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Old 08-10-2013, 17:10   #31
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

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Originally Posted by atoll View Post

funny thing is ......... if i mention "I am turning off the internet!",they hear me instantly,even when wearing headphones



The new trick is first thing in the AM you reset the wifi password to something new, every day. They get the day's password when their chores and homework are done, and not before.
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Old 08-10-2013, 17:18   #32
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

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The new trick is first thing in the AM you reset the wifi password to something new, every day. They get the day's password when their chores and homework are done, and not before.
I remember those days, but what I didn't remember often times was the new password.
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Old 08-10-2013, 17:40   #33
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

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The new trick is first thing in the AM you reset the wifi password to something new, every day. They get the day's password when their chores and homework are done, and not before.

That's brilliant.
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Old 08-10-2013, 17:42   #34
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

I think to eliminate most yelling on cruising boats is to learn to anchor using only hand signals. The person on the bow is in charge and the hand signals have been worked out in advance. The only reason to use your voice is if there is a hazard that one or the other doesnt see. I once watched a Cheoy Lee Off Shore 40 come into an anchorage, and let out the hook and start backing down. It seemed like he was letting much too much scope out, but by keeping tension on the rode as he let it out, they managed to back the boat straight as an arrow. That is a real feat in a long keeled boat. The wife then let the stern hook go, and the man on the foredeck took in rode until they were perfectly set with a bow and stern hook. Not a word spoken. Turned out he was a retired Navy Commander, and one hell of a seaman. Less talk and more clear signals work wonders._____Grant.
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Old 08-10-2013, 17:55   #35
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I think to eliminate most yelling on cruising boats is to learn to anchor using only hand signals. The person on the bow is in charge and the hand signals have been worked out in advance. The only reason to use your voice is if there is a hazard that one or the other doesnt see. I once watched a Cheoy Lee Off Shore 40 come into an anchorage, and let out the hook and start backing down. It seemed like he was letting much too much scope out, but by keeping tension on the rode as he let it out, they managed to back the boat straight as an arrow. That is a real feat in a long keeled boat. The wife then let the stern hook go, and the man on the foredeck took in rode until they were perfectly set with a bow and stern hook. Not a word spoken. Turned out he was a retired Navy Commander, and one hell of a seaman. Less talk and more clear signals work wonders._____Grant.
+1 keep 'em simple.
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Old 08-10-2013, 18:10   #36
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

From what I've noticed, there seems to be almost no yelling aboard vessels where the woman drives and the man handles the anchor or dock lines.

Still, I'm thinking about getting something like those "Marriage Saver" headsets simply because all the hand signals in the world don't help when my wife - ensconced behind the dodger WAYyyyyy back there - wants to relay something to me up on the prow.

We haven't docked in three years so I guess it'll be a re-learning experience next time we need fuel.

Edit: Should have noted that she normally just brings the boat around when unhappy about something. Or a short toot on the horn lets me know she thinks something is amiss.
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Old 08-10-2013, 18:34   #37
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

I consider myself a very lucky guy .... I have a wife who not only puts up with me and my many foibles but is totally involved in boat maintenance and sailing. We share a true partnership.

That's not to say that we each do every job on the boat. That's because she is flat out brilliant at some stuff that I'm not good at and I do some things that she's not so keen on tackling (but could if it came down to it).

We're on the hard at the moment and my wife is in her element organising contractors, sourcing parts, pushing things along in the most efficient way possible to keep our time on the hard as short as possible. We both wet sanded the antifoul and she painted the new antifoul on while I polished the topsides from scaffolding (she's not so keen on heights). We're both learning about the boat and looking after her together. We play to our strengths by dividing the work according to who can git'erdone best.

Once we're in the water again we minimise the need for shouting by running through how we're going to handle any docking or anchoring beforehand, complete with what we expect the boat to do due to wind and tide, who needs to do what and when and what we might need to do if something gets a bit pear-shaped. Afterward we'll go over things and think about what went well and what didn't and how we can do it better next time. That doesn't mean we get it right each and every time but we try to learn from each attempt and keep improving.

