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Old 18-12-2015, 13:51   #16
vjm
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Re: Freeze dried food

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A lot of them used to have large amounts of unfermented Soya as Textured Vegetable Protein (TVP) in them.

Unfermented Soya is really bad for us (it's supposed to be a neuro toxin - why in Asia a long time ago, after massive problems, they hit on fermenting it to make it safe).

A friend used to have a factory making Soya products (TVP, Soya milk, Soya cheese, etc), and the stuff killed him.

I've made a point of avoiding the stuff ever since.

It does affect the digestion too.

An example of this was an old neighbour, who had a large herd of dairy cows. He came up for a chat one evening, really concerned about his cows, because they were getting all sorts of digestion problems, and he (and the vet) was struggling to get to the bottom of things.

So I asked him if he had changed the concentrate he fed them recently. He had, about 10 days before. So I asked him to check if there was Soya in it. Turned out there was. A new type of concentrate, higher protein, lower price.

He had what was left collected, reverted to the previous concentrate, and after a few days of working the Soya out of their system, the cows were ok.

Wind with Soya? That's the least of the problems, but it is part of the problem.

Do you have any cites to double blind scientific studies that support your points? As far as I can tell the entire thrust of your post has been debunked and I can only find non scientific cites and claims on woo pushing websites. Would love to know if there is an legitimate backup.
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Old 18-12-2015, 17:49   #17
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Re: Freeze dried food

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Do you have any cites to double blind scientific studies that support your points? As far as I can tell the entire thrust of your post has been debunked and I can only find non scientific cites and claims on woo pushing websites. Would love to know if there is an legitimate backup.

I doubt there are citations. IMO it doesn't matter. People give their opinions and the OP decides which ones to give weight to. End of story otherwise the thread descends into chaos.

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Old 18-12-2015, 18:14   #18
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Re: Freeze dried food

I asked the cows. They said "Moo problem."

End of story!


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Do you have any cites to double blind scientific studies that support your points? As far as I can tell the entire thrust of your post has been debunked and I can only find non scientific cites and claims on woo pushing websites. Would love to know if there is an legitimate backup.
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Old 18-12-2015, 18:26   #19
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Re: Freeze dried food

I dehydrate my own veg, fruit and some meats. Buy cheap and unprocessed food, and dry it yourself. It's not hard to do. Properly dried, and then sealed, food lasts for years. It stores in very small space. And best of all, dried food is nearly as good as fresh once rehydrated. I've never bought commercial dried or freeze dried foods that taste as good as the stuff I can produce myself.

I've got about three months of dried food on board right now. I hope to be able to carry on drying in bulk when things are cheap as we move into our cruising life. Time will tell...
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Old 19-12-2015, 11:06   #20
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Re: Freeze dried food

DL- I see you've got yourself a freeze drier. A local (Salt Lake) outfit makes them, has discounted them to 3.6 K (!) I hear good and bad things about them. If people are serious about freeze drying food, I guess we could form a Coop and get one. I hear it costs about a dollar a pound to process...
Or do we just want to stay with canned beef?
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Old 19-12-2015, 16:40   #21
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Re: Freeze dried food

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Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
DL- I see you've got yourself a freeze drier. A local (Salt Lake) outfit makes them, has discounted them to 3.6 K (!) I hear good and bad things about them. If people are serious about freeze drying food, I guess we could form a Coop and get one. I hear it costs about a dollar a pound to process...
Or do we just want to stay with canned beef?
We cruised with some Canadian friends who "canned" (actually used Mason jars) the meat they used. The flavor was excellent, miles & miles above supermarket tinned beef. You can buy a lot of Mason jars and lids for $3,600!

Just my 2 cents.
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Old 19-12-2015, 19:53   #22
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Re: Freeze dried food

In some regards I guess it's down to the planned use. We use it for times when cooking is out of the question.

Others use it as a staple, particularly with home canning.

I'm intrigued enough to want to learn a bit more on canning. Anyone able to recommend a good intro book aimed at sailors?

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Old 21-12-2015, 11:14   #23
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Re: Freeze dried food

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Originally Posted by s/v Beth View Post
DL- I see you've got yourself a freeze drier. A local (Salt Lake) outfit makes them, has discounted them to 3.6 K (!) I hear good and bad things about them. If people are serious about freeze drying food, I guess we could form a Coop and get one. I hear it costs about a dollar a pound to process...
Or do we just want to stay with canned beef?
I haven't heard the cost/pound anywhere. Would that weight be before or after freeze drying?

The site for the freeze dryer has a whitepage available for download that shows a cost breakdown for a variety of foods. Cut to the chase... They show electricity usage at $1.80 (ymmv) and Mylar bags,/O2 absorbers at $0.75. They do not mention the consumption of vacuum oil (my guess approx. $0.30). All these are per batch, not per pound.

Yes, freeze drying is not the cheaper way to go. Cost is not one of its advantages. Advantages include better flavor/appearance, nutritional value (97% vs 40%) Shelf life (20 yr vs 3-5 yr), etc...
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Old 21-12-2015, 11:33   #24
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Re: Freeze dried food

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Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
We cruised with some Canadian friends who "canned" (actually used Mason jars) the meat they used. The flavor was excellent, miles & miles above supermarket tinned beef. You can buy a lot of Mason jars and lids for $3,600!

