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Old 21-02-2016, 11:53   #16
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

No problem. When you're doing it, sometimes it takes a bit of "grunt" on the 2nd winch in order to break things loose. But between the wraps on the original (overriden) winch, & the load on the line on winch #2, there's very little, to any, sudden movement, line wise. Though it can still surprise you when things break free.

If nothing else, it can't hurt to try, in a situation where you've got a bit of sea room. Then you always have other options to revert to, needs be.
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Old 21-02-2016, 12:47   #17
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

Quote:
Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
We never had it happen to a halyard - I guess our leads were good - always happened to one of the side deck lines (from your long list of lines in the other thread ) that was NOT lead thru a permanent turning block.
NOTE: I would be both gentle, & selective, when doing this with halyards. Particularly if it were to involve cross sheeting athwartships across a companionway opening. As on the vast majority of boats, structurally speaking, this is a weak location. Especially when compared to the kind of power which one can generate with a winch.
And No Way would I try it here with a powered winch. Heck, I'd be skittish about trying it in most spots with powered winches.

Too, some of it goes back to my earlier post about knowing the boat. As, for example, on some racers, when the halyards & other lines by the companionway hatch are cranked on hard, it deforms things enough so that the hatch can't be closed.
Where as on others, it'd take a hydraulic jack to alter the companionway's dimensions.

Ditto on using caution in sheeting across the cockpit on various boats. As on a fair number, the laminate structure isn't setup to field such obtuse loads. Especially one with primary winches mounted on tall (read cantilevered), relatively lightly built, coamings. Though, of course other boats are just the reverse.

However, generally speaking, running lines from Primary to Secondary winches, & vice vers, on the same side of the boat is okay. As their support structures are setup for loads primarily in such directions.
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Old 21-02-2016, 13:18   #18
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

If you have put a line on a high powered wench and have been over ridden, it's only gentlemanly to remove the line. I don't recommend using a second wench to correct the first one. That can be stressful.
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Old 21-02-2016, 16:56   #19
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

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Originally Posted by IdoraKeeper View Post
If you have put a line on a high powered wench and have been over ridden, it's only gentlemanly to remove the line. I don't recommend using a second wench to correct the first one. That can be stressful.
"Stressful" in what way? Also, have you tried this technique much? And what alternatives are you proposing?
As at times, even with the load having been removed from the line on the overridden winch, things can be on there pretty snugly to be getting them off by hand. If it's at all possible, without; a knife, or some other type of force multiplier.
Which, a knife is (see "plane" or "wedge") but in this instance they're kind of a last resort.

I state the above, having been on many a yacht, where it wasn't possible to remove the override, even with the line in question disconnected from everything; without, that is, the assistance rendered by a 2nd winch.
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Old 21-02-2016, 18:43   #20
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
"Stressful" in what way? Also, have you tried this technique much? And what alternatives are you proposing?
As at times, even with the load having been removed from the line on the overridden winch, things can be on there pretty snugly to be getting them off by hand. If it's at all possible, without; a knife, or some other type of force multiplier.
Which, a knife is (see "plane" or "wedge") but in this instance they're kind of a last resort.

I state the above, having been on many a yacht, where it wasn't possible to remove the override, even with the line in question disconnected from everything; without, that is, the assistance rendered by a 2nd winch.
I think you miss his attempted humour - replacing "winch" with "wench" .
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Old 21-02-2016, 19:32   #21
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

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Originally Posted by StuM View Post
I think you miss his attempted humour - replacing "winch" with "wench" .
Yes Sir. Went completely over my head. Never even saw it.
Or in the words of Homer Simpson: DOH!
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Old 21-02-2016, 21:16   #22
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

Ya know, that word (winch) is so often replaced with wench here on CF, not through humour but through ignorance, predictive text confusers, or sloppy typing
that unciv's response was reasonable IMO... To be really honest about it, I had the same reaction at first!

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Old 29-02-2016, 02:42   #23
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

and please remember, a winch, and specially an electric one can be VERY DANGEROUS ! this previous post relates some horror stories, with very serious injuries:
The hidden dangers of power winches

Originally Posted by Muckle Flugga --How long does it take to move 20cms with a powered winch? A couple of seconds? 20cms is long enough do blow a fitting if at the top of the mast, or rip a body part off if somewhere below and caught.


notably from Muckle Flugga <<This is exactly why it is so very dangerous to use an electric winch to climb a mast! A truly terrible incident in Jolly Harbour a few years ago resulted in the amputation of a woman's hands and forearms, and all eight fingers of a would be rescuer… I know the guys who had to clean it all up, and was present a day later. Awful.>>

neilpride <<I meet the Woman in person , and their husband ... horrible history,,,, >>
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Old 29-02-2016, 04:02   #24
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

Quote:
Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Curious - How well does that work?

I have heard of it but never tried it. The rolling hitch has always been enough for me.
The hitch used to be my default, and STILL is for major screwups... but the "tail pop" as I call it, is really quick on 85% of 'em... Amount of pucker is directly proportional to how hard you're cranking on the freeing winch...
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Old 29-02-2016, 06:38   #25
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
NOTE: I would be both gentle, & selective, when doing this with halyards. Particularly if it were to involve cross sheeting athwartships across a companionway opening. As on the vast majority of boats, structurally speaking, this is a weak location. Especially when compared to the kind of power which one can generate with a winch.
And No Way would I try it here with a powered winch. Heck, I'd be skittish about trying it in most spots with powered winches.

Too, some of it goes back to my earlier post about knowing the boat. As, for example, on some racers, when the halyards & other lines by the companionway hatch are cranked on hard, it deforms things enough so that the hatch can't be closed.
Where as on others, it'd take a hydraulic jack to alter the companionway's dimensions.

Ditto on using caution in sheeting across the cockpit on various boats. As on a fair number, the laminate structure isn't setup to field such obtuse loads. Especially one with primary winches mounted on tall (read cantilevered), relatively lightly built, coamings. Though, of course other boats are just the reverse.

However, generally speaking, running lines from Primary to Secondary winches, & vice vers, on the same side of the boat is okay. As their support structures are setup for loads primarily in such directions.
I saw my cockpit coamings move inward by several inches trying to remove an override using the cross cockpit method
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Old 29-02-2016, 07:23   #26
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Re: Wrapped line around a winch

Quote:
Originally Posted by estarzinger View Post
Curious - How well does that work?

I have heard of it but never tried it. The rolling hitch has always been enough for me.
I think he means you still need to relieve the load (at least I always have, since you want to maintain control), but that even after that, sometimes pulling the tail will not free it. Just take the tail to another winch and give it a pull in the reverse direction, like you would by hand, but a bit harder (learned this after I set some tracks too high--the solution was fixing the hardware, of course).
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