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Old 14-03-2016, 13:14   #76
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Don't forget to check the other anchoring threads here, lots of other good tips.
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Old 14-03-2016, 15:29   #77
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Years ago I agreed to crew on a friend's 26 ft fixed keel sloop for a two week island hopping trip out of Puerto Escondido in Baja California. Neither of us were very experienced. The first night out he decided to anchor bow and stern for reasons i didn't fully understand since there was plenty of room to swing. I worried about not being able to swing into the wind if it changed. We awoke at night when a small, local, violent squall (chubasco) hit. Before we had a chance to do hardly anything, the boat was pushed onto the rocks and holed. Within 24 hours one entire side was eaten away and the boat was a total loss. I have always believed that having two anchors out was the problem. The wind hid us abeam and neither one could hold a proper set.
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Old 14-03-2016, 15:37   #78
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gone2long View Post
Right now I'm somewhere where it is hard to find good literature on the subject, so I am posing a question on this forum.

I would like to know when most folks consider it necessary to set a stern anchor. Also, what is the downside to doing so, and when might a 2nd bow anchor be a better choice.
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SET STERN ANCHOR IN TIGHT ANCHORAGES AND ON THE BEACH. FOR 2 BOW ANCHORS YOU ONLY HOLD ON ONE ANCHOR ANYWAY, SWITCHES FROM ONE TO OTHER. I USE 2 WHEN LEAVING THE BOAT FOR WEEKS AND NEVER HAD A PROBLEM EVEN WITH CHAINS TWISTED, JUST TAKES LONGER TO RETRIEVE. MOSTLY JUST USE ONE.
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Old 14-03-2016, 15:46   #79
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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Originally Posted by hamburking View Post
I was in my favorite anchorage in the islands, and the wind picked up to 40 knots and stayed there. Boats were dragging all over. Eventually, so did I. After a couple failed attempts to re-anchor, the hook was holding. But the wind was strong and it was getting dark, and the boat was tacking like crazy. I had a second, identical anchor, so I carefully powered up and set the second anchor to make a V shape at the bow. I felt the second hook grab solidly as the boat backed off in the wind. I balanced the two anchors using the rodes. Now the boat stayed put...no more tacking. And the force due to windage was shared between the two anchors...neither one pulling too hard anymore.

As for anchor size...it turned out that my originally set anchor was fouled on an ancient tree, buried on the bottom. The tree stopped my anchor from setting deeper. When I dragged, I dragged the entire tree. I was able to pull up a large section of the tree with my anchor, to the amazement of my neighbours. A larger anchor would have made no difference. In fact, my anchor was about 2 sizes larger than most boats my size usually carry.

With the two anchors well set off the bow, I had a pleasant, although windy night. I cannot say the same for many of the other boats sharing the anchorage that night.
Hamburking,

You cite a perfect scenario to deploy that 2nd bow anchor...

As I often tell thos asking why we have 2 hefty bow anchors, our 2nd is primarily a back-up in case the primary anchor fails [for any reason...]

Your's failed [although you didn't know why until you saw the tree in its grasp...] and you set a 2nd bow anchor, and slept...

A great example of one scenario when 2 ready to deploy bow anchors paid off...

You also indirectly point out a method for reducing the load on the ground tackle by mitigating the hull veering/horsing at anchor [and the associated increased loads and shock loads on the ground tackle.]

Cheers!

Bill
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Old 14-03-2016, 16:10   #80
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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Originally Posted by wrwakefield View Post
Hamburking,

You cite a perfect scenario to deploy that 2nd bow anchor...

As I often tell thos asking why we have 2 hefty bow anchors, our 2nd is primarily a back-up in case the primary anchor fails [for any reason...]

Your's failed [although you didn't know why until you saw the tree in its grasp...] and you set a 2nd bow anchor, and slept...

A great example of one scenario when 2 ready to deploy bow anchors paid off...

You also indirectly point out a method for reducing the load on the ground tackle by mitigating the hull veering/horsing at anchor [and the associated increased loads and shock loads on the ground tackle.]

Cheers!

Bill
I often tie an additional line to the dock, just in case some others fail. Sometimes this applies also to lines to nearby trees or to an extra anchor. If a shackle breaks, it may be better to have a weak anchor rather than none. Makes me sleep better. All these measures depend on what kind of weather changes I expect to be possible. Sometimes one weak line is enough.
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Old 14-03-2016, 16:46   #81
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Only once; on our old boat. Matia Island is in the San Juan Islands, in Washington. The cove below Rolfe Cove sits a little WNW / ESE and we had wind/waves from the south overnight. The tidal swing was @ 6 ft as I remember. The picture may not show the narrowness of the cove; it is only a one boat spot, and we simply backed up as far as practical at high tide and set the stern anchor (after setting the forward anchor). Moved a little side to side but never hit the rock sidewall. The retrieval was pretty easy the next day.
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Old 14-03-2016, 17:12   #82
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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Originally Posted by Juho View Post
I often tie an additional line to the dock, just in case some others fail. Sometimes this applies also to lines to nearby trees or to an extra anchor. If a shackle breaks, it may be better to have a weak anchor rather than none. Makes me sleep better. All these measures depend on what kind of weather changes I expect to be possible. Sometimes one weak line is enough.
Hi Juho,

It sounds like you are being prudent to me... I agree about redundancy. It doesn't take long...

We double all dock and spring lines when in a marina during anticipated inclement conditions, or when away from the boat. Likewise with shore lines, etc.

I had to overwinter during a refit in northern Washington [Semiahmoo] many years ago, and ended up tripling all lines because of the high winds broadside to my assigned slip... And I did have some chafe through during the course of a couple of storms...

