Sexist Views...

[geoleo]

.......and ACE Hardware has a great supply of stainless steel fasteners.........at least in Florida

[Celestialsailor]

Originally Posted by DiverChick71

So I just wonder if he would have had the same approach if my boyfriend would have called and asked the same questions instead of me?

Anyone who asks me anything about materials, I want to know if they have any experience with the material in question. It's not sexiest at all. I just want to know how detailed I need to get in my explanations.

Originally Posted by DiverChick71

Haha---and I'm totally guilty of using my chickness to my advantage at times. Really quite ridiculous to think I can have it both ways, huh?

There you have it. You answered your own question. It's a two way street sometimes for women. Men can't get away with it.

[Coops]

Originally Posted by georgetheleo

Au contraie--I cant imagine any men being this stupid with a boat

I can, and seen it happen many, many times. Even to a restored timber one that I sold. One and a half years later, it was back to needing another restoration. Stupidity and laziness is not gender/sexual preference specific.

Coops.

[LBW399]

Counter - for the women folk to consider.

Who would YOU rather be served by at a chandlery, come to fix something on your boat, or whatever trade actually - MAN or WOMAN?

And don't give me some gay answer like "whomever is best for the job"...because you have no idea initially if the person will be any good.

No, I am talking about your initial feelings when you walk into a marine chandlery or scroll the marine trade listings and dial the number.

Come on sailor chicks, be honest .....

[SmartMove]

Originally Posted by Kiwi399

Counter - for the women folk to consider. Who would YOU rather be served by at a chandlery, come to fix something on your boat, or whatever trade actually - MAN or WOMAN? And don't give me some gay answer like "whomever is best for the job"...because you have no idea initially if the person will be any good. No, I am talking about your initial feelings when you walk into a marine chandlery or scroll the marine trade listings and dial the number. Come on sailor chicks, be honest .....

OK this is to date, the stupidest comment I seen on this forum!

Did you not stop to consider the audience you are writing too?!? The women on here are intelligent, independent and accomplished people -- many in non-traditional (female) careers/trades (that includes me)!!! Since we are doing these kind of jobs ourselves why would we think a man would be better for a particular job over a women?

You are right, initially you have no idea if the person will be any good -- the operative word there being PERSON, man or woman. It's a crap shoot anytime you pick a number out of the phone book. That is why I try to ask around for recommendations. If both a man and woman were recommended for the job, I would talk to both and see who I got along with the best. Because, after all, the success of any project is communication and team work.

As bobconnie would say, that's just my 2 cents!

[Coops]

Originally Posted by Kiwi399

Counter - for the women folk to consider.

Who would YOU rather be served by at a chandlery, come to fix something on your boat, or whatever trade actually - MAN or WOMAN?

And don't give me some gay answer like "whomever is best for the job"...because you have no idea initially if the person will be any good.

No, I am talking about your initial feelings when you walk into a marine chandlery or scroll the marine trade listings and dial the number.

Come on sailor chicks, be honest .....

Why would that be a gay answer? (to be honest that is such a crap expression anyway) I work in a chandlery, with both men and women, some know specific areas of expertise, some lack some knowledge on some subjects. It is quite ok to refer the question to the best person to answer that within their knowledge range, disregarding what sex they may be, and we do it all the time.

Coops.

[SmartMove]

Hi Diverchick,

Now that my rant is over this is what I wanted to post.

Without being there and not seeing the body language that accompanied 'someone to help' statement, my take is he was just trying to get info to better help you by providing more in depth instructions/descriptions.

Personally, I have not experienced anything that I would call sexism when shopping at chandleries or hardware stores. Unlike my husband, I do not want to spend hours browsing around. I want to get in and out, so if someone does not approach me to ask if I need help I go find someone. I tell them what the project is, what I need, and if I haven't done it before I share that info too. If I'm going to attempt something a bit unconventional I ask their opinion and then a discussion usually follows about the pros and cons. Normally, I would have researched the heck out of the project I was about to begin, but more knowledge is more and sometimes you miss things. In the end, my ultimate goal is to only go to the chandlery once per project. Well, only twice. OK three times.

All that said, sexism does exist on both sides and I am not opposed to using it to my advantage when I can. But, I going out on a limb here, with men it is more about an attitude and demeaning view of women -- with women it is all about using our assets to achieve our ends (I think Zee pointed that out nicely).

Robyn

[sww914]

Thank the Sun Gods that I've finally *almost* learned that if the person I'm dealing with is stupid, or excellent or an ******* or super helpful that that is independent of their gender or race.
I have a 45 year old woman working for me as a mechanic right now. Not only is she excellent but we will be friends for life. I'm lucky to have met her.
Fortunately she is a lesbian so we didn't have any sexual tension of any form to deal with on either side, makes it easier and we can trade funny stories as well!

