Induction cooktop and pan comparison

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Pizzazz

I did some experiments as well motivated by the recent ban on alcohol sales in CA. I was considering a replacement for my Origo 6000 cooker. Here are my findings:

The Origo is rated as a 7,000 BTU per burner alcohol stove. It takes 5 min 30 sec to boil two cups of water (16 oz). I tested the same pot at home with a 5,200 BTU and a 9,100 BTU natural gas burners. I got proportional results of 7 min 20 sec on the smaller one and 4 min 40 sec on the bigger gas burner. The key finding though was that when you use gas or alcohol to warm water only 23% of the produced heat goes in the water. The rest is wasted in heating the surrounding air and producing moisture.

I did the same test with a 1,000W ceramic burner and it boiled the water in six min 30 sec. However, 45% of the produced energy went in the water, thus electric heat is nearly 2x more efficient in the heat transfer from the plate to the pot. I can only guess that induction plates would be even more efficient.

Finally, if you use an electric kettle to boil the same amount of water, the heat transfer efficiency is 80% or nearly 3.5x more efficient that gas/alcohol.

I draw the following conclusions. If you are really big on cooking, by all means get a gas stove with super powerful burners, may be on 9,000 BTU and one 15,000 BTU. This is the best setup but it does waste a lot of heat. If you are an average cook, you can get an electric induction plate plus an electric pressure cooker plus an electric kettle and you will likely be better of - not that much draw on the batteries, no propane except for the grill, no extra heat/moisture produced in the cabin. We have definitely reached a point in time when electric cooking makes sense on any boat with at least 440AHr batteries plus an inverter. Also, always boil water in the electric kettle. There is no substitute for that.

SV Pizzazz

There is little difference between an electric kettle and an induction kettle on an induction cooktop. Remember that with induction cooking it is not the cooktop that gets hot but the iron atoms that are placed on top of it... which are inside the bottom of the kettle just like the electric kettle. The transfer of energy is magnetic, from the coil under the induction glass top to the shorted coil put on top, which is the pan. You have the same magnetic energy transfer from the base of the electric kettle to the coil in the bottom of the kettle.
Induction cooking eliminates the need for an electric kettle

[StuM]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

There is little difference between an electric kettle and an induction kettle on an induction cooktop. Remember that with induction cooking it is not the cooktop that gets hot but the iron atoms that are placed on top of it... which are inside the bottom of the kettle just like the electric kettle. The transfer of energy is magnetic, from the coil under the induction glass top to the shorted coil put on top, which is the pan. You have the same magnetic energy transfer from the base of the electric kettle to the coil in the bottom of the kettle.
Induction cooking eliminates the need for an electric kettle

Almost. An electric kettle typically has a more insulated body than an induction cooking utensil, so less energy will be lost by radiation.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by StuM

Almost. An electric kettle typically has a more insulated body than an induction cooking utensil, so less energy will be lost by radiation.

Exactly, that’s why I noted “little difference” I don’t think it would be measurable for bringing 2 cups of water to a boil though.

[Auspicious]

Originally Posted by Pizzazz

I did some experiments as well motivated by the recent ban on alcohol sales in CA. I was considering a replacement for my Origo 6000 cooker.

Footnotes please for your efficiency numbers? They look off to me.

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by B23iL23

Gimballed and all! 4 "burners" and a convection oven. What's not to like?

Is this on your boat? Can you post more details please? If not can you please post the link of where it came from?

It's always nice to see an attractive gimballed induction setup. I'm noting them for future reference.

THANKS

[ohthetrees]

s/v Jedi appears to think that I'm a consumer magazine or something, and that I owe him a comprehensive review. I picked IKEA because the cost/value proposition was excellent, and my internet research found many happy customers, and I liked the idea of testing performance of one brand at 3 price points. My test was always conceived to be more about the burners than the pans, the pans were an afterthought. As I mentioned, I also tested a number of my own pans, including cast iron (lodge), a carbon steel pan, and a couple of all-clad stainless (they were not non-stick). Not because s/v Jedi demanded it, but because I wanted to, damn it (), I ended up purchasing a very nice NS1 Allclad nonstick pan, and put it through my previous tests. It is a very nice pan, but still didn't perform quite as well as the winning IKEA pan.

One the left is the All-Clad, on the right in the IKEA. The All-clad is definitely the more nicely constructed pan, and You can see the IKEA is slightly smaller at 11" rather than the all-clad 12". It seems to me, it is easier to get even heat distribution in a smaller pan, so the All-clad has a more difficult task. Even so, you can see that the heat distribution of the OUMBÄRLIG is considerably better, with a toasty brown color reaching the edges of the pan, and the center just barely beginning to scorch. The All-clad performed better than the other two IKEA pans, but on the edge the flour is white, and in the middle, it is more burnt than the OUMBÄRLIG.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by ohthetrees

s/v Jedi appears to think that I'm a consumer magazine or something, and that I owe him a comprehensive review.

Ohthetrees you got me completely wrong. You don’t owe anyone. My message is that it is you who should have read the magazines, testvideos, before making those buy decisions.

And here you go again, you go out and buy a 12” AllClad based on a review I linked for 8” pans! No, that is an entirely different class!

For 12” the consensus winner is the pro-line T-fal which is only $35 and works great on induction! There’s no one brand that is best in every class; it’s a Wild West out there!
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[ohthetrees]

Sorry, s/v Jedi, I was joking about getting the All-clad because of you. I bought it days before I saw your post because I got a very good deal on it. I agree that letting pros review these things is wise, and I'm a "researcher". However, while I saw many good reviews comparing pans, I saw very few high quality reviews specifically comparing how they perform on induction stoves.

