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Old 10-10-2019, 13:18   #31
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

Microwaves don’t cycle based on temperature, except when they have advanced modes like steaming, sensor reheat etc.

I recommend against all those extra’s. Steaming is great for fresh vegetables but how often does one have those aboard? Also, a $5 or $10 steaming container made for microwaves works as good, if not better.

Microwaves shine for (re) heating and when meals are cooked and frozen before starting a passage, it’s ideal to rotate meals from freezer to fridge to microwave during passage. Next trip we will have our own canned food (pressure canning at home before leaving) as well as filled freezers
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Old 10-10-2019, 13:22   #32
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

Jedi, the steaming is not the interesting thing. The Panasonic mentioned above works as a fan oven and could replace a normal gas oven. I had a simpler model a few years ago on land and it worked quite well for baking and roasting stuff - better than the boat gas ovens I know.

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Old 10-10-2019, 13:36   #33
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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Jedi, the steaming is not the interesting thing. The Panasonic mentioned above works as a fan oven and could replace a normal gas oven. I had a simpler model a few years ago on land and it worked quite well for baking and roasting stuff - better than the boat gas ovens I know.

Paul
Ah I see... my parents have that one, it is an European model. It is very large, I would not want that, nor have room for that in a gimbal mount.

Panasonic has simple, small inverter microwaves as well, which are ease to put in a gimbal mount with induction cooktop above. Then, elsewhere (where traditionally the microwave is) a good electric oven/grill/toaster, like this Breville: https://www.amazon.com/Breville-BOV9...0736122&sr=8-2
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Old 10-10-2019, 14:23   #34
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

We are happy with our induction ready Magma stainless steel nesting cookware set. It worked great on an induction cooktop. We sold the house and now they work great on the gas range.

I've played with the idea of getting an induction cooktop for the boat. But, we so rarely need a third burner. The gimbaled gas range works fine under way.

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Old 12-10-2019, 14:46   #35
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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Steaming is great for fresh vegetables but how often does one have those aboard?

At least a week after my last port call.


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Microwaves shine for (re) heating and when meals are cooked and frozen before starting a passage, it’s ideal to rotate meals from freezer to fridge to microwave during passage. Next trip we will have our own canned food (pressure canning at home before leaving) as well as filled freezers


Hmm. I had a microwave and took it out. Just didn't use it enough. Even reheating works well on cooktop or oven, depending on what it is.



Home canning is a boon to cruisers. I made two gallons (7.5 litres) of pasta sauce two weeks ago. Ten pints, two quarts, dinner that night, and leftovers for lunch. Shelf stable for a couple of years. Some things are better done with water bath canning vice pressure canning. I turned a batch of pickles into soup with pressure canning but they'll keep for years with water bath canning. RTFM. We can a mix of finished dishes (soups and sauces) and ingredients (meats, veg).



The canner is well worth the space. You can use it as a stock pot, a Dutch oven (ha!), and a pressure cooker as well as a canner. We're the folks who can support a seafood boil or steamed crabs on the beach. *grin*



It appears that the EU does not have guidance for food safe home canning. I've looked without luck. There is a lot of anecdotal material, especially from Eastern Europe, but nothing official. If you find something please let me know. In the meantime, feel free to use ours: https://nchfp.uga.edu/publications/p...ions_usda.html .
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Old 12-10-2019, 16:06   #36
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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Well, it's taken a while, but after the trauma of my last thread, I'm going to try posting again, and see if this forum is the community for me. If Kenomac comes and tells me I'm not fit to step onto a boat again I don't know what I'll do....

Anyway, I thought I'd share some results of testing 6 different single burner induction burners, and a variety of cookwear. For background, we are doing a comprehensive refitting our 38' Bill Garden Walloon ketch, which has a teeny interior by modern standards for a boat of this length, and a wee little galley. We decided to gimble a single 1800w induction burner, and have a 2nd portable 1800w unit that we can pull out of a drawer and deploy onto the counter when needed. I can't think of when I've used more than one burner on passage, so only gimballing one seems fine, and when at anchor or dock, we can pull out the 2nd burner. We are also considering embedding the 2nd burner flush with our counter top, un-gimballed. So when not used it will just be glass counter top, but when we need a 2nd burner, we just slap a pot on there, and let her rip.

I tested all units by timing how long it took to boil a pot of water, rating their noise levels, both fan noise and the whine/screetch that some people can hear, especially with an empty or low-mass pan. (Younger people tend to find it annoying, so I enlisted my 7 and 9 year old boys to give their opinions.) I also compared how evenly they heated a pan by sprinkling a pan with flour and observing the white/brown/black gradient as the flour toasted then scorched. It turns out all the burners are similarly even, that is more down to cookware.

