In search of perfect expedition boat

[ranchero76]

Yes, expedition boat. Not cruising, not racing. The difference? It must have place for toys/equipment, and also must have real workshop, to be able to do repairs/maintenance of them, as well as boat itself.
I became addicted to catamarans and been watching big cats market closely for over the year now. Lately I looked at some monohulls for sale, for comparison.
What amazed me - how much more some of them offer, in terms of "must have" features for me. Like this 75ft boat. By the way, this video - by far best boat video presentation, and I've seen hundreds of them.
Been quite old (1982), this boat had couple major refits, and while interior looks a little dated, it's very functional. Lots of space, lots of nice features. But what really amazes me - huge engine room, which doubles as nice workshop!
Now, one would think that 60ft catamaran should have more space and features than 75ft monohull. By comparing this boat to 60ft catamarans I've seen on the market during last 12 months, I wouldn't say so. Yes, Lagoon 620 has tremendous amount of space, but most of it taken by countless heads and other useless (for me) features. Buying 900K boat and doing major refit sounds like crazy idea. Custom built cats of this size are scarce, most of them have cramped space in hulls, forget about big engine rooms and workshop. And asking price is often close to the price of 2013 Lagoon 620, it will take years for sellers to realize that their boats not worth nearly that much. Same applies to older production cats.
There are couple nice (and also expensive) custom aluminum catamarans on the market, each of them has its own good points, but both have quite cramped space in hulls, no workshop.
It's hard to believe that in a few decades nobody created real expedition catamaran. I'd love (at least) to see such catamaran, as proof they are exist indeed . Anyone?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QkBTAzc8q4

[Scot McPherson]

What you are looking for would be a one off or a refit....there is no where near enough demand for a production boat to be made with your needs.


Some people who want such specific needs end up having a boat designed and built for them. THAT is not so unusual, but it's not so common for a builder to started building inventory.

[mikereed100]

Just about any cat should be able to fulfill your criteria, but you will have to either have to modify a production boat or build yourself. When I rebuilt our boat I was going under the premise that the boat would be more of a 'workboat' than a marina queen. With that in mind the forward port hull is taken up completely by a workshop, fully stocked with tools and materials. It would not be too difficult to remove the forward head and bunk from any production cat and replace it with a workbench.

We spent very little time on the exterior cosmetics, knowing that we would be visited by pangas, comoros, bankas, longtails, dugouts, canoes, military and coast guard vessels, all of whom would have little regard for a mirror finish on our topsides. This has paid off well as, after several years of cruising, our topsides are scuffed, scratched, dented and repaired, none of which causes me any concern.

[Scot McPherson]

There is definitely something to be said for a boat finished out as a working boat. It's a whole lot less work to maintain and a whole lot less to get stressed over.

[Palarran]

I'm curious what you would use a workshop for on a catamaran.

Of all the cat's I've seen, none would meet what your describing. To me, the biggest factor with an "Expedition" boat is going to be the ability to handle serious cold for long periods of time, and carrying a tender that can be used to explore remote areas. Rock solid construction for course would be necessary. The only manufacturer that I've seen that could build something very close to that is St. Francis.

What about a Nordhavn?

[barnakiel]

So what about that "Garcia" thing?

They have not build one or what?

http://www.garcia-yachting.com/yachting.php?type=oneoff

b.

[UNCIVILIZED]

Assuming that by "Expedition" you mean high latitude capable, among other things, there are a couple of steep challenges for a multihull to meet.
- Being stout enough to withstand the continually being knocked into things. Unforgiving things, like rocks, pilings, & steel commercial vessels.
- Being able to manuever during, & despite the extreme winds in such regions. As even heavy, keeled boats find this to be quite a challenge. This, with a bunch of tons of metal underneath of them, slowing the wind's pushing them around a bit.
So for something with an areal density of less than Styrofoam, there will be problems. Semi-steerable jaccuzi drives maybe? Or that & bow thrusters.

It's definitely worth watching Skip Novak's videos on his boats, & also what it's like operating in those kinds of areas. And yes, I'm supremely jealous of his winch & shop area!!!

BTW, I'm uncertain as to who built it, but one of Kurt Hughes's 36' cats was built in aluminum. And he seems to do a lot of mod's & conversions on his designs, as well as on lots of others. So if you're serious, it'd be worth talking to him.

Another option might be to beef up a production cat. Say some extra exterior laminate from above the WL on down. Some extra stringers & ring frames. And or, built from the start with Airex or Corecell, of much thicker dimensions, & higher modulus than a standard boat. Kind of like was done with the Santa Cruz 52 that did the solo RTW race. She had enhanced coring, more structure, a smaller cockpit, stiffer mast, etc.
And you could easily add aluminum diamond plate patches anywhere on her topsides prone to dock rash. Ditto on "aftermarket" metal capped rubrails.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oFu...r_embedded#t=0

[ranchero76]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

Assuming that by "Expedition" you mean high latitude capable

Not so much. Let's call it "tropical expedition" High latitudes - totally different story.

[ranchero76]

Originally Posted by Palarran

I'm curious what you would use a workshop for on a catamaran.
Of all the cat's I've seen, none would meet what your describing. To me, the biggest factor with an "Expedition" boat is going to be the ability to handle serious cold for long periods of time, and carrying a tender that can be used to explore remote areas. Rock solid construction for course would be necessary. The only manufacturer that I've seen that could build something very close to that is St. Francis.