[DiverChick71]

Originally Posted by SmartMove

Hi Diverchick, Now that my rant is over this is what I wanted to post. Without being there and not seeing the body language that accompanied 'someone to help' statement, my take is he was just trying to get info to better help you by providing more in depth instructions/descriptions. Personally, I have not experienced anything that I would call sexism when shopping at chandleries or hardware stores. Unlike my husband, I do not want to spend hours browsing around. I want to get in and out, so if someone does not approach me to ask if I need help I go find someone. I tell them what the project is, what I need, and if I haven't done it before I share that info too. If I'm going to attempt something a bit unconventional I ask their opinion and then a discussion usually follows about the pros and cons. Normally, I would have researched the heck out of the project I was about to begin, but more knowledge is more and sometimes you miss things. In the end, my ultimate goal is to only go to the chandlery once per project. Well, only twice. OK three times. All that said, sexism does exist on both sides and I am not opposed to using it to my advantage when I can. But, I going out on a limb here, with men it is more about an attitude and demeaning view of women -- with women it is all about using our assets to achieve our ends (I think Zee pointed that out nicely). Robyn

Hi! Well it was all on the phone so he couldn't "see" my body language. But I did ask a lot of questions. And in thinking about the convo, someone in this thread brought up the point that he was possibly going to recommend someone to help me or for hire. This caused me to ponder, as he had mentioned that my phone number was "almost local" (just north of the county in Florida where the company I called was located. In hindsight, I do think it's at least possible that he was going to recommend a professional nearby. However, while I kept my FL cell number, I live in California now so it's a moot point. He was nice, professional, and his company will likely get a lot of my money over the next few months. But watching all the replies have been enlightening. :-)

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by DiverChick71

But watching all the replies have been enlightening. :-)

Damn right... some folk take life way to seriously.. and if you LOOK for it.. just about everything has a double meaning...
Its like that old saying... "Why is it when your being polite... folks think your flirting.."
Get a freakin life folks...

[Ocean Girl]

Gotta disagree with you DOJ ( are you just playing bad boy again?!). The "who would you rather help you?" Post is so far off the mark I wasn't even going to reply to it. But, I will

I don't care what gender helps me. Male or female, if I don't know them, I just outright ask how much they know about the project I'm working on. Usually, they will say or indicate with body language that it may not be their strong suit. You can get a BSer, but generally the folks at chandleries will tell you who is the best on any given subject. There are usually "resident experts" to talk to. It is on the docks that the real bs can fly. When I worked on boats and at West Marine, I had no problem sending my customer to another boat worker if I thought I wasn't the best for the job. Saying I don't know is no big deal.

[JPA Cate]

Never had a problem in a chandlery, but I had one with myself just this morning. The nurse's assistant who came to help me use a walker (I've just had knee implant liner revision surgery) to go to the toilet is a man. Now, how I grew up was that one only shares a bathroom with a family member, and after a certain age only same gender family members. I'm well aware that I need the help in this situation. But I can fess up that I felt uncomfortable with him performing that role, and there was no excuse other than gender for my attitude. I joked with him about it, because I needed to ease my gender discomfort.

So even amongst us equality types, the issue can creep up on us at times.

I also got Ma'amed in my thirties, by a young southern gentleman, and it made me feel at least a thousand years old. The Maam thing is regional, I think, and it wouldn't bother me at all now, but it was a big surprise back then.

[Target9000]

Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate

Never had a problem in a chandlery, but I had one with myself just this morning. The nurse's assistant who came to help me use a walker (I've just had knee implant liner revision surgery) to go to the toilet is a man. Now, how I grew up was that one only shares a bathroom with a family member, and after a certain age only same gender family members. I'm well aware that I need the help in this situation. But I can fess up that I felt uncomfortable with him performing that role, and there was no excuse other than gender for my attitude. I joked with him about it, because I needed to ease my gender discomfort.

So even amongst us equality types, the issue can creep up on us at times.

I also got Ma'amed in my thirties, by a young southern gentleman, and it made me feel at least a thousand years old. The Maam thing is regional, I think, and it wouldn't bother me at all now, but it was a big surprise back then.

I am a southerner. I grew up around places that had no stop lights and I was raised by people that were what a lot of people might call traditional.

I open doors for ladies and I "ma'am" and "sir" people who are younger than I am!

Some people, especially women, will sometimes get this look of shock on their face when I say. It doesn't mean we think someone is old. It means we think they deserve respect. Its embarrassing to me when it just slips out and I realize I've hurt someone's feelings. I feel discourteous when I don't do it though. Problems of a child raised by conservatives living in a PC era.

A lot has been made of the disparity of treatment of the genders. But I often wonder more about the reason than the actual act. Does opening a door for a lady stem from some deep belief that women are inferior and they cannot open a door themselves? Or does it come from a traditional show of respect? Does having a different mental state about it even matter?

And finally, I believe stereotypes exist for a reason. The human mind is designed to pick out patterns. These patterns form a bias and this is a simple tool our minds used to protect us. If every time you saw a purple dog it bit you, then you'd probably have an aversion to purple dogs. The same holds true in more mundane situations. If a salesperson found that nine out of ten men she spoke to were ignorant about what she is selling, she'd probably get more inquisitive and preachy towards men. If she does this because she feels men are losers, then that is sad and it will probably come across in convo. If she does it to be helpful (using her natural ability to pattern match and infer) then should we call it sexism?

A lot of this stuff has gotten so muddled by the conflicting forces on either side of it. One one side you have the recent past in which women were ill treated and some vestiges remain. On the other side, you have the progressives pushing for a PC future and turning personal bias political. It makes for a very confusing middle.

In the end I think we should just be respectful and loving to those that deserve it, be open to those we don't know, and simply let go of those that we shouldn't associate with. Giving some time to get to know someone may clear up the reasons behind some perceived "slight".

[tamicatana]

Y'all think the local yokels here at CF are bad, check these out:

7 Breathtakingly Sexist Quotes by Famous and Respected Male Authors – Flavorwire

[geoleo]

For everyones info-there is a article in Yahoo news today titled "Why people hate feminists and enviromentalists----" which says they are hated because they are basically mean and arrogant and base their views on feelings-not facts.....Now don't get excited I didn't say this-just passing it on.....