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Old 08-04-2015, 13:39   #1
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Used genoa - keep or return

Since my old roller reefing genoa resembles an old potato sack I recently ordered a used genoa in "very good condition", as advertised, along with a main sail.

Now, the genoa is actually in a nice condition. Problem is, it's clearly not the sail that the seller (company) posted. The cut is different, measurements don't check and the promised foam luff is missing. My main problem is with the measurements. The luff is short by about 40 cm from promised and the foot about 50 cm. Besides the 2,5m2 of "lost" sail area I'm worried about halyard wrap when furling. Also, really wanted the foam luff and retrofitting one probably doesn't make sense economically.

The problem I have is that the seller does not have a suitable replacement. Assuming I would get a full refund for the sail (seller is not in my home country, but within EU so even return/refund may be problematic), getting a new genoa made to spec by a sailmaker here would probably take too long to have for the start of the season (and costing about 4x as much).

I guess the options are:
- keep the sail, manufacture a pennant to cover the shorter luff and request for partial refund
- return the sail requesting full refund, order new sail from sail loft and be stuck with potato sack at least for the beginning of the short season + paying a lot more
I'm only in 500 eur for this sail and I guess it will outperform the old one, so I am considering keeping it. Any ideas?

Another thing was the main: condition and measurements as advertised, BUT: came without battens. It has full batten pockets. Possibly a shipping issue getting the close to 4m long battens to Finland, still annoying. I guess can make them myself, or order from local sail loft, if I can't get them from the seller - any experiences with this?
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Old 08-04-2015, 14:13   #2
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandibar View Post
Since my old roller reefing genoa resembles an old potato sack I recently ordered a used genoa in "very good condition", as advertised, along with a main sail.

Now, the genoa is actually in a nice condition. Problem is, it's clearly not the sail that the seller (company) posted. The cut is different, measurements don't check and the promised foam luff is missing. My main problem is with the measurements. The luff is short by about 40 cm from promised and the foot about 50 cm. Besides the 2,5m2 of "lost" sail area I'm worried about halyard wrap when furling. Also, really wanted the foam luff and retrofitting one probably doesn't make sense economically.

The problem I have is that the seller does not have a suitable replacement. Assuming I would get a full refund for the sail (seller is not in my home country, but within EU so even return/refund may be problematic), getting a new genoa made to spec by a sailmaker here would probably take too long to have for the start of the season (and costing about 4x as much).

I guess the options are:
- keep the sail, manufacture a pennant to cover the shorter luff and request for partial refund
- return the sail requesting full refund, order new sail from sail loft and be stuck with potato sack at least for the beginning of the short season + paying a lot more
I'm only in 500 eur for this sail and I guess it will outperform the old one, so I am considering keeping it. Any ideas?

Another thing was the main: condition and measurements as advertised, BUT: came without battens. It has full batten pockets. Possibly a shipping issue getting the close to 4m long battens to Finland, still annoying. I guess can make them myself, or order from local sail loft, if I can't get them from the seller - any experiences with this?
If it were me I'd return the genoa for a full refund and order the sail you need for your boat or try to sell it to someone in your area for the price you paid.

These sorts of things happen with us here in Hawaii. Not so much with sails but with other boat gear that we must get used through eBay or craigslist because there aren't any used boat gear stores or shops in the islands. Sometimes things just don't match their description and we have to send things back to the seller at our expense. Luckily it doesn't happen often but just often enough to make you leary of some sellers.

Good luck in whatever you choose to do about your sail.

kind regards,
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Old 09-04-2015, 10:35   #3
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Thanks John, will try to settle with seller. Actually noticed seller's item no. on the genoa. It's not the sail I ordered. Still have a small hope this was a mistake and not intentional so I can have the original.
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Old 09-04-2015, 11:03   #4
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

I'm not sure why you'd get halyard wrap with a short luff. You just need a pendant at the top to make up the 40cm. This is how my 83% blade is set up.
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Old 09-04-2015, 13:35   #5
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandibar View Post
Thanks John, will try to settle with seller. Actually noticed seller's item no. on the genoa. It's not the sail I ordered. Still have a small hope this was a mistake and not intentional so I can have the original.
Yes, let's hope it was an honest mistake and can be sorted out in your favor.

I just ordered sails from Florida and I'm here in Hawaii. I hope they don't make that kind of mistake. The company I'm dealing with has been good to me in the past so I don't really anticipate a problem.

kind regards,
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Old 09-04-2015, 15:13   #6
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Let me guess -- Westaway, AKA Exchange Sails, of Torquay?
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Old 10-04-2015, 01:20   #7
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Mark - yes, will use a pendant if I keep it, that's easily solved. The smaller size and missing foam can't be fixed (eonomically) and are issues that I'd rather avoid on the furler.

Dockhead, not naming any names until I get hold of the seller. Would this be the MO of the Torquay company?

I really don't want to be stuck with my old sail, which is only really usable downwind, for the season. Otherwise return and refund would be the obvious answer. As it is I'm still hoping that the original ordered sail would be available. Naive hope, I know
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Old 10-04-2015, 03:17   #8
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandibar View Post
Mark - yes, will use a pendant if I keep it, that's easily solved. The smaller size and missing foam can't be fixed (eonomically) and are issues that I'd rather avoid on the furler.

Dockhead, not naming any names until I get hold of the seller. Would this be the MO of the Torquay company?

I really don't want to be stuck with my old sail, which is only really usable downwind, for the season. Otherwise return and refund would be the obvious answer. As it is I'm still hoping that the original ordered sail would be available. Naive hope, I know
Yes. I was also a victim. You will read dozens of horror stories if you do a search on ybw. They sell sails which don't exist and then send whatever they have lying round.

What usually happens is that you will eventually get your money back, but only after months of aggravation.

Do not naively think that the right sail is there somewhere. The story will just be repeated.
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Old 10-04-2015, 12:06   #9
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

Damn. I knew it was risky ordering used sails. The price on these was too tempting, i.e. 1/4 of the price of new (in Finland) for 8-9/10 condition. I know, if it's too good to be true... but thought I'd risk it anyway. Would understand if the seller would quote the condition a bit upward, but sending out something totally different is just nasty, if it's intentional.

Will see how this pans out.

On a positive note, got a lot done on the boat today. Impeller is changed, which on this boat is absolutely the worst spring chore. Also started deck re-coat with Kiwi-Grip, very happy with ease of application and result.
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Old 10-04-2015, 13:13   #10
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

I have good things to say about Second Wind and Bacon.
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Old 10-04-2015, 13:27   #11
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Re: Used genoa - keep or return

If you keep the genoa add a pennant to the top of the sail so the furling roller is hoisted to the top/normal location. If you don't, the sail can wrap the halyard around the stay and you'll be in deep doo doo. Hoisted a shorter jib without pennant in the Marina on a calm day just to see how it set. Tried to furl it and the halyard wrapped after only a few revolutions of the furler. Had a hell of a time getting the halyard to unwrap without going up the mast. If that had happened in anger, might have had to cut the sail/halyard to get the sail off the stay.

Battens are normally shipped coiled up and taped together so they don't unwrap. Can usually get the coil down to a size that will fit in not too large flat box for mailing. Seem to remember someone saying that long battens are pricey. Might want to see if the seller could send you the battens for the sail if they still have them.

The outfit you bought the sails from seem a little dodgy. A full battened main without battens is only partially complete and exchanging the jib for another doesn't seem right.
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