Just my 2 cents.
Hi Ann,
Since I live in the prepper capital of the world (Utah) I can pick up the jars, lids and canning cookers for just about free at garage sales.
My old question would be how to make sure your batch is good (I know it's an art) Lots of people back in the old days died from botulism toxin.
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Old 21-12-2015, 11:52   #25
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Re: Freeze dried food

Hi, s/v Beth,

Well, if i were going to get involved in canning (I did not grow up in a household where they did it), I would look at Dept. of Agriculture books from the 1930's about home canning. The botulin toxin issue had been solved by then, and because they were simpler times, the processes should be clear. I believe it has to do with the times and temperatures involved. Also check out some modern canning publication. It will be important to follow the instructions, but your concern about the botulism tells me you most likely would!

What was written above about loss of nutrients by canning may be so--I don't know--but I can tell you I was really impressed by the flavor of J's chicken, which had been turned into a stir-fry with fresh vegs.

The rings and jars last "forever", but the lids with the seals should be fresh, so you'd need a big supply of them, or an address to have them shipped to.

Ann
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Old 21-12-2015, 12:21   #26
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Re: Freeze dried food

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...

Others use it as a staple, particularly with home canning.

I'm intrigued enough to want to learn a bit more on canning. Anyone able to recommend a good intro book aimed at sailors?

Rich
You don't need to buy a book, the book has been written with your tax dollars.

National Center for Home Food Preservation | USDA Publications

There are multiple documents you can download as PDFs. I printed the chapters years ago.

Canning is not rocket science and is pretty easy to do. I bought a pressure cooker with a weight to set the pressure since that is pretty idiot proof and reliable.

I will make two gallons of bean soup. One gallon we will eat over the week or so after cooking and the other gallon I "can" in quart jars. My food tastes much better than what is in the store and my food is not loaded with salt.

The only problem I can see with canning on a boat is the heat and moisture generated from canning but one could can outside depending on heat sources.

To the OP. We bought a dehydrator years ago to dry fruit and it works very well but I think it would be an energy hog on a boat but if one has shore power that might not be a concern. We try to dehydrate based on whatever fruit is in season and cheap to buy. Freeze drying seems to be overkill for a boat since weight is not that much of a concern compared to someone trying to carry food in a pack back for a week or more.

Later,
Dan
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Old 21-12-2015, 12:45   #27
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Re: Freeze dried food

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To the OP. We bought a dehydrator years ago to dry fruit and it works very well but I think it would be an energy hog on a boat but if one has shore power that might not be a concern. We try to dehydrate based on whatever fruit is in season and cheap to buy. Freeze drying seems to be overkill for a boat since weight is not that much of a concern compared to someone trying to carry food in a pack back for a week or more.
The energy issue for drying is one I've been thinking about Dan. I dry a lot of food using a home-built electric dehydrator. In our future I've thought about trying to time marina stops to coincide with local harvest times. My thought is to come in, buy whatever's cheap and in-season in bulk, and then spend a few days tied to dock and shore power processing and drying all the food.

I also built a solar dehydrator (slightly modified from the one in Sailing the Farm), but I have yet to put it to use.
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Old 21-12-2015, 13:06   #28
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Re: Freeze dried food

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...

I also built a solar dehydrator (slightly modified from the one in Sailing the Farm), but I have yet to put it to use.
I looked at solar dehydrator designs and they should work. The temperature needed to dehydrate is pretty low and a sunny day should provide more than enough heat. The only issue I could see is the need to move air but if the design was not right a cheap solar power fan should solve that problem.

Later,
Dan
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Old 21-12-2015, 13:34   #29
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Re: Freeze dried food

Since we are slightly off course, what do you guys think of this new hydroponic, Led garden for the boat?, Seems like on sunny days I could bring it out, otherwise keep it in the galley. Just food for thought
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O9GRTC8/...189_B00I0B86AW
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Old 21-12-2015, 15:08   #30
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Re: Freeze dried food

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I looked at solar dehydrator designs and they should work. The temperature needed to dehydrate is pretty low and a sunny day should provide more than enough heat. The only issue I could see is the need to move air but if the design was not right a cheap solar power fan should solve that problem.
I think air flow should be fine. I do wonder about general humidity though. Wondering if the salt air will make it difficult. I guess I'll find out...

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Since we are slightly off course, what do you guys think of this new hydroponic, Led garden for the boat?, Seems like on sunny days I could bring it out, otherwise keep it in the galley. Just food for thought
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O9GRTC8/...189_B00I0B86AW
We used to have one of these in our previous land house, although it was an earlier version that used florescent bulbs. Worked really well to grow fresh herbs all winter long. I assume the LED version would draw a lot less amps. Might work well, especially if it would run off DC.

We currently bring potted herbs on board and shift them outdoors whenever possible. Otherwise they stay down below, underneath our translucent hatch.
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