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Old 26-09-2013, 23:35   #91
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Re: Sexist views...

No newt, gentleman sounds more accurate.
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Old 27-09-2013, 02:14   #92
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Re: Sexist views...

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post

An amusing example: Friends of ours hired a diesel mechanic in a major Australian city environment. On about his third visit to the boat, he arrived dressed in a summer frock, wearing high heels and with makeup and a wig... and carrying his tool box. "Holy ****!" they said, but watched as he took off the heels, put coveralls over the frock and got down to work. Continued to do a competent job and they were happy with his efforts. They admitted nearly firing him at first glance, but were able to overcome the gender shock and in the end enjoyed the experience. Perhaps not exactly the same thing that Diverchick was talking about but a case where ignoring a unusual sort of gender prejudice was beneficial... and it was a hoot to witness!


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I assume that this is the same guy that comes into our chandlery. He would come in some days dressed as a man, some as a woman. He said that he loved the expressions on customer's faces when he turned up as a woman. He is an absolutely hilarious person. Have not seen him for a while though. I like eccentrics.

Coops.
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Old 27-09-2013, 02:50   #93
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Awesome. My boyfriend is directionally challenged also! I'm a "north at the light" person when giving directions. He's a total "landmarks" person. "Left at the Shell station." ?! THAT isn't going to help us when were hundreds of miles offshore, huh?? Maybe that's a guy thing. (Oops...sexist remark!!! ) I was taking sailing classes in the SF Bay Area and was tired of our instructor's yelling. After about the fifth time of him using a landmark for navigation and yelling at me, I yelled back "I'm not a $&:$ing local and have no clue what the &:@(Ing PALACE OF ARTS IS!!" I got yelled at a little less after that. (Little less.)

Fortunately my bf is REALLY good at weather. Me, not so much. :-) We'd have been blasted many times in Florida if he hasn't known when to run for cover.
That's funny cuz my hubby is from SF and does know where the palace of fine arts is!!
Really though what matters is that we compliment each other with our strengths and weakness.
I'm a vegetarian but still hand him the gaff when he pulls a fish in.

Your instructor is setting a bad example by yelling! Good grief I would have slapped him!
My hubby's best fishing coach is a woman and he also is the best cook.
I do find though that I would rather be crew than in charge. It's a huge weight being the go to person. But that's just me. I'm sure there are plenty of women skippers with nerves of steel.
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Old 27-09-2013, 06:33   #94
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Re: Sexist views...

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No newt, gentleman sounds more accurate.
Thanks OG, you and Raindog are always welcome on my our boat. The other day I was informed that OUR boat is going down to the Caribbean in a couple of winters. I gotta love it.
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Old 27-09-2013, 08:00   #95
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Re: Sexist views...

Wahoo, hopefully we will see ya there
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Old 27-09-2013, 08:29   #96
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Re: Sexist views...

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(snip) when we talk boats just about anywhere guys will look right at him and ask him questions as if I'm not even there.(snip)

This happens to me with some frequency - new meets just look at husband and talk as though I weren't standing there. I find the older guys are worse than the younger.

I have also noticed this: When I was younger, thin and pretty, I was not shown the chauvinism that I now experience. In fact, now that I'm fat, old and homely, I'm treated differently, especially by men, but actually by a fair number women also. It's been a real eye-opening experience, to say the least
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Old 27-09-2013, 08:34   #97
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Re: Sexist views...

Though I sincerely doubt you are fat old and homely I too noticed the change as I got older, I thought it was me getting grumpier with my old age.
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Old 27-09-2013, 08:41   #98
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Re: Sexist views...

thanks OG, but it's true. Nevertheless, I wish I'd gotten into this sailing thing a lot earlier in life so, like Zeehag, I could have worked the system more...
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Old 27-09-2013, 09:07   #99
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Re: Sexist views...

Don't be too hard on yourselves! We will never be in the shape that we once were in our 20's. A little change in your daily routine will bring you some satisfaction. Start by walking for 20-25 minutes every day whenever possible; at least 3 times a week. Always drink a full glass of water before eating. Diets do not work! Try smaller food portions. Never eat anything after 19:00. You must cut down on sweets, colas, chips, fries and fattening foods; I only drink water with a slice of lemon. Aim for 1-2 lbs a month weight reduction; you'll be surprised at the results! A word of caution...if you're taking medications for Diabetes, check with your doctor first as you do not want a sudden drop in your blood sugar. That's all folks!

Mauritz
Working out to lose 20 lbs and achieve my ideal weight.
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Old 27-09-2013, 09:21   #100
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I am an old white guy. For years I tried to open the door, be polite, even stand up when a woman entered the room. Now I don't treat them any different than anyone else. My wife, and my old friends that appreciate it, I do everything I can for. The rest I just ignore, like all the guys out there. If they want part of this dog eat dog world, they are welcome to it. Exception: when a little old lady gets on the train or the bus and can't find a seat, she gets mine. I guess I am still sexist.
You know Newt I've run into a few men in the last few years who actually apologized before they held the door for me exiting a building. I'm a southern bell transplanted north and this struck me as extremely strange. The first one I stopped dead in my tracks and asked if I heard correctly and promptly thanked him for being polite. He promptly thanked me for not yelling at him for being the person his mom raised him to be. We had a funny conversation after that.

