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Old 13-01-2014, 18:23   #46
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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Originally Posted by DoubleWhisky View Post
Do You think it is important to keep the interior level changes by evn, not odd numer of steps?
No… point I was making was split levels so as to minimize steep climbs and simplify passing heavy/awkward objects to a person on other level.

In my case I have 5 steps from aft cockpit to pilothouse (ER underneath)
Then from Pilothouse, 4 steps aft to my (Owners suite) or 3 steps forward to dining salon.

Other tricks are to create a short L shaped Hallway going aft for privacy reasons and to create easy access from both sides of long storage locker (#42 as I show in sketch).



What do mean by multifunctional? Simply twin berths transformable to to double, or something elese?

Can be anything your imagination comes up with at this conceptul stage.
Depending on layout consider multifunction design of a little used guest cabin and en suite to accommodate anything from simply installing a hidden Ironing board to an arts and crafts table that can become your wife’s private space….
I have my office in the owner’s area… why not think about something for the wife in other areas that are normally empty on a larger boat.

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My comments above
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Old 13-01-2014, 18:55   #47
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
The presence of a man-rope will help with exiting the dinghy.

I think boats should not have walk through entry to the cockpit; I believe one should have a bridge deck. Milady will not be amused if a big wave comes cascading down. Such a vessel went down with all hands between New Caledonia and NZ: the wave sunk the boat.
We use 2 lines as a quick clip on for bowsing and steadying tender by the lander
People grab the overhead davits to get their balance when standing up before transferring grip to ladder.

Ann I think cockpit decision is design dependent.

I agree I do not like side openings to cockpit especially if a low freeboard boat with no inside pilothouse control in heavy weather.
However, I would expect in any yacht if you have breaking seas on deck you are strapped in

In our case we are high aft deck with high sided cockpit, option of protected inside steering and only a narrow walk thru aft at centerline.
To me, that offers substantial benefits in drainage, if we ever filled the cockpit
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Old 13-01-2014, 19:16   #48
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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Originally Posted by Sea Shaw Gal View Post
When the late Jim Whitley designed power boats in Melbourne Australia he said "I don't make boats for men I make them for women because if you can keep the women dry and comfortable then you have sold a boat".
I think a similar attitude was expressed by Lars Halvorsen when he said you had to sell the boat to the wife. And it worked, they sold lots.
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Old 13-01-2014, 19:31   #49
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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Originally Posted by GILow View Post
I think a similar attitude was expressed by Lars Halvorsen when he said you had to sell the boat to the wife. And it worked, they sold lots.
Lol… I think there is an evolution in design teamwork and objectives once the size and price goes up.

Up to about 90ft, design priorities are reasonably balanced to satisfy both.
After that, the naval architect/designer focusses on meeting the brief of whomever is signing the check and craftily manages the needs of their partner.

As some very wealthy Owners have told me
“this boat is the only mistress that my wife approves of”
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Old 13-01-2014, 19:53   #50
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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Lol… I think there is an evolution in design teamwork and objectives once the size and price goes up.
True, but I wonder what the relative cost and complexity of boats such as the 50 foot Penelope was in 1938?

Edit: Just found that the 60 foot Tooronga was valued at 12,000 pounds in 1949, which, based on CPI is $603,000 now. Puts it in some kind of perspective I guess, though that's a pretty simple measure.
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Old 13-01-2014, 21:10   #51
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Tomasz,

How about really high quality LED lighting, unobtrusive...

Really high quality everything, actually, but seriously, for refrigeration, watermaking, genset, and so on. The owner will want everything to work immaculately, with only the rare breakdown, once the bugs are out of it. Once knew a boat that every time the electric toilet flushed, there was a 26 amp electric drain...it flattened the battery overnight. Eventually got the problem sorted, but the owner of this 75 footer will not put up with that kind of problem. If you and your mates aim at impeccable, that's probably the right way to go. I hope the buyers have deep enough pockets.

It is an interesting exercise, partly because the complexity the owner is likely to desire would normally need an engineer to look after.

Ann
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Old 13-01-2014, 23:09   #52
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Quote:
We use 2 lines as a quick clip on for bowsing and steadying tender by the lander
People grab the overhead davits to get their balance when standing up before transferring grip to ladder.

Ann I think cockpit decision is design dependent.

I agree I do not like side openings to cockpit especially if a low freeboard boat with no inside pilothouse control in heavy weather.
However, I would expect in any yacht if you have breaking seas on deck you are strapped in

In our case we are high aft deck with high sided cockpit, option of protected inside steering and only a narrow walk thru aft at centerline.
To me, that offers substantial benefits in drainage, if we ever filled the cockpit
I love the idea of a cockpit above the deck ( or level with the deck.) I really like that design , What length is she

dave
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Old 13-01-2014, 23:12   #53
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
The presence of a man-rope will help with exiting the dinghy.

I think boats should not have walk through entry to the cockpit; I believe one should have a bridge deck. Milady will not be amused if a big wave comes cascading down. Such a vessel went down with all hands between New Caledonia and NZ: the wave sunk the boat.
The fact is today , most bridge deck are in there by name only , often miserable little things. I see no reason to have them in that form. A good door is infinitely better then bridge decks or horror , washboards.

dave
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Old 13-01-2014, 23:12   #54
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Quote:
Originally Posted by GILow View Post
True, but I wonder what the relative cost and complexity of boats such as the 50 foot Penelope was in 1938?
Edit: Just found that the 60 foot Tooronga was valued at 12,000 pounds in 1949, which, based on CPI is $603,000 now. Puts it in some kind of perspective I guess, though that's a pretty simple measure.
These days, I think the unlimited options of complexity can push up the price to where a Feadship will cost about €1.2 million per meter.
In 1938…yachting was far more simple and organic even for the large ones

If you buy in to all the toys as Ann warns it may mean you need an engineer onboard to handle all the magic.
Not practical on a 65-75 ft. yacht and will NOT make the wife happier as she doesn’t really want to bother with paid crew inside her intimate floating home.

