are a concern. Then we have the texting drivers and assorted others....

Have heard that the TapaTalk app smartphone app is good for uploading images. I use laptops and am asked for a http:// address when trying to upload images.

Some great ideas! Thanks!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
In many cases trailers with long boards for support rather than rollers are superior anyway. Is there a way you can add/modify so you have a some vertical channel iron or heavy angle iron bolted to the existing uprights that support long wood planks for longitudinal support on the hull? Pics would help a lot for sure. The sailboat should sit on the keel on the trailer, the supports are for stability not holding the weight.
Will the trailer configuration do this?
Another option is to buy (marine yard junk pile) an old wood cradle, or make one that sits on the trailer frame/ bottom. Bolt the lumber together, don't just screw it. use heavy stuff 4 x ?, use diagonals to support the upright members or even plywood gussets.
Typical longitudinal supports shown here. You need taller of course and probably only need one per side. They flex and self fit to the hull curve.
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Old 02-04-2017, 04:51   #6
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, softdown.
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Old 02-04-2017, 06:09   #7
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Thank you, hopefully I may post more often now.

My response to Cheekako disappeared for mod review....and never returned.


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Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, softdown.
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Old 02-04-2017, 06:27   #8
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

You definitely need a cradle, and ideally, for that length trip, it should be mostly metal and welded. If you design, cut the parts and clean and prep them for welding, hiring a welder to put it together might be affordable. The welds don't have to be pretty. One option is to just weld metal uprights and diagonal braces for them and the rest out of wood, bolted to the uprights. Most yards will let you hang your boat in the slings over the weekend for work for a modest fee, and could position your boat on the trailer and you could finish the wood part of the cradle around it. On Monday they lower it fully and you block the keel to get the best fit.

You can probably sell the roller assemblies on Craig's list to recoup part of your cost.

I believe but am not certain you're going to want the keel, and most of the boat's weight, resting on an adequate plate/support on the trailer. You need to find out what gives the load the most stability.
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Old 02-04-2017, 06:43   #9
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Having the keel support much of the boats weight makes sense to me. Having spent time looking at various sailboat trailers, that would seem to be the exception.

Variations of this design have been the norm....in my viewings: 1986 Catalina 25 sailboat with 2007 Rocket aluminum trailer | eBay

This trailer offers more support over a larger area than most others in my limited experience. Interesting design allowing the keel to hover several inches from the road. Not the only one to do that.

I believe that a typical 4' draft would mean approx. a 2' keel..... The boat originally had a shoal draft keel with a 2' 6" draft......so a very small 6" keel per my "figurings". Some S2 shoal draft keels wish they had more substance in their keel.


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Originally Posted by Suijin View Post
You definitely need a cradle, and ideally, for that length trip, it should be mostly metal and welded. If you design, cut the parts and clean and prep them for welding, hiring a welder to put it together might be affordable. The welds don't have to be pretty. One option is to just weld metal uprights and diagonal braces for them and the rest out of wood, bolted to the uprights. Most yards will let you hang your boat in the slings over the weekend for work for a modest fee, and could position your boat on the trailer and you could finish the wood part of the cradle around it. On Monday they lower it fully and you block the keel to get the best fit.

You can probably sell the roller assemblies on Craig's list to recoup part of your cost.

I believe but am not certain you're going to want the keel, and most of the boat's weight, resting on an adequate plate/support on the trailer. You need to find out what gives the load the most stability.
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Old 02-04-2017, 07:48   #10
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Hi guys, had a similar problem on picking up a boat and trailer in Texas. My problem was not the bed as much as the brakes. The seller sold me a trailer with the brake lines cut and the surge system disbanded. Anyone got experience with replacement of surge brakes with electric which I am reading seem superior and less apt to go haywire? It's a dual axle carrying a Cal 2-27. Thanks in advance for all thoughts here.
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Old 02-04-2017, 07:55   #11
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

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Hi guys, had a similar problem on picking up a boat and trailer in Texas. My problem was not the bed as much as the brakes. The seller sold me a trailer with the brake lines cut and the surge system disbanded. Anyone got experience with replacement of surge brakes with electric which I am reading seem superior and less apt to go haywire? It's a dual axle carrying a Cal 2-27. Thanks in advance for all thoughts here.
Depending on your axles its pretty easy. Go to a local trailer supply. In Phoenix I use Auto Safety House but every city has something. Take in your axle model number and they should be able to give you a new hub assemble. You just pull the hubs off the existing axle, grease, and put on the new hub assemble. Other than that you just need to run 2 wires per side up to your electrical plug. You should also have a brake controller in the tow rig.
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Old 02-04-2017, 08:21   #12
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FriscoKid View Post
Hi guys, had a similar problem on picking up a boat and trailer in Texas. My problem was not the bed as much as the brakes. The seller sold me a trailer with the brake lines cut and the surge system disbanded. Anyone got experience with replacement of surge brakes with electric which I am reading seem superior and less apt to go haywire? It's a dual axle carrying a Cal 2-27. Thanks in advance for all thoughts here.
Yes beware of old trailers, many of them the brakes are shot or corroded, wheel bearings also should cleaned and packed for a long trip. The master cylinder on the hitch portion of a surge setup is often bad, empty or has water inside.
Replacement bolt on brake assemblies are readily available for each axle. You can probably live with a good surge setup on C27...If you are towing with a big stout truck, you're reaching the limit though. If not surge, then you need to get into controllers etc in the cab...
RV outfitting and supply places have this stuff.
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Old 02-04-2017, 09:35   #13
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Still here. My attempts at posting simply vanish....

EDIT: Except this one. Bit of a mystery...
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Old 02-04-2017, 09:40   #14
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Surge brakes are fine when working properly. Wondering why the lines got cut.

Replacement is easy enough....for a mechanic. Brake guys can probably do the job with their eyes closed. Not convinced that most people should install their own brake systems.

Electric would require a brake controller inside the vehicle and seven pin trailer connectors...for starts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by FriscoKid View Post
Hi guys, had a similar problem on picking up a boat and trailer in Texas. My problem was not the bed as much as the brakes. The seller sold me a trailer with the brake lines cut and the surge system disbanded. Anyone got experience with replacement of surge brakes with electric which I am reading seem superior and less apt to go haywire? It's a dual axle carrying a Cal 2-27. Thanks in advance for all thoughts here.
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Old 02-04-2017, 18:05   #15
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Re: Significant trailer challenge...

Interesting that the San Fran area offers no sailboat cradles on craigslist. Bit of a disappointment there. Three days of efforts....very little progress to date.
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