Induction vs gas is an important difference. I don't really care for non-stick (except for eggs) and I prefer my cast iron and carbon steel more than even all-clad on my large-burner home gas stove. When I started testing induction burners, I found my cast iron and carbon steel pans, while they didn't buzz, and certainly got hot quickly, performed very poorly on heat evenness. This is when I started playing around with aluminum cored multi-layer pans, where I'm finding they work better than my cast iron on induction.

[B23iL23]

Ok so that's the amel 60 at the boat show in Cannes. Really really slick solution that I am trying to get onto an amel 50.

It's really well done.

Originally Posted by jmh2002

Is this on your boat? Can you post more details please? If not can you please post the link of where it came from?



It's always nice to see an attractive gimballed induction setup. I'm noting them for future reference.



THANKS [emoji2]

[jmh2002]

Originally Posted by B23iL23

Ok so that's the amel 60 at the boat show in Cannes. Really really slick solution that I am trying to get onto an amel 50.

It's really well done.

Yes it's very nice, thank you for following this up

[CaptainRivet]

thanks ohthetrees, great review and exactly what I was looking for.
ordered 3 Ikea burner....

I have ikea burners and oven in our 100000Euro kitchen at our house, which is sold now. Why because they fitted well (wanted in white), oven and burner is top end model and individually exchangeable and had all the options I wanted for 1/3rd of the price of the top brands. And I don't calculate with 15years lifetime. I replace especially the oven all 7-8years as more gimicks and usefull features coming out.

Ikea 1 burner is great and cheap, have 2 of the previous model in the holiday home for 5 years. So cheap so I will buy 3 for the boat, and put one away as replacement. Works and for my non Michelin star cooking skills absolutly ok. Yes they will break earlier, well I have 3 for half the price what a professional is costing and it does it job. And in 5 years there will be a better one for the same price...Not installed, so exchange no hassle at all.


A hot tip for all the electric galley guys and woman out there:

Panasonic NN-CS598S which is a stainless steel microwave, oven with BBQ function and real steamer all in one standalone with a small form factor. 1000W inverter Microwave, 1000W BBQ, 1300W steaming and 1450W oven on max. temp. So a 1800W inverter manages it well. This will join me on my 5-8years cirumnaviagtion for sure.
Not cheap but here it makes sense to go high quality.

super high quality and just works if you cook for up to 4 people, perfect for 2. Using it nearly daily since 5 years at home (our big oven gets only used now if we get visitors, so I need to make eg >1kg meat), holiday home and on the boat too. Especially if I have just 600g of roastbeef the small one is much faster, better and uses less power then our IKEA high tech big one. Temp to 90 degrees and time set to 1h on Panasonic and forget about it till its done. Oven convection with 40/80/80-240 degrees celcius+BBQ function.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

. . . Panasonic NN-CS598S which is a stainless steel microwave, oven with BBQ function and real steamer all in one standalone with a small form factor. 1000W inverter Microwave, 1000W BBQ, 1300W steaming and 1450W oven on max. temp. So a 1800W inverter manages it well. This will join me on my 5-8years cirumnaviagtion for sure.
Not cheap but here it makes sense to go high quality.. . .

I just bought something just like that with all of those functions for one of my land homes, for 110 euros. Kenwood, on sale.


I have a Panasonic inverter microwave/grill built into the galley of my boat -- part of the original build. I would love to replace it with something with convection. But the original Panasonic still works perfectly, and I haven't found one with a convection oven which exactly fits the built-in spot.

[CaptainRivet]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I have a Panasonic inverter microwave/grill built into the galley of my boat -- part of the original build. I would love to replace it with something with convection. But the original Panasonic still works perfectly, and I haven't found one with a convection oven which exactly fits the built-in spot.

If the above panasonic whould fit with some mods I would highly recommend to do it. Best buck spend in my kitchens since long and worth some hassle to integrate if on a mono and you need the tilting covered.
Got the one panasonic thats now in the holiday home slightly used for a steal, otherwise I wouldn't have bought such an expensive "microwave". After 6 month when the "normal" microwave broke I didn't hesitate a second and spend 600Euro on a new 2nd Panasonic for our "normal" home.

Spend more here as the parts inside need to be high quality otherwise the all in one doesn't work right/properly and don't last long, especially at sea its important insides are stainless steal or plastic or ceramic too. And that costs money but good invested here.
Eg that Panasonic keeps the full heat of 200 degrees oven for over 2,5hours constant, try that with another cheap "all in one"...it won't be able to keep that stable for more then 30min and vary greatly in real temp. I just have a 800g veal nut/shoulderpiece with low temp 100 degrees cooking in Panasonic for 2h45min, comes out perfect every time.

[toolbar]

I couldn't find the exact Panasonic on German Amazon, but a few similar Panasonic combination-ovens that were marketed with "stainless-steel" in the description, had a lot of reviews (with pictures) claiming that the oven rusted quite badly even on land, when using the steam function. I'm not sure how that works out on a boat.

Or is the NN-CS598S really stainless inside and outside and not just a box with a shiny case?

Paul

[toolbar]

Waited too long to amend my post:

How much does a "baking cycle" with one these combination ovens pull out of the battery? 1300w is the max draw and I guess that it starts cycling once it reaches the target temperature?

Paul