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Old 08-03-2015, 04:54   #121
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
It is true that drivers with the right of way have certain obligations to avoid accidents, but that does not mean being a stand-on vessel and having the right of way are the same thing. They are in fact totally different, and it's important to understand those differences. I'll start a separate thread on it when I have time.
Well, when you have time I'd be interested in reading about it.
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Old 08-03-2015, 05:07   #122
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Youre right, there is no such thing as "right of way" on the water.
If that's correct why do marine regulations refer to the 'give way' and 'right of way' vessel?

Oh, I know why, your going to quote the common adage that 'right of way' doesn't appear in the Colregs.
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Old 08-03-2015, 05:09   #123
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

I just noticed this comment on the video in youtube

Know the people on board. They got caught by the southerly buster. forestay snapped, sail blown out, major rigging and equipment failures including steering.
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Old 08-03-2015, 06:27   #124
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
If that's correct why do marine regulations refer to the 'give way' and 'right of way' vessel?

Oh, I know why, your going to quote the common adage that 'right of way' doesn't appear in the Colregs.
Which ones?

Of course. Since when has discussing colregs, in a thread about a collision, been OT?
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Old 08-03-2015, 06:49   #125
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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...forestay snapped...
The forestay was intact at the time of the collision, that is clear from the video. It may have come loose when the bow got knocked off by the ferry, though that did not contribute to the collision.

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Old 08-03-2015, 08:29   #126
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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The forestay was intact at the time of the collision, that is clear from the video. It may have come loose when the bow got knocked off by the ferry, though that did not contribute to the collision.

Sent from my XT1080 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

Yeah, I looked at the video a couple more times after reading the comment and the forestay was looking intact before the collision.


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Old 08-03-2015, 10:26   #127
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
If that's correct why do marine regulations refer to the 'give way' and 'right of way' vessel?
They do not indeed refer to "right of way vessels". They refer to "stand on vessels".
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Old 08-03-2015, 10:58   #128
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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They do not indeed refer to "right of way vessels". They refer to "stand on vessels".
Major difference between "right of way" and "stand on". If you don't understand the difference, you need to study the Colregs again
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Old 08-03-2015, 11:11   #129
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

My Father and 2 uncles used to the two 34 ft fibreglass and one 35 ft steel yacht. When we sailed together, the uncle on the steel boat always had "right of way"
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Old 08-03-2015, 16:00   #130
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Yeah, I looked at the video a couple more times after reading the comment and the forestay was looking intact before the collision.
Here we go ... horse's mouth versus video evidence ...
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Old 08-03-2015, 16:10   #131
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

Well the video is the only evidence we have that a collision actually happened.
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Old 08-03-2015, 17:17   #132
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Well the video is the only evidence we have that a collision actually happened.
Yep. It's comforting to know that if you ever make a mistake, some fool will record it and post it on the Internet for thousands of strangers to see and criticize even though they weren't there to know what actually happened. What a use of technology!
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Old 08-03-2015, 17:18   #133
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Originally Posted by hoppy View Post
I just noticed this comment on the video in youtube

Know the people on board. They got caught by the southerly buster. forestay snapped, sail blown out, major rigging and equipment failures including steering.
If it had been me and I wasn't under oath I'd be saying it was aliens wot dun it....

Forestay may have snapped... post collision
Sail blew out.... pre collision
major rigging failure ...post collision
equipment failure including steering... most likely just that she wouldn't answer the helm... we have already discussed that.

So... pretty much as the skipper described it.
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Old 08-03-2015, 18:08   #134
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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Here we go ... horse's mouth versus video evidence ...
Perhaps the collision caused the forestay to break. Besides, what do horses know about sailing ?
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Old 08-03-2015, 18:22   #135
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Re: T-boning a Ferry in Sidney

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They do not indeed refer to "right of way vessels". They refer to "stand on vessels".
'Rule 17 Action by stand on vessel' is the only place the expression is used and then in the body it refers to the vessel 'required to keep her course and speed'

I must be missing something here.... mind you when I inhabited a previous world we would in general terms refer to , 'give way ship', who has the 'right of way', and who was the 'stand on vessel'. In fact I'm sure such expressions were used by me in orals... and I seem to recall passing them.
The need to repeat the regs word perfect was dropped from the British system in about 1964 btw.

What there is rather a lot of is 'give way vessel' and 'keep out of the way of'.

Bit easier saying 'the stand on ship' than parroting ' A vessel, the passage of which is not to be impeded' or 'the vessel required to keep her course and speed'.

I think way too much has been read into posts 55 and 61.

Bloody hard tracking down a proper copy of the regs ( my copy here on the campo is for the 1960 regs and - rather strangely - has been autographed by Johnny O'Keefe) but I did find this http://www.yachtingaustralia.com.au/...ty/COLREGS.pdf
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