I do this for the same reason we always set our anchor with a long bridle and back-down hard to test everything for storm readiness: because I am lazy and don't want to have to get up in the middle of the night... It only take a couple of extra minutes to rest peacefully.

Cheers!

Bill
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Old 14-03-2016, 17:25   #83
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

only when forced to... and go kicking and screaming!
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Old 15-03-2016, 02:42   #84
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrwakefield View Post
Hi Juho,

It sounds like you are being prudent to me... I agree about redundancy. It doesn't take long...

We double all dock and spring lines when in a marina during anticipated inclement conditions, or when away from the boat. Likewise with shore lines, etc.

I had to overwinter during a refit in northern Washington [Semiahmoo] many years ago, and ended up tripling all lines because of the high winds broadside to my assigned slip... And I did have some chafe through during the course of a couple of storms...

I do this for the same reason we always set our anchor with a long bridle and back-down hard to test everything for storm readiness: because I am lazy and don't want to have to get up in the middle of the night... It only take a couple of extra minutes to rest peacefully.

Cheers!

Bill
Yes, I agree. Especially if you leave the boat alone for a longer period of time or plan to sleep, it may be much easier to spend few minutes tying some extra lines (or even row an extra anchor), than to later walk back and forth or roll in your bed, wondering if the boat is ok.

Juho
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Old 15-03-2016, 07:38   #85
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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I heartily endorse the ebooks from Attainable Adventure Cruising. John, Phyllis, et.al. have e-chapters on virtually every aspect of owning, maintaining and cruising.
Anchoring is a subject elaborated, and discussed in the opinions posted by your fellow cruisers with heaps of experience.
It was free blogsite for years, and now, for a very nominal fee (around $10/year, I think), you can access the entire library, new posts come out usually about once a week from quite a close knit cohort of seasoned, usually high latitude, sailors.
You can still join for free, receive their email topics, and see loads of posts. And they make unsubscribing painless.
Fully support and endorse their philosophy and site (for example):

https://www.morganscloud.com
Thanks for the link. Will check it out.

G2L
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Old 15-03-2016, 13:20   #86
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Quote:
Originally Posted by coolboat30 View Post
Years ago I agreed to crew on a friend's 26 ft fixed keel sloop for a two week island hopping trip out of Puerto Escondido in Baja California. Neither of us were very experienced. The first night out he decided to anchor bow and stern for reasons i didn't fully understand since there was plenty of room to swing. I worried about not being able to swing into the wind if it changed. We awoke at night when a small, local, violent squall (chubasco) hit. Before we had a chance to do hardly anything, the boat was pushed onto the rocks and holed. Within 24 hours one entire side was eaten away and the boat was a total loss. I have always believed that having two anchors out was the problem. The wind hid us abeam and neither one could hold a proper set.
Yeah that is always the danger of anchoring in close or in a small cove, but I always pull one anchor against the other to be sure both are well set, and if I am hit broadside, which rarely happens, but if I were, I'd switch to pulling the stern rode to the bow, or hitch to the stern rode and pull the line to the bow, make sure I have anti-chafe stuff ready and let it ride Bahamian style. Or I'd just clear out of there.
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Old 15-03-2016, 15:19   #87
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

Conditions in which we've used a stern anchor:
1) everyone else is anchored bow and stern (crowded anchorages)
2) on about 1.5:1 scope off the stern quarter to keep boat from swinging into reef
3) to keep the bow into a swell where the wind was inconsistent, so springing the boat off the anchor rode wouldn't work
4) med mooring (like Boatie)

Hurricane anchorage.... In the hurricane areas of Queensland, Fiji, New Caledonia, people shelter in mangrove creeks. Still, one's boats' safety will depend on the cyclone strength. Usually there is mud where there are mangroves, so while it is a coral area, the actual anchorage area is muddy.

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Old 15-03-2016, 20:32   #88
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

I recently used 2 bow anchors while anchored off of sandy spit overnight in BVI. This is because the crappy barely sized delta on our charter boat was dug but dragging1-2 inches every time the boat swung, despite 8:1 chain scope and snubber. I wanted to sleep, so dug out the danforth type spare from stern and set off of bow. It actually did reduce our swinging.
But on my boat, in rocna I trust. I could see stern anchoring in very calm conditions in which I want to cove anchor, eg. But I like to be head to wind for air circulation in cabin, so can't see wanting the boat not to swing with wind.


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Old 16-03-2016, 17:26   #89
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

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I recently used 2 bow anchors while anchored off of sandy spit overnight in BVI. This is because the crappy barely sized delta on our charter boat was dug but dragging1-2 inches every time the boat swung, despite 8:1 chain scope and snubber.
+1

You did well to pick this. Underwater I often see these slow drags, especially with convex plow anchors. The anchor does not dig in any deeper, but slowly moves backwards with each gust. The normal cues of dragging such as the transits rapidly changing and the boat turning broadside to wind are absent and most skippers are unaware that they are dragging.

It is worth trying to recognise, as it is an indicator that the anchor is under a lot of stress and there is a risk the anchor will break out into the more familiar and easily recognised normal rapid drag.

Reducing the swing and therefore the times that the boat is presenting itself side on to the wind will help holding, especially on a boat that is sheering around excessively. There are numerous ways of doing this, such as a riding sail, but a second anchor, even one on quite a short scope can be effective and is worth considering. A good design and size of anchor, as you have on your boat, is much simpler and ultimately more reliable.
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Old 16-03-2016, 18:41   #90
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Re: When to Set a Stern Anchor?

And noelex- I credit your pictures on your anchor thread. I almost didn't notice the dragging at first when I dove, but then saw the telltale puffs of sand. Then I put rocks next to the anchor as a marker and 15 minutes later the anchor was 12-18 inches back.


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