I can't speak for anyone else but regardless of gender maybe the world would be a better place if people would polite to one another no matter their appearance it would be a better place.

Yes female captains are often missed. I still watch our friends do this occasionally then catch themselves. I just ignore it. I don't think it matters if the lady is 5' or 6'1 I think most people ass-u-me.

I have so many stories I could go in for days. A very brief favorite from my time in IT:
- I had surveyed a system for security flaws and found several. The man who was responsible for this system came charging into the conference room screaming at me threatening to break my legs. I stood up took a step forward into his space politely looked down a good 6" at him in flat shoes and told him to go see the CTO and come back if he still had such desires after that. He disappeared for the day.

SC
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Old 27-09-2013, 09:54   #101
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Re: Sexist views...

it's really simple;"you cant judge a book by it's cover". Delmarray is right, the odds are that any woman you meet wants nothing to do with fixing her car or a boat. But that doesnt mean the next one you meet wont!
a good example: As a young man I had hair to my shoulders. When I found myself in a position of authority and responsibility many years later, my Engineering Manager wanted to hire this skinny young engineer with straight long blond hair. I was reluctant to give the blessing (although he didnt have to have it). He talked me into it. Guess what? that skinny kid with long blond hair turned out to be one of the brightest and best we ever hired!
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Old 27-09-2013, 10:11   #102
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Re: Sexist views...

Way back in 1955, my mother was refused access to night school. The reason given was that there were no women's toilets. That is an example of the level of post-war sexism in Southern California. She was so mad about it that she wrote a short story about the incident, to work out her feelings.

Today, we're having this "discussion" on this forum, and I, for one, am glad that people are willing to express themselves in public about these issues.

In some of the places we've been, some of the woman skippers have been given a bad time by male port captains and their representatives. There is no way to make it comfortable, except maybe for the skippers to cut those guys some slack. The reason for their behavior is the way they were brought up, often girls are not sent to school (because they're going to be wives, there's not enough money, so it's more important to educate the boys, and the societies are strictly patriarchal). It has to be a shock each time to such a man to encounter women captains.

What will help is for such women to be "professionally" friendly--be polite, and quietly efficient. IMO, best done without the husband being present. Try to bear in mind what you really do know: that a huge percent of women would not want the responsibility or to learn what is necessary to wear the Captain's hat. You are a relatively rare bird, even among cruisers. It is normal that some men will have difficulty with women captains. The more of you there are out there, the better those guys will get, but it will take time.

My two cents.

Ann
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Old 27-09-2013, 10:31   #103
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Re: Sexist views...

Being I can switch back and forth between genders, I do find that males tend to talk to males and females tend to talk to females which is because the discussion and topics are different. Also the older generations, boys and girls where some keep separate and expect to be gender specific. So the older generation seem to be more sexist as that is the way their where brought up. However female/girls have/are acting, doing and wearing more things that are/where considered boy/male. The two genders are blending in many areas, but girls more so. Its becoming more common to in counter the opposite gender/sex in a gender/sex specific area.


True story

We where the first pleasure boat to be allowed to moor on the commercial docks. Commercial docks/boat are considered 99.9% male so they did not know quite what to do being their area as being invaded by a pleasure boat with two two perceived females. Anyway, one morning just before they where fleeting/group was heading to Alaska, I came up the ramp and stopped suddenly as a group of commercial guys where talking and blocking my way.

Panic/shock/fear hit me, but having already been seen, I continued. The group sort of blocked and in circled me. One of the older salts spoke up saying, “We are up set/pissed that you are one of the first and best looking female that has walked the dock, and you’re a guy!” in which they all broke out with a smile and of course asked the standard questions that most people ask.

From that day we been accepted on the commercial dock, but I still get the comments/whistles and sexist remarks, which I take in stride and as a complement. I think its because the Eagle is/looks like a commercial and a I can talk the talk and walk the walk, but a little swishy.

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Old 27-09-2013, 10:52   #104
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Re: Sexist views...

I'm an electrician. I've worked construction all my life. I designed and built my house. I've been a foreman and superintendent on jobs with as many as 50 electricians. I've designed and drew up the electrical systems in huge data centers and high rises. Yet when I walk into a hardware store, home center, auto store or any other "male domain" I get treated like I made the wrong turn.

And then I start to talk shop with the employees and as soon as they realize I probably know more than they do, they start to look at me strangely. I had one guy come to the house to give an estimate on replacing the roofing. I handed him a scaled drawing I made with all the dimensions. He said, "Where did you get this?" I told him I drew it up. He looked at the drawing, back at me and back as the drawing, then scowled. Then he tried to sell me on why his price will be much higher than the competition.

It used to bother me. Now I just have fun with it.
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Old 27-09-2013, 11:13   #105
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Re: Sexist views...

As an old white guy, like newt I have some problems from being raised and being trained to treat women with respect in the rural west. I always try to be polite and most of the times it works out OK. I do limit some of my actions like him.

There seems to be a problem I can't resolve. I had to address my teachers and all women when I didn't know their last name as "Mam". It is simply a reflex at this point. I get yelled at fairly often "I'm not a mam!!!" maybe if I get beat on enough I can unlearn it but so far no luck.

Anybody else have this problem? In fact I don't even understand it I guess it is just a word that is out of favor with many women.
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