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Old 20-08-2017, 20:24   #16
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

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Originally Posted by SecondBase View Post
In some situations speed IS security - that may be a reason. Of course the use of speed increases, not decreases, the need for effective collision avoidance.
What a load of bollocks!
Control and situational awareness are the key factors of security.
Blind speed is a cowboy's solution and should never be part of a normal transit thru dense waters in busy shipping lanes.

In COREGS it is called "Safe Speed"
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Old 20-08-2017, 20:37   #17
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

reintroduction of responsibility concept will solve the problem.

In old USSR engineers/architects that made mistake were shot.

That sure helped.
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Old 20-08-2017, 20:51   #18
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

This really is astounding!

Such similar incidents, in such a short period of time.

. Shaking my head.
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Old 20-08-2017, 21:07   #19
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

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Should a DDG under steam ever be in a collision w/ a tanker? No.

But let's save the political commentary until the findings okay? The Navy has been underfunded and maintained low readiness because its been on the back burner since 9/11. 15+ years of continuous war without the country being really mobilized for war.

10 sailors are missing. Have some respect.
I agree, the point of my post is out of respect for our Americans in uniform and the tragic loss of life that could have been prevented, we're not discussing box cutters here...

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Old 20-08-2017, 21:15   #20
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

It is being reported that the McCain lost steering. (CNN)
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Old 20-08-2017, 21:31   #21
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SV DestinyAscen View Post
Should a DDG under steam ever be in a collision w/ a tanker? No.

But let's save the political commentary until the findings okay? The Navy has been underfunded and maintained low readiness because its been on the back burner since 9/11. 15+ years of continuous war without the country being really mobilized for war.

10 sailors are missing. Have some respect.

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5 injuries and 10 missing crewmembers. Once again our prayers
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Old 20-08-2017, 21:31   #22
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

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Originally Posted by arsenelupiga View Post
reintroduction of responsibility concept will solve the problem.

In old USSR engineers/architects that made mistake were shot.

That sure helped.
Doesn't make sense these days because the office boys on shore are setting the accident-prone rules and their number 1 rule is "pass the buck so we don't get shot."
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Old 20-08-2017, 21:58   #23
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

Latest from Singapore (check straitstimes.com and look at top right for updates):

Search and rescue under way for 10 missing sailors after US warship collision off coast of Singapore, United States News & Top Stories - The Straits Times
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Old 20-08-2017, 22:09   #24
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

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10 sailors are missing. Have some respect.

Seems unlikely, but I hope they're found safe.
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Old 20-08-2017, 22:17   #25
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

Malaysian news story includes a chartlet:

US Navy destroyer collision: Malaysia assisting in search for 10 sailors - Nation | The Star Online
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Old 20-08-2017, 22:37   #26
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

I hope they find those 10 sailors safe.

Being on a DDG myself, I cant even imagine what could have possibly happened in both this and the Fitz's case. It does seem rather coincidental that only 2 months later a near identical collision happened. But in times of high traffic (at least on my ship), everyone is extra cautious, we maintain a safe speed, and we have extra lookouts. I really don't get it.
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Old 20-08-2017, 22:41   #27
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

Fourth collision this year involving the US Navy and commercial ships.

Edit: Oops sorry, one incident was a grounding.
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Old 20-08-2017, 22:51   #28
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

To make that chartlet a little more comprehensible:

1. sovereignty of these waters is under a small cloud. The International Court of Justice made a ruling in 2008 about the sovereignty of some of the features shown, but did not rule unambiguously on others. Malaysia is seeking to retest those ICJ decisions.

2. The chartlet in The Star is taken from a Malaysian chart, so

* the green box and arrow pointing to waters enclosed by a green polygon is 'potential Singaporean water"

* the yellow box "Batu Puteh" (Melayu = English "white rock") is what is called on Singaporean charts "Pedra Branca" (Portuguese = English "white rock") and on all charts is dominated by the Horsburgh Light

* the yellow box "Abu Bakar Maritime Base" points to a recently established base of the Malaysian Maritime Enforcement Agency (a dock with a jetty extending to a rock, when I last saw it) on what you'll find on international/English language charts called "Middle Rock" (you'll see ("Middle Rock") under the Melayu name). Middle Rock has Malaysian sovereignty. The sovereignty of South Ledge, just a little SW of Middle Rock, is ambiguous.

* the red dot and red box is self-explanatory

* the magenta bar is the separator of the Traffic Separation Scheme of the Singapore Straits.
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Old 20-08-2017, 23:14   #29
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Mighty View Post
To make that chartlet a little more comprehensible:

1. sovereignty of these waters is under a small cloud. The International Court of Justice made a ruling in 2008 about the sovereignty of some of the features shown, but did not rule unambiguously on others. Malaysia is seeking to retest those ICJ decisions.

2. The chartlet in The Star is taken from a Malaysian chart, so

* the green box and arrow pointing to waters enclosed by a green polygon is 'potential Singaporean water"

* the yellow box "Batu Puteh" (Melayu = English "white rock") is what is called on Singaporean charts "Pedra Branca" (Portuguese = English "white rock") and on all charts is dominated by the Horsburgh Light

* the yellow box "Abu Bakar Maritime Base" points to a recently established base of the Malaysian Maritime Enforcement Agency (a dock with a jetty extending to a rock, when I last saw it) on what you'll find on international/English language charts called "Middle Rock" (you'll see ("Middle Rock") under the Melayu name). Middle Rock has Malaysian sovereignty. The sovereignty of South Ledge, just a little SW of Middle Rock, is ambiguous.

* the red dot and red box is self-explanatory

* the magenta bar is the separator of the Traffic Separation Scheme of the Singapore Straits.
While this is interesting, perhaps I could be excused for thinking the sovereignty of these waters matters not as far as the USN is concerned; but I would like to be proven wrong...

On a brighter note, it does seem like all the players are assisting in the search for the missing sailors.
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Old 20-08-2017, 23:29   #30
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Re: US Navy Destroyer Collision Again!!!

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While this is interesting, perhaps I could be excused for thinking the sovereignty of these waters matters not as far as the USN is concerned; but I would like to be proven wrong...

On a brighter note, it does seem like all the players are assisting in the search for the missing sailors.
You're correct, Wotname. The sovereignty matters not at all in the collision.

I was just trying to explain some of additions to the chartlet, to put it in context.

And yes, both Malaysia and Singapore are assisting.

Singapore has more closely aligned itself with the US of late (there's a residential area of Singapore that if you wander into you quickly find yourself talking to Singaporean authority figures, because that residential area is home to several defence-related US families; and Singapore has caused a minor rift in its formerly close relationship with China by its leaning to the US, to the point that it recently made a Chinese-born US national working as an academic in Singapore an unwelcome alien and claimed that he, the alien, had sought to influence Singaporean decision makers).

Malaysia has recently increased its economic integration with China (big developments in Malaysia being constructed by Chinese companies and funded by debt to both Chinese companies and the Malaysian govt). And rumours that Malaysia is about to buy some missiles from China (the rumours have been denied). Malaysia however has a track record of military cooperation with US and other forces. As well, of course, of rumours and records of corruption (involving everything from buying submarines from France that cannot submerge in tropical water to private persons (and perhaps the prime minister) diverting money from a Malaysian govt investment fund to buy luxury property in NY City, fund a Leo de Caprio movie, and gift gems etc to female movie stars and the wife of the person the US Dept of Justice refers to as "Malaysian Official No. 1".
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