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Old 04-07-2016, 06:29   #1
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Stack packs stink

I asked about stack packs before, but I didn't have a picture to show what my problem was. So, this is what I get every time I try to raise the main. With another person steering the boat into the wind, it took me approximately 30 minutes to get the sail up with the three battons constantly snagging on the lines.

There's about 6 inches of space between the two lines and you get maybe two seconds from the time the sail swings from one side to the other in order to start hoisting. There's no possible way one person can do this by themselves.

For anyone who spots that the jib was up when I attempted this, it was because my starter battery was dead and I could not have the engine in gear while this was going on, for steerage. The same thing happens when I do not have the jib up.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e3...psukviqrvq.jpg
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Old 04-07-2016, 06:51   #2
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Re: Stack packs stink

I think you need to redesign the lazy jack system.
1) I see from the picture that the lazy jacks go direct to the mast, a better set up is to route the upper part of the system through the spreaders, maybe about 12 to 18" out from the mast, that give a much better separation between the two sets of lines.
It might involve drilling a small hole through each spreader (and fit rubber grommets), or you may be lucky, and the holes are already there.

2) Device a system to bring the lazy jacks forward to the mast prior to the hoist, that gets them out of the way altogether.

I usually bring the lines forward prior to getting underway, and secure the sail to the boom with ties.
Underway, the jib/genoa is set, and I sail close hauled. Ease down the traveller and main sheet, remove ties, hoist main, point boat in the right direction, trim, and then reset the lazy jacks ready for lowering the sail (but not too tight to avoid chafe on the lines and sail.
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Old 04-07-2016, 06:54   #3
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Re: Stack packs stink

Hoist from the mast and you can give the leech a quick tug right before the battens meet the lazy jack line. If no one is with you to tail the line, take the end of it up to the mast with you by going around the winch to act as a fairlead redirecting it forward. This will get the sail up 95%. Then go back to the winch, put turns on it and go up the rest of the way.
It's actually much faster to hoist from the mast not to mention much less tiring.
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Old 04-07-2016, 06:55   #4
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Re: Stack packs stink

Thanks, number 2 sounds like the least invasive option. My next problem will be that these lines are frayed and need to be replaced and I have no idea how they are run in the bag. You can't open the bag to work on it.
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Old 04-07-2016, 06:58   #5
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Re: Stack packs stink

Some idea's in this thread as well
Keep my Lazy jacks?
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Old 04-07-2016, 07:01   #6
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Re: Stack packs stink

Quote:
Originally Posted by weinie View Post
.
This is helpful as well. I think my halyard is plenty long enough.
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Old 04-07-2016, 07:13   #7
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Re: Stack packs stink

I should have mentioned that the stack pack works extremely well in dropping the sail.
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Old 04-07-2016, 07:23   #8
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Re: Stack packs stink

I have bought 4 Mack Packs-all from Mack sails. They are not perfect-perhaps Lazy Bags _(from catamaran world) are better as the lazy jacks terminate at top of the bag envelope instead of being threaded thru it to the boom., Macks allows the fabric envelope to 'sag down' , making the envelope smaller in which the mainsail must fit--have made stops inside top grommet to help this-but Mack should provide these but do not. Best way is to have long boathook handy to untangle batten ends from lazy jacks as sail comes down and a well greased sail track!!!
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Old 04-07-2016, 07:36   #9
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Re: Stack packs stink

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Originally Posted by Madwand View Post
Thanks, number 2 sounds like the least invasive option. My next problem will be that these lines are frayed and need to be replaced and I have no idea how they are run in the bag. You can't open the bag to work on it.
Thats my personal preference too. The control lines for mine go thru a block on the mast and then down to a cleat (one each side) at about boom level. Makes it easy to "furl" the stack pack vertical lines for raising the main. Often I just do this on one side and slightly favor that side with the main while raising. Makes it much easier. This set up also allows the verticals to be adjusted, for example if you change the setting of your topping lift.
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Old 04-07-2016, 08:39   #10
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Re: Stack packs stink

A quick fix - shock cord from the spreader tips to the lazy jacks to open them up, also pull the end of your boom up abnormally high with the topping lift before raising the main.
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Old 04-07-2016, 09:15   #11
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Re: Stack packs stink

i like how they look after tropical storms... shredded... and these same folks are the ones i hear yapping about windage in storms... ok...
the top of stack pack also collects rainwater. the height of the coverings for the stack pack is taller than my radical anteek sailcover.
i see no one prepping for cyclonic events by wrapping these stack packs with lines. nope none. then they wonder why the rig is destroyed when they return to sail boat in november or december.
i thank the investments of others as i watch for research and development of my own rig.
so far, simple and old fashioned seem best and least pricey ways to go.
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Old 04-07-2016, 09:21   #12
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Re: Stack packs stink

It's got a nice looking zipper along the length of it, but it doesn't work.

I wish there was a way to obtain a diagram of how the thing is made because there are ropes going into it everywhere and I have no clue what most of them are for. One of the lines that I found is apparently one end of the reefing system. No idea how you are supposed to get to the second reefing point with it. And then there are the stack pack lines themselves that are about to fail and need replacing but I have no idea how to feed them through the eyelets to their anchor points.
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Old 04-07-2016, 18:16   #13
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Re: Stack packs stink

SailRite has a discussion of making stacking boom bags, that might make the construction clear to you.

Next time you have the main up, look at how the first reef is rove. See if your sail even has a 2nd reef, not all do. You should be able to figure out how to attach a 2nd reef line. Usually, it is tied to the boom, underneath where the 2nd reef clew is, from there it goes aft, through a turning block, and then forward, out through a sheave (if internal) or you'll have an external block to turn it to the reefing winch. Measure to determine the length.

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Old 04-07-2016, 19:01   #14
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Re: Stack packs stink

There are two sets of grommets, I assume 2 reefing sets. The first one on the bottom near the end of the boom has a line coming from the bottom of the bag somewhere, up through the grommet, down back to the Boom, forward to a cleat with a big knot tied in the end of the line.

I would assume that you used this same line for the second reef except for the fact that they tied a knot in it and it won't pass through the grommet, for whatever purpose. I don't know what you were supposed to do on the boom end, there are no hooks or lines or anything that I recognize.
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Old 04-07-2016, 19:30   #15
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Re: Stack packs stink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madwand View Post
I asked about stack packs before, but I didn't have a picture to show what my problem was. So, this is what I get every time I try to raise the main. With another person steering the boat into the wind, it took me approximately 30 minutes to get the sail up with the three battons constantly snagging on the lines.

There's about 6 inches of space between the two lines and you get maybe two seconds from the time the sail swings from one side to the other in order to start hoisting. There's no possible way one person can do this by themselves.
Hmm... When I bought my boat, it had a Mack Pack installed, and I didn't think I would like it. Now I think it's great. Granted, for a 30 foot boat it might be overkill, but the main on my boat would be a beast to gather up out of the cockpit and flake onto the boom, tie down and cover all by yourself. I went out singlehanded today and it was no problem at all. Looking at the pic, I have to ask if you are releasing the mainsheet when you hoist. If the lazyjacks are taut, then yes, it would be hard to get the main up without snagging. And it is important to keep the boat headed into the wind, but I seem to manage. (Usually)
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