Ikea Tillreda: This is the one we selected for our gimballed setup. Good price, major brand, so easy to replace with like unit if necessary without having to rebuild our gimble setup when a fly by night brand disappears. It had our favorite form factor, a large flat glass rectangle that I think will look great when we build a gimbaled tray for it. Fastest heating (not sure if more efficient, or pulls more watts than others, despite same 1800w rating). UI more awkward than some, but you figure it out in about 2 minutes, so no big deal.

Sandoo HA1865: This will be our 2nd "portable" burner. Good price, smallest form factor, which is important for a 2nd burner that will be stored away, and will have to push other stuff aside on the counter to find a space. Just as powerful as others, performs just as well. Dead simple UI, and only unit with tactile buttons which I liked.

Duxtop 8500ST: An internet favorite. Of the six I tested, this was the only one that was noticably quieter than the others. Both fan noise, and the high pitched whine that my kids complain about when I put an empty pan on high, were noticeably less on this unit than any other. Downsides, is it had cracks and crevices for food and grime to get caught in, is has a clunky tall form factor, looks kinda crappy, and most importantly has arbitrary 1-10 heat levels, rather than telling me the wattage which I much prefer. This is made worse by the fact that different power levels jump different wattages.

Duxtop 9600LS: I had high hopes for this because it is the "new" Duxtop, and I hoped it would be quiet like its predecessor, and solve the form factor problems since it has no crevices for grime to build up. But it was just as loud as the others, is more expensive than others, and still uses a 1-10 heat levels. So no thanks.

iSiLER 1800watt: Peformed fine. Nice glass top. Fatal flaw was slow responding buttons in the UI, so frustrating to change heat levels quickly.

Sandoo HA1865: Performed fine. Didn't distinguish itself, good or bad.

Pans! I tested heat evenness by sprinkling the whole bottom with flower and seeing how even the browing flour was, and if it scorched in spots. I think pan construction will be the key difference between those who love induction cooking, and those who hate it. Sadly, existing cast iron and steel pans don't work very well. They get plenty hot, but because iron and steel are relatively poor conductors they get wicked hot spots, far worse than our home gas range. I would call them barely usable. Our all-clad sauce pans, and frying pans are a mixed bag. If they are magnetic stainless, they work very well. About half our existing all-clad is magnetic, and half isn't.

I bought 3 pans specifically marketed as induction compatible from IKEA.

OUMBÄRLIG was the winner. Cheapest, at only $20, it has a thick aluminum base, and a handle that doesn't get hot. It was superbly even heat across the whole bottom, best of any pan I tested. Quality seems very high, it uses Teflon Platinum plus, and I think the coating will hold up too. Only downside is that the large thermal mass of the thick base makes for slow heat-up, but it is well worth it to have even heat, and more stable heat mass.

IKEA 365+ was a step up in price at $30. It looks great, but it performed horribly. Terrible hot-spots, pretty much as bad as my steel pan, uncomfortable handle that got hot. In this case the "cheaper" construction technique of the OUMBÄRLIG which has a disk on the bottom is better

TROVÄRDIG is their highest end pan at $40. It really is beautifully constructed, and as a person with some very high-end cookwear, this compares favorable. If I were cooking on gas, I'd keep this one. While it performed much better than the KEA 365+, it still couldn't beat the thick aluminum bottom of the OUMBÄRLIG, wasn't quite as even, the handle is less comfortable, and the cooking surface is kind of convex so oil runs the the outside, which I don't like.

Hopefully someone finds this useful! Maybe even Kenomac!
Excellent information, thanks!
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Old 14-10-2019, 08:16   #37
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

I appreciate all the work you put into your comparison. On a recent episode of "This Old House," the homeowner was installing a big expensive induction stove. The stove company said that although induction burners heat up fast, the cook time is the same as a regular burner.
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Old 14-10-2019, 08:53   #38
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

Fascinating stuff , it always amazes me how the human brain works and the knowledge that can come out , and how some people can get so engrossed in the simple things ,
Great thread , loved reading most of it , but have to say my 2 gimballed gas stove has been fine for me and family and no better at home with 4 burners which I never use
the mind set that we are cooking 4 saucpans at once creating culinary delights in a passage makes me chuckle . plenty of food that is healthy , good for the mind and soul can be done without even turning the gas on
But if you want to cook for me I would be honoured to try your food
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Old 14-10-2019, 09:06   #39
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

following. Very interesting info
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Old 14-10-2019, 10:13   #40
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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I couldn't find the exact Panasonic on German Amazon, but a few similar Panasonic combination-ovens that were marketed with "stainless-steel" in the description, had a lot of reviews (with pictures) claiming that the oven rusted quite badly even on land, when using the steam function. I'm not sure how that works out on a boat.

Or is the NN-CS598S really stainless inside and outside and not just a box with a shiny case?