My wife is fabulous and I couldn't wish for a better person to go sailing with or to share my life with. She doesn't know everything there is to know about boats ... but then, neither do I and we're having a heap of fun finding out together.
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Old 08-10-2013, 18:47   #38
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

Angry yelling is just plain ugly!

When I hear someone yelling at their crew or significant other while docking or anchoring, I always wonder what it would be like to sail with that person under more strenuous circumstances...
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Old 08-10-2013, 18:49   #39
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

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The new trick is first thing in the AM you reset the wifi password to something new, every day. They get the day's password when their chores and homework are done, and not before.
cruel! i like it
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Old 08-10-2013, 18:51   #40
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I believe there needs to be clear distinction and communication style between "sailing partners" vs "life partners". I think the two can function and are quite healthy, so long as it is understood by both that these are very different power dynamics, understood by all the "when" and "why" this needs to be.

My wife and I have had terse moments and stern words, sometimes yelling. But at no time disparaging or hurtful (unless having a non sailing related relationship dispute that has spiralled out of control). It has occurred once where the two sailing/relationship dispute coincided and thought this an important story to share.

We are both from different native language backgrounds (Australian and German) so communication is often not natural and extra explanation is needed. I have sailed since age 10, on and off for 32 years and my wife born in a landlocked city only a recent developing master of the wind. Despite long experience, I admit I am no sailing expert and have much to learn myself.

We were heading back out of the protection of a bay under motor and the wind was not pleasant, causing a nasty chop and funnelling into the bay. Once we hit the full force, I realised the wind and swell was far stronger than anticipated and could see some gear on deck shifting as it was not quite stowed as well as it should be in these conditions. I asked my wife to take the helm, but she refused since we had just been having an argument. In any case I popped the throttle in neutral, and walk up to the bow to secure the gear. Of course this blew us quickly off course and brought us beam-to the swell and wind, causing us to dangerously pitch, roll and yaw. I sliced my foot on a deck fitting, was not happy and swore black and blue. I was not proud of myself nor the situation.

As any leader or manager (whether man or woman) it is vitally important that there is a single point of command, particularly in the event of an urgent or imminent emergency situation. Think Emergency Medical Triage, Piloting Aircraft, Skydiving, or Rock climbing. Experience, Knowledge, Preparation, Procedure, and Control are vitally important. These aspects are also vital when sailing, particularly when weather conditions are not ideal.

A modern relationship (between man and woman, or same sex) is more based on equity sharing of power. This is where when sailing as a couple, the lines of leadership and management can become blurred and issues arise.

A few times when sailing I had to raise my voice with my wife, only because instructions were not followed, as she saw it that she knew better. This is OK in the normal relationship situation, my wife can do what she sees fit at any time although I may not agree. In safety of our home, we can discuss or argue within reason as we like. This is how healthy relationships evolve.

However in sailing, where there is potential disaster when deviating from instruction (close quarters, wind gusts, etc); deviation or self determination in face of command is not prudent. Normally in these situations I have loudly reiterated the instructions and declared their importance. Then afterwards when out of danger, calmly explained the whys and wherefores of the instructions and the reason for them, potential danger, etc.

I love my wife, she is a very intelligent woman and very talented in her ability to learn sailing. I admire that she analyses and questions everything and understand this is the key to successful learning. However sometimes it is also important to act and not question, when the stakes are high. It is also then important to analyse and discuss later, when more prudent.

We have discussed the reasons and mechanics behind this sailing "command and control" dynamic and both agree, though sometimes the "relationship dynamic" overpowers that of the sailing one. It is Important that all sailing couples have this conversation, both honestly explore and understand the different power dynamics at play. I have learned that a firm, clear, measured statement is more effective than a blustered, frustrated, yelled one.
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Old 08-10-2013, 19:24   #41
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

Well, another example of why I love my wife... working on the boat today I locked myself out of the car. This was fairly important because my lunch and my laptop was in there. If I had to do "real" work I would have been SOL. Luckily, I asked my wife nicely and she left work in the middle of the day, told the office "I'm leaving" and drove almost 2 hours to get me in the car. Then, still clad i her office clothes... proceeded to replace the glass in a porthole.

Awesome
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Old 08-10-2013, 20:37   #42
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

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Originally Posted by svmariane View Post
From what I've noticed, there seems to be almost no yelling aboard vessels where the woman drives and the man handles the anchor or dock lines.

