Best second language

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Tayana42

My first language was DOS but now I'm up to IOS 9.3.1.


S/V B'Shert

Computer languages are soooo much easier than human languages. During my career, I was fluent in about a dozen (programming languages, those are OS's above, though each OS typically has its own scripting language).

Regular grammar (as opposed to the "irregular" grammars of spoken languages), no exceptions to the rules, no irregular verbs, no tenses and thus no conjugation, each "word" or expression means one, and only one, thing, relatively small vocabulary, no coloquial expressions, few if any "dialects" of any given language (language "extensions" for an OS are common, but the core language is usually the same)...

[boatman61]

[QUOTE=belizesailor;2109647]Being from the south, but having traveled all over the USA working (including NY), I often find myself in the position of translating between dialects. My wife is from "kahhlifornia" so when around southern friends I often have to translate for her. I joke that I speak 3 languages: English, Spanish, and "Bubba".

Central American Spanish has even more variation in dialects than American English, not so much in the accent, as in the USA, but significant variations in vocabulary. For example, in Guatemala and Panama they use totally different vocabulary for common tools & hardware store items.[/QUOTE]

Bit like the England and US... we speak English and you speak American.. you even spell differently..

[belizesailor]

[QUOTE=boatman61;2109658]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

Being from the south, but having traveled all over the USA working (including NY), I often find myself in the position of translating between dialects. My wife is from "kahhlifornia" so when around southern friends I often have to translate for her. I joke that I speak 3 languages: English, Spanish, and "Bubba".

Central American Spanish has even more variation in dialects than American English, not so much in the accent, as in the USA, but significant variations in vocabulary. For example, in Guatemala and Panama they use totally different vocabulary for common tools & hardware store items.[/QUOTE]

Bit like the UK and US... we speak English and you speak American.. you even spell differently..

True, "Two countries separated by a common language".

I used to teach technical semimars in the USA & Europe. In the European sessions we had students from many different european nations. All spoke "English", but It was a bit like Central America, in that students from each country had their own dialect. I learned to be very careful about not using American coloquial expressions...which would result in a room full of confused looks.

The Brits seem to have the most distinct variations of in country dialects. With, like the USA, very different accents from different areas.

[omc]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

Computer languages are soooo much easier than human languages. During my career, I was fluent in about a dozen (programming languages, those are OS's above, though each OS typically has its own scripting language).

Regular grammar (as opposed to the "irregular" grammars of spoken languages), no exceptions to the rules, no irregular verbs, no tenses and thus no conjugation, each "word" or expression means one, and only one, thing, relatively small vocabulary, no coloquial expressions, few if any "dialects" of any given language (language "extensions" for an OS are common, but the core language is usually the same)...

Very well said and definitely true ! In the 90's I was not bad in Basic / Fortran / Clarion programming languages (DOS was easy and helpful). All of them were a lot easier to learn than the Russian I learned right after the Berlin Wall collapsed.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by omc

Very well said and definitely true ! In the 90's I was not bad in Basic / Fortran / Clarion programming languages (DOS was easy and helpful). All of them were a lot easier to learn than the Russian I learned right after the Berlin Wall collapsed.

During my EE studies I had one class that took us into assembler and even machine code. I think Russian would be easier.

[barnakiel]

I will not agree Spanish speakers easily understand Portuguese speakers. From my experience, this is not the case. Unless you are from Galicia maybe.

I have seen Portuguese speakers having problem understanding Brazilian speakers too. One language so I guess pronunciation or work choice is the key. Seen the same between Spanish and Latino speakers, mostly because of word choice here.

Reading flashcards on an App is a very lame way to learn a language. A sailor may be primarily interested in quick acquisition of bare spoken fluency within say the early 500 to 2000 words. This gets you started ashore, in the office, at the mercado, marche, etc.

You want whole phrases that match the situation at hand: correct, complete and round. And decent pronunciation.

YOU WANT TO SPEAK AND UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY SAY

Good courses here:

- Español: Instituto Cervantes
- Française: Alliance Française

You want native speaker teachers who are teachers of their language as a foreign language. They will get you there in half the time and for half the money. If you truly apply yourself to study, you may be ready to go and have a basic street conversation in your target country in about a year. Then it goes real fast until you hit the wall.

Cheers, hasta pronto, au revoir,
b.

[omc]

Originally Posted by skipmac

During my EE studies I had one class that took us into assembler and even machine code. I think Russian would be easier.

Oh yes, I trust you about that !

[StuM]

Originally Posted by skipmac

During my EE studies I had one class that took us into assembler and even machine code. I think Russian would be easier.

x86 assembler has a vocabulary of less than 700 words,you only use single word sentences and syntax is 100% consistent.

That has got to be easier than any natural language.

[Sam8989]

The following languages I'd like to learn, in approximate order:

1: Spanish, mainly because I already know some Spanish, and it's probably one of the easiest languages to learn for an English-speaker.