Paul

Hi Paul,
looked at Amazon and the NN-CS598S is discontinued. Discovered if you look detailed that most reviews are for follow up models. So the new models are made worse with cheap insides....good to know if it breaks I will repair it even its the cost of a new one. So look for a used one.

the 2 NN-CS598S we have are spotless without any sign of rust, steamer used min twice a week since 4 years. All Walls are stainless steals, except bottom and back wall inside are ceramic coated (don't see whats underneath, needed to isolate for BBQ and steam function). only piece that doesn't seem stainless is the shinny protective cover of the BBQ heating pipes, our is fine but if it rusts just take it out as its protection is very limited and it will still work fine.
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Old 14-10-2019, 11:01   #41
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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Great thread , loved reading most of it , but have to say my 2 gimballed gas stove has been fine for me and family and no better at home with 4 burners which I never use
the mind set that we are cooking 4 saucpans at once creating culinary delights in a passage makes me chuckle .

Why chuckle? There is no reason you can't eat well cooking mostly from scratch including on passage. Two burners and an oven is plenty.



"A good chef can count anything, anywhere, with anything." - Chef Bernard Meehan, Executive Chef, Cosmos Club


I don't count myself a chef, only a darn good cook. I haven't felt limited by two burners and an oven or by rolling seas. I haven't tackled a souffle as I'm afraid it will fall when we drop off a wave. Cooking at sea does take longer and the importance of mise en place goes way up.



Making and canning two gallons of pasta sauce takes about four hours on board vice two-and-a-half with more burners at home. Roast pork loin stuffed with spinach and feta takes close to three hours at sea and half that ashore. Roasting a decent turkey takes a long time since you have to cut it in half to fit in the d@m^ oven. If you're going to make a significant protein, a couple of sides, and a salad you have to do some planning. I recently made seared scallops, confit baylia (right out of the movie Ratatouille), rice, and a salad. The ratatouille was a little fussy.



The biggest problem is watch responsibility and delegation, not burners.
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Old 14-10-2019, 11:30   #42
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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I appreciate all the work you put into your comparison. On a recent episode of "This Old House," the homeowner was installing a big expensive induction stove. The stove company said that although induction burners heat up fast, the cook time is the same as a regular burner.


Cooking time for foods may be the same, but boiling time is faster on the induction and there is a lot less waste heat being dumped into the galley.
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Old 14-10-2019, 16:16   #43
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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I appreciate all the work you put into your comparison. On a recent episode of "This Old House," the homeowner was installing a big expensive induction stove. The stove company said that although induction burners heat up fast, the cook time is the same as a regular burner.

It's just a different (more efficient) way to heat the cooking vessel and its contents initially. Why would anyone expect a difference in cook time?
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Old 14-10-2019, 16:37   #44
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

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It's just a different (more efficient) way to heat the cooking vessel and its contents initially. Why would anyone expect a difference in cook time?
Induction is known and proven it has the best heat efficiency transfer rate, means to boil eg a 1l of water it needs the less amount of total energy of all cooking methods. And it's the safest as an induction burner the surface doesn't get hot, so if you suddenly get thrown around and touch the burner you don't get burned. Even more important then efficiency on a boat in my eyes.
Conventional or gas need to heat up the burner plate first. depending how cold the surface is a lot energy gets lost their and also part of heat is lost as it transfers in the whole stove. Also in the surfaces/burners that you don't actively use. Then it heats up the whole pot and only then the heat is transferred to the water.
Induction creates the heat only in the bottom of the pot and no heat is lost to warm up burner and surface of the stove itself. The colder it is the more effective induction is compared to gas and conventional.

Gas without any doubt produces the best and constant heat desperation in pot/pans. That's why top gourmet chefs only cook on gas.
Conventional is simply the cheapest and works with all kind of pot and pants.

Regarding security is 220V or gas safer... Well that is personal evaluation. For me I prefer 220V in a GFK boat over gas. You can survive a 220V shock and in general GFK is isolating and even wet has quite a resistance=lower shock=injury protection but even a little gas explosion if you not get seriously injured it will be catastrophic for your yogurt cup boat and kill you then as it burns. On Alu or steel vessel I would prefer obviously gas. But everyone will have his own preference.

For me induction also reduce the hassle and hunt for one resource less to monitor, stock and take care. That damned gas bottle is always empty at the most remote spot and the nearest but quite far away spot cannot refill because they or you don't have the right adapter... Murphy calls...
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Old 14-10-2019, 16:55   #45
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Re: Induction cooktop and pan comparison

I love my induction and have even bought one for our RV. When I started looking for which one to purchase, I found some info here. https://campingmoz.com/ Thanks guys for all the info. I need to purchase some new induction pots and have learned a lot from this thread!
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