Production boat steel frame.

[daletournier]

I was reading that the Salona 44 has a stainless steel frame laminated into the hull that the keel bolts go through and the rigging attachs to. This seems like a very strong build. I figure that with inspection being hard on modern boats due to liners a very strong structure such as this is a good thing?
Does anyone know of other production boats that have or use a similar system? Another CF contributor did put me onto Grand Soliel which also have this arrangement or similar, not sure which year they started using this method.
Any comments good or bad welcome.

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[UNCIVILIZED]

Aluminum space frames laminated into a boat's hull structure were pretty common in racing boats in the 80's. And so long as they're pretty beefy, & kept fairly dry, they hold up well. The keeping dry part being critical, as if they got wet & started to fizz, then their structural properties would degrade. And there's no practical way to rebuild them.

Cal 40's & a few other Cal's used steel beams underneath of their main bulkheads as their primary mast supports. But unfortunately the builders substituted galvanized mild steel for the stainless called for in the plans. And over time the beams got eaten by corrosion. Causing owners to replace them with stainless ones, after extensive furniture & liner removal, & subsequent reinstallation. Attached is one example, & you can also likely find some via www.Cal40.com This is the process on a Cal29 Wilkie's Sailboat Page

I'd imagine stainless to fair much better. Though if desired, it should be possible to get some Non-Destructive Testing done on a perspective vessel in order to ascertain the health of the beam. I've got a few links somewhere if needed. But a search for NDT Forums will turn up quite a few, & also do some looking over at www.BoatDesign.net/forums/ , where I posed a similar question a few years ago.

[Eleuthera 2014]

Our former Bavaria 46 "Exclusive" had the alu framework. Not surprizing as the designers were J & J, the same as Grand Soleil.

[double u]

X-yachts from denmark have a galvanized steel frame
saw a Salona-frame this March at the boatshow - looked indestructible
IF you manage to damage it it will be much more difficult to repair than a grp-grid...

[Scaramanga F25]

"Morgan One Ton" in the 70's was a 36 footer. Steel reinforcement for the keel.

[ihe2]

Most of the S&S designed Nautor Swans do have these massive steel grids as standard.


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[UNCIVILIZED]

A good percentage of production bilge keel boats have metal structural bits glassed into the hull to take the loads from the keels. Since the leads aren't on centerline as they'd be in a more typical boat.

And I've even seen a few advertised as having bronze framing for such. Which isn't far fetched really, as plenty of traditional boats have bronze keel floors, or keel reinforcing. Where in other boats they're glass or composite.

But on any boat of such nature, it pays to get the structure surveyed by someone very familiar with them. Who's got good references.

[daletournier]

Thanks guys, I was thinking in terms of the more modern production boats, say 2000 onwards. Galvanized frames worry me even if they are properly glasses in. Water always find away etc. The salona chasis made of stainless just seems a quality idea.

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[double u]

Originally Posted by daletournier

...Galvanized frames worry me even if they are properly glasses in. Water always find away etc. ...

my sentiments entirely!

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by daletournier

(...)

Galvanized frames worry me even if they are properly glasses in. Water always find away etc. The salona chasis made of stainless just seems a quality idea.

(...)

Stainless corrodes very fast given right conditions.

If a frame is properly glassed in, there is no worry about corrosion, no matter what materials you use.

In boat building a lot is up to craftmanship, experience and continuity of production. Some yards have been in the business for 'ages' others pop up and disappear.

I cannot see where a frame gives a boat any advantage. It is just one of many ways boats are built today.

The same applies to SS vs. galvanized. Just two options and builders will use what they have available / what the client pays for / etc.

Since it has been around for a time (since at least 60'ies, I think) the method is valid. And the actual result is up to execution by a specific boatyard.

b.

[Dansailv]

Steel frames are surely very good ways of properly fixing the keel.

An interesting boat with this sort of frame is (our) ridas 35. Only in this boat the frame and bolts are of a more serious size. It's a racer cruiser (built from 96 to 06, but I believe they will still custom build one for you.)

I believe the newer ridasses also have this solid construction. The rest of the hull is also very well built. The ridasses vonsistently outrun similar x-yachts when it comes to speed.It may be worth it to check the brand.

Many other keel designs are far less stiff and sometimes even very weak ( check some bavarua match boats and some beneteaus).

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Dansailv.