Two cruising boats missing in the Pacific

[daletournier]

Another drift. Im currently at Thursday island (top of Australia). While waiting for a ferry today I struck up a conversation with a guy that happened to be a search and rescue pilot up here.

The below I already knew, but it was good to hear directly from a search and rescue pilots mouth. Doing grid searches from the air its almost impossible to find someone. Hes done his fare share and said just trying to stay focused was incredibly difficult, throw in some white caps and its almost impossible to find someone.

Epirbs, hes done two searches recently (not yachts) with 100% success and in minimal time due to both vessels in distress having ebirps.

I know the above is obvious but it reinforces to me that ive made good investments in modern technology, ebirps and inreach.

Also completely agree with the dont be lazy with maintenance and inspections, im climbing the mast tomorrow.

[hpeer]

Just some musings.

Comparisons to other activities are difficult for any number of reasons. Partly because there are different types of sailing.

Single handed long distance racing is more like climbing a challenging peak. Both are risky.

Crossing the Pacific or Atlantic is a bit more like living in tornado alley. Or maybe living in a very dangerous neighborhood. The environment (meteorological or social) can change quickely. There are some indicators and better seasons so a boat should avoid most problems. A house is fixed. A bit ago a shrimp boat was hit by a waterspout and three were lost.

If you live and long distance cruise on a boat it's more like living in a RV where you tour the country. They are not the most road worthy vehicles. And you don't do Yellowstone in winter. But you may get hit by a tornado in Kansas in August. And some of those things, RVs just look scary on the road. Top heavy, swevering all over, being driven way too fast. Then there are then it ones based on a bus that look pretty good. I'll bet there are different accident stats on those two types.

The fellow I linked above is a very active 81, just finished a circumnavigation in a 30' plywood boat. I watched him in the yard where he hauled for some work. Lots of guys loafing around talking about what they are a gonna do. Jack came in, got to work, and got out to get on with his travels. The man is full of life and vigor.

I hope the over due boats are found in good order. My Wife had a scare about me one time, mostly because she didn't pay attenetion when I told here my plans. Hard to get a non-sailor to understand. She called the Coast Guard and they found me, safe, dry, and warm where I was supposed to be. Embarrassing. But as an upshot I now carry an Iridium phone. No sense putting loved ones through unnecessary heart ache. I've since used it to report my delayed arrival and change of plans due to mech failure. The pain of uncertainty hurts both of you in the long run. Nothing funny about it.

[hpeer]

Dale,

Re visual spotting, I agree. I did a turn in the USCG as a radioman aboard C-130 and HU-16 aircraft. Part of my the problem is you loose sense of how high you are. You fix something in your mind and look for that. But then you see a tanker and realize it's much smaller visually than you anticipated and wonder if you would have missed the sailboat.

Then there is the fatigue. We would change out observers every 15 minutes I think. After that you can't stay focused see on the task. Your mind wanders. You daydream. Zone out.

We would occasionally find folks but an unaided visual search is very, very difficult.

[zeehag]

was awakened by a dinging sound htis am -- was notification of a message from ali.
ok so A boat has been spotted in the general area. whether sea nymph or celebration or a third now also overdue hawaii to hiva oa is still unknown.
it is still too far out for the air craft searches.
when ali learns the name she will allow me to know that info and i will post here. they are tracking it and will fly over tuesday
so perhaps some family and friends of someone will know what is happening with a loved one.

[hpeer]

Longjonsilver,
Could not reply to PM, too many stored messages.

Try this....
Fleetwoods Circumnavigation - Jack Van Ommens Travels

Or google "Fleetwoods Circumnavigation"

[rallyman1122]

Originally Posted by Guy

Save it. Think about those WW1 pilots drinking and flying.

That was 100 years ago. We know much more about the effects of alcohol and other recreation substances now than we did a 100 years past.

What a foolish post!!

[zeehag]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Guy View Post
Save it. Think about those WW1 pilots drinking and flying.
That was 100 years ago. We know much more about the effects of alcohol and other recreation substances now than we did a 100 years past.

What a foolish post!!
rallyman1122

funny we know but how does knowing affect the physiology... it doesnt. besides you gonna go out into other flying things without a good belt under your hat?

the flyers in ww1 KNEW they were not going to be going home. whatsa lil nerve steadier... i do better after a few swigs.. wonder how many would have returned had they been sober.

[barnakiel]

Originally Posted by svseachange

I'm not lecturing you on anything. Just pointing out crossing the Pacific is a relatively dangerous activity. Important for people to know this before they set out.

If the sailor is ignorant and their boat is rubbish, it is relatively more dangerous than when the sailor is good and their boat is sound.

Another factor is that should any sailor become incapacitated, help is further away in space and time. A car driver can drive, or get a drive, to the nearest hospital. A sailor not all this much so. But this is why we are doing offshore sailing (and many other outdoor sports) - to feel a bit closer to the real thing.

