Sym Or Asym Spinnaker for Panama to Marquesas?

[Dave22q]

Simple tradeoff, safety and ease of sailing v. optimizing speed. If not racing, an asym with sock or a code zero on a furler seems preferable.

[akprb]

Originally Posted by 2big2small

Yep, on the Bene 50. I have all the symmetrical gear except for the sail. Buying an asym with sock or especially with furler would be a much bigger hit on the budget. I’m looking at used and new but would prefer used if I found something in reasonable shape which so far I haven’t seen yet. If I’m not going to use it that often it might as well be used.

I agree about the asymmetrical being easier (read safer).

We didn’t break ours out until the run from Bora Bora to Samoa. Even then didn’t use it much.

Catamaran so very easy to fly.

Good luck!

[morpheus]

We crossed from The Galápagos to Hiva Oa in 2017 and the predominant direction was dead down wind, we had squalls most days so even if we had a spinnaker I would not have flown it as there was only myself and my wife on board. We did fine with a poled out Genoa which was easy to reef when the wind started to build. If I was doing this passage again I would install a code zero on a furler system as this can be used through various wind angles.
If you want to get a flavour of our crossing its on our blog at
Passage to the Marquesas: Days 1-3 | Morpheus of London

enjoy your passage

[a64pilot]

Why not run two head sails, your Jib poled out and a Code Zero not on a pole?
Unless DDW, you don’t need both on a pole?

[Taipe]

For the S. Pacific, I'm considering using a furled drifter. The concept of using a lightweight sail with a stout bolt rope sewn into the luff that furls independently w/o foils on a forestay, is new to me. Only just saw an ad for this last year. This allows for the versatility of two foresails wing & wing, one on the forestay, though when not running before the trades, it would require it's own whisker to keep it filled, and maybe even then.
However, for myself, I am already using an Alado furler which has two channels in the fairings, allowing one to carry two sails wing & wing.
If you left from Puerto Vallarta, you could likely head west on a beam reach for the better part of a week before turning south when you reach the point of having the trades directly behind you.

[Qayaq]

I did that trip in 2010 via Galapagos. We used a an old symmetrical but had it tied down to the bow to make it easy use, also used a snuffer, so an assymetrical would have been the choice if money was available for it., with a top down furler.
It would urge caution on using it in the ITCZ. Coming out of Panama before getting down to the Trade winds proper. Especially at night as when the cloud base lowers the down droughts become more frequent. We carried a small and big chute, blew out the small one in the ITCZ and a very nice lady in Galapagos sewed it back together for us, she normally did clothing repairs but managed to sew up the 20ft tear in the chute and it worked afterwards.
Galapagos to Hiva Oa, ran the big chute (normal size for our boat) for 8 days and nights constantly and a few other occasions, would have been at a loss without it. It's nice to have a small chute as well for easier handling. We were 2 handed.
Hope that helps.
Cheers Simon

[chouliha]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Why not run two head sails, your Jib poled out and a Code Zero not on a pole?
Unless DDW, you don’t need both on a pole?

This is our standard tradewind downwind running configuration. 2 poles and two headsails. One on the head stay and the other on the solent stay. No main.

Easy to carry even with the wind 140 - 180 degrees

Chuck
Jacaranda

[JPA Cate]

The passage from Panama to the Marquesas is a light winds deal, or so I've heard. My own experience is from Cabo San Lucas to the Marquesas, and in a smaller mono than the OP's. We went wing and wing, mostly.

Not a symmetrical kite, the ocean swells try to roll the air out of it. Also, it's a large sail to handle essentially singlehanded, when something gets twisted in the sock. On our first trip to the Societies, we flew our symmetrical kite one time only. At the time, it was the only sail that would move the boat, it was that light, and had been so for the seas to be almost flat.

We have found we are able to pole the larger headsail out to windward, and let the smaller out to leeward. You can do this with the full main, or reef the main down, and over-trim it, to limit rolling.

The only Code Zero I ever saw stowed, was a huge item to stow, with its furler. It was for a 47 footer, so not as big as the OP's would be. If you leave it up for months at a time, the sun will kill it, saw one of those, too.

Honestly, that is a long passage, and possibly the kindest solution for your family would be a nanny, that would allow you and your good lady to share watches. A long passage like that, an extra day or two in its length is irrelevant. If you're content to sail slowly, I'd think you can manage the passage with your existing plain sails. You are the one who knows your boat's light air performance characteristics, best, and you might want a larger genoa for that section of your passage.