Still, I'm thinking about getting something like those "Marriage Saver" headsets simply because all the hand signals in the world don't help when my wife - ensconced behind the dodger WAYyyyyy back there - wants to relay something to me up on the prow.

We haven't docked in three years so I guess it'll be a re-learning experience next time we need fuel.

Edit: Should have noted that she normally just brings the boat around when unhappy about something. Or a short toot on the horn lets me know she thinks something is amiss.

I have heard (haven't tried them) that the headsets do not work well if there's a fair amount of wind, which might be exactly when you need to communicate best. I've never been on a boat where anyone, male or female, yelled at anyone -- either over docking or anchoring. As for men doing the lines -- no one ties up my boat but me. Sometimes I'm polite and let someone on the dock "help" but I always end up having to redo it when he's out of sight. It's not that I know more than anyone else, but I know a lot more about my boat than a stranger will.
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Old 08-10-2013, 20:39   #43
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

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I consider myself a very lucky guy .... I have a wife who not only puts up with me and my many foibles but is totally involved in boat maintenance and sailing. We share a true partnership..."
That's really terrific. And, two heads really are better than one when you're evaluating tide, current, and how to park 15,000 or more lb. of boat with no brakes ...
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Old 08-10-2013, 21:12   #44
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

The tooting the horn to get the foredecks attention reminds me of being mate on an 86 foot motor yacht. both the Captain and I were experianced cruisers. After about the third anchorage we worked out a system were he decided where to drop anchors and from that point on I on the foredeck controlled all of the manuvering to get the 2, 300 lb anchors and tons of chain placed in a correct position. Never a word spoken. All hand signals. When the Captain was on vacation during the hurricane season, I had to move the boat because of an impending storm. I borrowed two cruisers (both RTW cruisers) to run the foredeck. pulling hooks worked out fine , but the move to another anchorage and getting the hooks down in the proper place didnt go well. they were so busy BSing that they never looked up to the bridge and when I wanted to anchor, they were joking away without hearing me. I finally blew the horn and watched them jump out of their shoes. They paid attention after that. This was my mistake in not making it clear what was expected and how much responsibility that I expected out of them. Clear understandings and simple (hopefully silent) communications will smooth out most yelling situations. _____Grant.
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Old 09-10-2013, 05:42   #45
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Re: Surprised Guy Here

[QUOTE=BoomBrake;1359761]I believe there needs to be clear distinction and communication style between "sailing partners" vs "life partners". I think the two can function and are quite healthy, so long as it is understood by both that these are very different power dynamics, understood by all the "when" and "why" this needs to be.

My wife and I have had terse moments and stern words, sometimes yelling. But at no time disparaging or hurtful (unless having a non sailing related relationship dispute that has spiralled out of control). It has occurred once where the two sailing/relationship dispute coincided and thought this an important story to share.

We are both from different native language backgrounds (Australian and German) so communication is often not natural and extra explanation is needed. I have sailed since age 10, on and off for 32 years and my wife born in a landlocked city only a recent developing master of the wind. Despite long experience, I admit I am no sailing expert and have much to learn myself.

[quote]

Very interesting parallels here....you and I are the two who admit yelling (though I suspect many more are being silent). I too grew up on the water, my Dad being a bay man in my early years. My Wife grew up in Bavaria, and knew nothing of the water. She is learning at a good rate and coming to love the water.

Extra explanation is needed, and the whole marital/situational issue thing does get involved. It can be hard to hear "commands" (e.g., throw the dock line) as simple directives when you are pissed or hurt to the max about something else more personal.

In another bizarre parallel, both our Fathers had extremely sever and similar head injuries making them very quiet, and emotionally silent people, which creates problems difficult to understand by folks who have not experienced it. That shared experience makes us soul mates, even when we are screaming at one another. Weird to see and weirder to be, but it works.

I'm thrilled to hear so many folks here who have this whole yelling thing under control. Bully for ya mate. Yet there are those of us for whom this is a struggle. The reasons are probably as varied as the couples who participate.

Maybe, sometimes, it's best to just watch the squall blow by and be glad it's me, not you, in the weather.
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