So robust, simple systems and a good marina based maintenance program is recommended for the 70ft size.
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Old 13-01-2014, 23:32   #55
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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These days, I think the unlimited options of complexity can push up the price to where a Feadship will cost about €1.2 million per meter.
In 1938…yachting was far more simple and organic even for the large ones
How true, here is the quotation from the newspaper cutting that felt such an impressive boat deserved serious column inches, on page 3 no less:

"The Tooronga has luxury accommodation for five passengers and a crew of two.
Some of the features are:
. Hot running water; . A gas oven;
. An electric refrigerator;
. Three state-rooms furnished willi inner-sprung beds, 'dressing tables and wardrobes;
. Power points for toasters"

WOW, based on those items I sail a mega yacht!

Oh, no, hang on... I only have two cabins...
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Old 13-01-2014, 23:46   #56
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

I think in those days sailing was primarily a Man’s (old-boys) getaway and the ladies only came onboard for the occasional day sail or weekender.

I am curious…. Does anyone know who is considered the first woman world cruiser?

The one that comes to mind is Electa Johnson
Electa Johnson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 14-01-2014, 00:15   #57
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

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Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
I think in those days sailing was primarily a Man’s (old-boys) getaway and the ladies only came onboard for the occasional day sail or weekender.

I am curious…. Does anyone know who is considered the first woman world cruiser?

The one that comes to mind is Electa Johnson
Electa Johnson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Josh Slocum's wife had accompanied him when he was master of sailing ships... does that count? Actually, that was pretty common IIRC.

Jim
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Old 14-01-2014, 00:25   #58
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Thinking more smaller Private yachts Jim. Schooner Yankee was pretty big but all I could come up with

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Old 14-01-2014, 09:09   #59
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Question Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pelagic View Post
If you buy in to all the toys as Ann warns it may mean you need an engineer onboard to handle all the magic.
Not practical on a 65-75 ft. yacht and will NOT make the wife happier as she doesn’t really want to bother with paid crew inside her intimate floating home.
So robust, simple systems and a good marina based maintenance program is recommended for the 70ft size.
Hello!
I completely agree with Your statement.

Still - on the boat of 65 - 75 ft it is not easy to keep to the KISS principle.

The powered winches and furlers are necessary, when sailling shorthanded.
Reliable generator is essential.
Water maker is a must-to-have on the boat of this size.
Domestic appliances are not a biggest problem
Air-con: I think the decentralised system shall be simpler and more robust.
The things to avoid (just my own thinking) are: anything hydraulic, captive winches.

It is not my piece of cake in this project, but I think a big decision problem is electrical system. I like to stick to traditional built, but at this size I'm not so sure. With so many cabling tracking any fault in the system shall be difficult and extremely time consuming.
So may be the self diagnosing bus distribution system is acceptable?????
I hate electronics, but it has some merits.

What I think should be avoided is electronic management of the whole electrical system, steering on its own everything: shore power, generator, inverter(s), loaders and so on. Even at the cost of weight I would like to have some overcapacity in the elements, and keep the management of the system as simple and straightforward as possible. Idea of generator or inverter kicking in at will to suplement for high loads is nice, but make things overcomplicated for me. I know, people more and more like to do everything from a touch screen, but for me nothing is wrong about engaging generator by pushing its dedicated button and connecting it to the system by turning switches. Smartphone can be used other ways. May be as a phone, for example???

Any thoughts and comments around?
What particularily should be avoided on the 65 - 75 ft boat to make it cruiseable for shorthanded owners party, without a bunch of engineers on board???
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Old 14-01-2014, 09:34   #60
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Re: Feel of safety, feel of comfort

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoubleWhisky View Post
Hello!
I completely agree with Your statement.

Still - on the boat of 65 - 75 ft it is not easy to keep to the KISS principle.

The powered winches and furlers are necessary, when sailling shorthanded.
Reliable generator is essential.
Water maker is a must-to-have on the boat of this size.
Domestic appliances are not a biggest problem
Air-con: I think the decentralised system shall be simpler and more robust.
The things to avoid (just my own thinking) are: anything hydraulic, captive winches.

It is not my piece of cake in this project, but I think a big decision problem is electrical system. I like to stick to traditional built, but at this size I'm not so sure. With so many cabling tracking any fault in the system shall be difficult and extremely time consuming.
So may be the self diagnosing bus distribution system is acceptable?????
I hate electronics, but it has some merits.

What I think should be avoided is electronic management of the whole electrical system, steering on its own everything: shore power, generator, inverter(s), loaders and so on. Even at the cost of weight I would like to have some overcapacity in the elements, and keep the management of the system as simple and straightforward as possible. Idea of generator or inverter kicking in at will to suplement for high loads is nice, but make things overcomplicated for me. I know, people more and more like to do everything from a touch screen, but for me nothing is wrong about engaging generator by pushing its dedicated button and connecting it to the system by turning switches. Smartphone can be used other ways. May be as a phone, for example???

Any thoughts and comments around?
What particularily should be avoided on the 65 - 75 ft boat to make it cruiseable for shorthanded owners party, without a bunch of engineers on board???

Back ups!! and things simple as posible, i see this days lots of electric furlers with a winch back up in the drum , not my favorite stuff, i prefer a robust manual unit with electric winches in the cockpit or cabin top, inmast furling for a big boat with short crew make sense to, but again , with a foolproof back up, things to avoid ? electric toilets!! or worst , vacum flush toilets!! weird and lame Holding tanks plumbing...just to name few.....
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