Ann

[a64pilot]

Our Code Zero stows in a bag about the size of a big laundry bag, what surprised me though is it's weight, must weigh at least 50 lbs. Likely more.
I leave the furling mechanism, endless furling line etc up, I remove the sail of course but connect the Halyard to the furling drum and tighten it so it's as if the sail was still there.
Our does have a UV sacrificial strip, I think it may just be light sailcloth, you can tell it's no where near as effective as heavy sunbrella. Gut feeling is if you leave it up for too many months, the sacrificial strip will have to be replaced, but at least the sail should still be good.
I leave ours down and stowed unless I think I will get a chance to fly it.
It's not hard at all to put up, even when sailing. It hoists up through the Fwd Stateroom hatch. Much less work than I thought it would be. Be a real bear to drag it on Deck up the companionway.

[Snowpetrel]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Why not run two head sails, your Jib poled out and a Code Zero not on a pole?
Unless DDW, you don’t need both on a pole?

This is my favorite downwind rig. Haven't used it with a fancy code sail yet, just hank on drifters to leeward but it works a treat in light sloppy stuff when any kite tends to get the wind shook out and risks a wrap around the forestay. I normally lead the leeward sheet out to the end of the boom.

It might be worth getting in touch with my brother Booboo (Josh Tucker). He has just done the same trip on a bene50 with two kids. Be warned that he is a hardcore racer though and isn't too fazed about running big kites in marginal conditions. Best to get him on facebook as rogue sailing family. They are in the Tuamotos at the moment.

[captmikem]

i would hate to cross the pacific without a symetrical chute in a sock. one crossing (just my wife and i) on an 80 ft cutter it was one of our most used sails. we had carbon fiber poles to keep the weight managable, and i would choke the guy fwd about six feet and oversheet the sheet a bit (and a bit more at night) so you do not have to tend it much.
i had a hard rule that we would douse it at 20 kts, and we followed it mostly.
Also used Martin breakers which greatly simplifies dousing.
a truly wonderfuj sail.

M

[Dr. Sea]

Originally Posted by Pete7

We fly our CC with just one sheet, no pole, no guys and a keep it simple approach. To jibe we lower the sock and walk the sheet around, move the sail and hoist the sock. Its a two minute job.

Why not use 2 sheets? Would’t that make it easier and potentially safer?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Our Code Zero stows in a bag about the size of a big laundry bag, what surprised me though is it's weight, must weigh at least 50 lbs. Likely more.
I leave the furling mechanism, endless furling line etc up, I remove the sail of course but connect the Halyard to the furling drum and tighten it so it's as if the sail was still there.
Our does have a UV sacrificial strip, I think it may just be light sailcloth, you can tell it's no where near as effective as heavy sunbrella. Gut feeling is if you leave it up for too many months, the sacrificial strip will have to be replaced, but at least the sail should still be good.
I leave ours down and stowed unless I think I will get a chance to fly it.
It's not hard at all to put up, even when sailing. It hoists up through the Fwd Stateroom hatch. Much less work than I thought it would be. Be a real bear to drag it on Deck up the companionway.

My code zero has the uv protective strip. In an area like now where I use it more I leave it up. See below the answer to the question of durability that I asked Travis of Mack sails:

Hi Dale,

*

The cover is intended to allow the sail to stay up for months at a time.* I just recommend if you know you will not use it for a couple weeks you might want to drop it to save UV exposure. *Most customer will leave it up unless it won’ t be used in a while, they are leaving the boat for a week or more or doing a breezy upwind passage.

*

Some customers have not taken them down for many *years and then will need to have a new cover installed after 3 or 4 years of continuous sun exposure.

*

Thanks,

*

Travis

[JPA Cate]

^^^#28

I read this with some interest. I suppose it will really depend on the weight and type of sacrificial protection.

Still, a Bene 50 sails well, and while it might go faster with the Code Zero, the plain sail rigs are more easily managed by a singlehander. The OP said it was his wife, him, and two small kids. Rarely are there going to be two adults on deck at the same time, unless they take on crew or nanny.

Fatigue is the real challenge of shorthanded crews. It is the more conservative choice to use only plain sail, imo, for a couple with two small children, with everyone's sleep requirements.

Ann

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by JPA Cate

^^^#28

I read this with some interest. I suppose it will really depend on the weight and type of sacrificial protection.

Still, a Bene 50 sails well, and while it might go faster with the Code Zero, the plain sail rigs are more easily managed by a singlehander. The OP said it was his wife, him, and two small kids. Rarely are there going to be two adults on deck at the same time, unless they take on crew or nanny.

Fatigue is the real challenge of shorthanded crews. It is the more conservative choice to use only plain sail, imo, for a couple with two small children, with everyone's sleep requirements.

Ann

I'd agree. Even though the furler makes life much easier it's still a sail you must respect. It's a big sail on a Beneteau 50, you realise this when things go wrong.