The best F1 drivers are not into it for money. Money comes along. They want thrills. Sailors want thrills too. And bikers. And fly fishers. We all take risks and not just because we cannot avoid them but rather because the risks make us feel alive. I will even jump higher and claim many of us seek risks. Stock market participants and pregnant women definitely do.

People who are setting off for long offshore passages, if we do not know there are dangers in every day life, we counted as lunatics. Will get hurt whether we stay or whether we go. If one looks at actuarial tables she finds getting born is easily the most dangerous thing in our life. Not sure how many of us would pass the chance though.

Crossing an ocean does not bring any extras over our daily load of risk exposure - because while one is more probable to fall overboard and drown at the same time we are far less likely to get run down by a car. And so we cannot claim crossing an ocean is anything but like our daily (land based) life. (*)

b.

(*) - does not apply to people who are trying to learn highline walking and skip all the nonsensical preparatory exercises done walking the lowline chalked white across their backyard.

[hellosailor]

dw-
US authorities (DOJ, etc.) consistently reported something like 1/4 million "missing persons" in the US every year. And that's at home, on land, surrounded by civilization. Some apparently want to disappear, i.e. leaving abuse. Others are crime victims, murdered or kidnapped and never found.

So boats disappearing? Not so much. Bear in mind that is also often a case of a solo sailor crossing large distances, something that violates all laws and cautions since a "proper watch at all times" is a basic safety need, and there's no way to keep watch while you're fatigued or sleeping.

If you walk in traffic, or down dark alleys and lanes alone...you're rolling the same dice.

[Zven]

Originally Posted by zeehag

the flyers in ww1 KNEW they were not going to be going home. whatsa lil nerve steadier... i do better after a few swigs.. wonder how many would have returned had they been sober.

We are going a little off topic here but ...

Apparently, at some point in the 1980s there was an experiment done in Denmark: Researchers wanted to find out if a limited dose of alcohol was good or bad for driving.

The main conclusion was that a small amount, like one pint of beer or one glass of wine, caused drivers to perform better than average.
More than this, and the driving was worse than average.

Why would a limited amount of alcohol help to deliver better driving?
Nobody knows, but an obvious guess would be that while the senses would become slightly less alert, the drinker-driver would also be more relaxed and easy-going, more forgiving, less stressed. This would translate to lower speeds and giving others more space.
The latter effect could conceivably more than balance the former, and lives could be saved overall.
Of course, the whole thing was most politically incorrect, even in Denmark. Swept under the carpet and never considered again.

[hellosailor]

Zven, rashly assuming that's all correct, it could easily be explained by the fact that the drivers KNEW they were being tested, so they were focusing and concentrating on the job. Especially after drinking.

Ever see someone change lanes without a turn signal? Yeah, they're not focused on the task at hand. Distracted driving, cell phone, kids making noise in the back, argument with the passenger, all the same thing.

People don't know how to FOCUS anymore.

[Dave_S]

Originally Posted by Zven

We are going a little off topic here but ...

Apparently, at some point in the 1980s there was an experiment done in Denmark: Researchers wanted to find out if a limited dose of alcohol was good or bad for driving.

The main conclusion was that a small amount, like one pint of beer or one glass of wine, caused drivers to perform better than average.
More than this, and the driving was worse than average.

Why would a limited amount of alcohol help to deliver better driving?
Nobody knows, but an obvious guess would be that while the senses would become slightly less alert, the drinker-driver would also be more relaxed and easy-going, more forgiving, less stressed. This would translate to lower speeds and giving others more space.
The latter effect could conceivably more than balance the former, and lives could be saved overall.
Of course, the whole thing was most politically incorrect, even in Denmark. Swept under the carpet and never considered again.

We used to race motor cross bikes and on practice days we would have a BBQ and a light beer for lunch. After that one light beer we were significantly more likely to crash, and usually in the first couple of turns.

[dannc]

Lets get back to driving vs sailing. The comparison that was made was three months of sailing vs three months of driving. This is not a fair comparison.

The boat/crew sailing across the ocean for three months/90 days, is sailing 24 hours a day for that time period.

A car/driver will only be on the road for a few hours a day. The difference in time spent driving vs sailing over three months is vastly different.

The average American spends 17,600 minutes a year in a car which is 293 hours. That equates to 12 days of driving if one drove 24 hours a day. Americans Spend an Average of 17,600 Minutes Driving Each Year | AAA NewsRoom

To put that another way, the average US driver is on the road for 12 full days each year.

To more correctly compare driving vs sailing for three months, one would have to compare 7.5 years of driving vs 3 months of sailing. 90 days sailing divided by 12 days driving = 7.5 years.

Later,
Dan

[JPA Cate]

zeehag,

Thanks for trying to keep this thread on track.


Your sense of Mr. Carr, is he a practical, boat-competent sort of guy? If so, his chances of a successful journey are much better.

Still keeping my fingers crossed for him.

Ann

[CaptJamesCook]

For Mr Carr and the. Others Godspeed through the day and night