What about a Nordhavn?

Not thinking about cold climate, but more for remote areas. Where no parts or service available. Like exploring Amazon, for example. I know I wouldn't really need sails for that, but it's only one example, there are other places where sails would be needed. So I must be able to do pretty much full service, repair and basic fabrication, not just boat maintenance, but equipment repair and maintenance as well. I know it sounds like I'm asking to much, but hey - that 75ft monohull in OP pretty much meets my criteria (and it's tough boat too, and even has very nice interior!). It's just that I like catamaran's stability, ability to mount big solar array on it, ability to beach it if needed, shallow draft (most modern catamarans don't look good at this, though).

St. Francis 50 is good boat, but still has no workshop or place to store equipment. They sure could build custom one, but that would be way out of my budget.

[ranchero76]

Originally Posted by barnakiel

So what about that "Garcia" thing?

They have not build one or what?

http://www.garcia-yachting.com/yachting.php?type=oneoff

b.

I never seen any catamaran of this brand for sale, will study their web site.
Currently building of new boat is not an option for me, for simple financial reasons. This might change, but for now it's more "find something used as close as possible to what I need and modify the rest".

[ranchero76]

Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED

It's definitely worth watching Skip Novak's videos on his boats, & also what it's like operating in those kinds of areas. And yes, I'm supremely jealous of his winch & shop area!!!

These boats are incredible! I'd love to have such boat in catamaran form (not steel, though ), with huge solar array on top! Just have strong feeling that buying some used catamaran and converting it to something like that would be way over my budget.

[Palarran]

I don't know a lot about the other manufactures but maybe look at a Marquises. There are two listed on yachtworld for about 5 years now. I know they are in rough shape - probably very rough. But that may work for you.

Buy one for $200k, put another $200k into it, and you will have pretty much an excellent ship for what your talking about. Ask Yeloya, I think he would agree.

I think about this all the time - It's a curse isn't it. At this point, I'd have to spend about $1 to $1.5 million to get a customized new cat. Or, for another $100k I could pretty much do to Palarran what your talking about. The interior volume is - BIG btw.

[downunder]

You need a custom build.

Plenty of catamaran designers who have done custom vessels. Have been several Malcolm Tennant vessels including Domino which is for sale.

Here is another by Dereck Kelsall.

Advance Marine Catamaran For Sale | Ensign Ship Brokers

[Suijin]

Originally Posted by ranchero76

Not thinking about cold climate, but more for remote areas. Where no parts or service available. Like exploring Amazon, for example. I know I wouldn't really need sails for that, but it's only one example, there are other places where sails would be needed. So I must be able to do pretty much full service, repair and basic fabrication, not just boat maintenance, but equipment repair and maintenance as well. I know it sounds like I'm asking to much, but hey - that 75ft monohull in OP pretty much meets my criteria (and it's tough boat too, and even has very nice interior!). It's just that I like catamaran's stability, ability to mount big solar array on it, ability to beach it if needed, shallow draft (most modern catamarans don't look good at this, though).

St. Francis 50 is good boat, but still has no workshop or place to store equipment. They sure could build custom one, but that would be way out of my budget.

I'm kinda getting the impression that you're fantasizing about this, watching a lot of boat videos, and don't really have much practical experience at all to frame up your requirements.

An expedition boat is a boat with simple, easily serviced systems, that is low maintenance, with capacities and features to support operation in remote areas.

That Little Harbor is NOT that boat. It's an inflated New England cruising boat. I get the sense from watching that video that the owner is selling after 8 years because of the sheer cost of owning and operating the boat. It must be monumental.

You can take any four cabin catamaran and turn one of the cabins into a workshop. DONE. It's not hard, a little cabinetry. Any space can be a workshop. Are you honestly complaining that no one has installed a workbench and vise for you already?

The St. Francis 50 would in fact be a good candidate. It's a pretty low frills cat, is pretty quick, and systems are straightforward. I delivered one and in fact thought it would make a good long range cruising boat with the right equipment.

[neilpride]

Originally Posted by Suijin

I'm kinda getting the impression that you're fantasizing about this, watching a lot of boat videos, and don't really have much practical experience at all to frame up your requirements.

An expedition boat is a boat with simple, easily serviced systems, that is low maintenance, with capacities and features to support operation in remote areas.

That Little Harbor is NOT that boat. It's an inflated New England cruising boat. I get the sense from watching that video that the owner is selling after 8 years because of the sheer cost of owning and operating the boat. It must be monumental.

You can take any four cabin catamaran and turn one of the cabins into a workshop. DONE. It's not hard, a little cabinetry. Any space can be a workshop. Are you honestly complaining that no one has installed a workbench and vise for you already?

The St. Francis 50 would in fact be a good candidate. It's a pretty low frills cat, is pretty quick, and systems are straightforward. I delivered one and in fact thought it would make a good long range cruising boat with the right equipment.

Define expedition boat, my old CSY have simple reliable systems , easy to fix in any remote place with basic tools and few spares, and is not, by any mean a expedition boat, not even the litle harbour or the st Francis..

Ice, rough weather, remote locations, wind seas and all the mother nature can throw to you,, for that purpose there is a bunch of boats called expedition boats...