2: German

3: Japanese, because I love Japanese culture so much, especially anime. I list it third because Japanese is a COMPLETELY different language from English, very difficult for us to learn but it seems challenging and I love to tackle challenges
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bestermpaper-com

[JPA Cate]

Nice to see this thread revived.....

@ Boatman61, et al,

There apparently still exists in Spain, a prejudice against the Portuguese, who were driven out sometime back. That's why they were rude to you. They would probably be rude even if you said you were Brazilian. It's probably only some of them. I had a Spanish pen pal when i was 13. His name was Jose Barranco-Lama. He stopped writing to me when I revealed that my mother was Portuguese. I had hurt feelings!

As to the French, well, I have a little French, and I tried to use it in France. My teacher was Belgian, so I have a sort of Yank/European accent. In France, everyone was polite to us, very pleasant, even when I had a stupid problem. Even the Vietnamese taxi driver was nice. However, I get confused by some of the provincial accents, and what it is for me, is that when the sounds come in, my brain spells them to me so I turn the sounds into comprehension, or not. If the word ends, the way I know it as a "anh" sound, and they say "een", it doesn't spell right and the result is non-comprehension. I wish I knew how to get around that, 'cause it's a real show stopper. They can understand me, but my comprehension is poor to non-existent.

Ann

[mikedefieslife]

Originally Posted by Sam8989

The following languages I'd like to learn, in approximate order:

1: Spanish, mainly because I already know some Spanish, and it's probably one of the easiest languages to learn for an English-speaker.

2: German

3: Japanese, because I love Japanese culture so much, especially anime. I list it third because Japanese is a COMPLETELY different language from English, very difficult for us to learn but it seems challenging and I love to tackle challenges
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bestermpaper-com

I did some Japanese at university. Speaking was actually very easy, and grammar for me was much easier than any latin based languages. No plurals, no genders, not too much intonation. Of course I only spoke baby Japanese but native speakers could understand me. No the reading and writting is the difficult bit. Hirigana and katakana are fine, but trying to remember 2,000 Kanji, is hard.

On a different note. Every Portugese or Brazilian person i've met, could speak Spanish near enough fluently, most could understand Catalan, and Italian too. Yet i've never met a Spanish speaker that can speak Portugese.

[Sojourner]

We're lucky that one of us (Cristina) is fluent in Russian, Romanian, Italian, English, French and Spanish.... It's not for nuthin I call her our Fixer 😁
That said I'm also fluent in Hungarian and speak some German and Russian.

For a cruiser in the americas, I'd guess Spanish. Here in the med, you need more. If I had to speak only one second language, it would be French.

[redhead]

Living so close to the border we've found it indispensable to learn Canadian.

We have prooojects which we make prooogress on. We try to sail into harbours as politely as we can. We end all of or sentences with an upward inflection. In return we are invited onto others' boats and even into their houses for a meal. Exciting discussions on present day current events might be stressful, but as long as we end each statement with an "eh?" we seem to pass muster. Or is that mustre???

All kidding aside, I've lived in 5 countries and as long as I leave any Ugly American tendencies aside and am eager to learn and appreciate another culture I have always found people equally as eager to meet and communicate in any way we can. It might be pigeon English or even scattered words in each language with lots of hand signals, but it seems to satisfy both side. For getting around I also endorse "Spanish/French for Cruisers". After living in Spanish speaking countries for 6 years I'm relatively fluent, there were lots of tools and engine parts that I had not a clue how to name.

Not bad for a Mick Yank, eh?

[RELENTLESS 1]

We are heading to France to visit the Factory where our boat is being built. We plan to spend Summer 2021 and 2022 in Med. I have 'working' Spanish, where I can communicate, and if you use even a little everywhere Latin I have traveled the people have been over the top polite and enthused that a gringo has made the effort to learn the language.
We have been told, as one poster said, that if you at least attempt to speak some French you will be treated much more kindly - and likely in English by doing so.
I recommend the App Duolingo is really useful, easy to use and you can 'hear' the language.
We have both the French & Spanish for Cruisers - really helpful - I printed a picture of the boat and labeled everything in French to be familiar w/boat parts etc.
Also on Youtube there a ton of language help videos - Alexa for French is really good and I just listen to that and have learned a ton.
Also on Youtube are some great 'hint' videos of 'What not to wear/say/do in ...." as well as what to say and do in certain countries - it helps me not to be an 'ugly American'

[jamescharles]

Originally Posted by Sam8989

The following languages I'd like to learn, in approximate order:

1: Spanish, mainly because I already know some Spanish, and it's probably one of the easiest languages to learn for an English-speaker.

2: German

3: Japanese, because I love Japanese culture so much, especially anime. I list it third because Japanese is a COMPLETELY different language from English, very difficult for us to learn but it seems challenging and I love to tackle challenges
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bestermpaper

Overall, Spanish. However, if you have a specific job or place of work, that could change. There are plenty of Russian, Chinese, and German speaking communities. If you plan on staying in one of those cokmunities, then the language of that community is best. If you just want all around use, Spanish is the best option by far!