Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 13-03-2016, 06:23   #151
Registered User
 
MYTraveler's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 166
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizzy Belle View Post
This number is now floating around as if we know for a fact what the costs were. We do not. Could me more, could be less - we simply don't know.

Since that number is based on a % of the value of the boat, which wouldn't have lasted forever on that reef, it might very well have been worth whatever the costs are. Maybe his insurance that might have covered (part of) the costs, assuming he has any.
Unless the fee had been negotiated in advance, no one knows the cost -- it is a matter of negotiation. And, given the apparent certainty of loss without immediate salvage, and the risk to the salvor, as evidenced by the damage it incurred, 20% may be far less than the salvor was asking. That is where insurance comes in -- they not only pay the bill, but negotiate the amount and in the meantime defend against claims.
__________________

__________________
MYTraveler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 06:23   #152
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,189
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Actually it was started by 1st responders who when they found their RIB's insufficient to deal with the situation advised professional assistance which one presumes was done by the Skipper/Owner.
So far neither of them have commented so the rest is the usual speculation.
Monte.. being amongst the 1st responders has tried to keep us informed however truth be told, on the money and reason for the 'Runner'.. it is not relevant to my mind other than when one hires someone to do a job there's usually a fee to be paid on completion.
The owner can bluster and bullshit all he wants but he was in the wrong if he sailed without notifying his rescuer of his plans.. which apparently he did not.
Its usually folks with money who pull this stunt funny enough.. they'll buy a 300K boat then try and welch a $20K bill from the delivery skipper..
Wonder if the Skippers defenders are looking for ways to welch without getting caught..
__________________


Born To Be Wild
boatman61 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 06:36   #153
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,828
Images: 25
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MYTraveler View Post
That is where insurance comes in -- .
Maybe the insurer told them to head to another country?
__________________
MarkJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 06:59   #154
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,189
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
Maybe the insurer told them to head to another country?
I want to know who he's insured with in that case... they're not usually that quick..
__________________


Born To Be Wild
boatman61 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 07:58   #155
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 429
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Is the cost of repairing whatever damage the salvage boat suffered yet known - and is there evidence of that damage being sustained during that particular incident?
I ask because I don't remember ever seeing a salvage boat without significant unrepaired damage.

$11,000 doesn't sound much compared to previous estimates of the value of that yacht but for a rescue lasting (less than?) a day it seems like very good wages to me.

If your house is burning and the fire department demands $11,000 before they'll begin to put out the fire would that be reasonable?
If the fire department was a private business would that make it reasonable?

What if your neighbour takes advantage of your desperation and demands, say, $1000 to borrow his hose pipe?
Would you feel that was perfectly reasonable because your house is worth $5million and it's insured anyway?
Would you later meekly pay up, turn the other cheek and thank him or would you be incandescent with rage and tell him to sue you?

Let's say you were in Monte's place but had succeeded in pulling that large, expensive boat to safety - would you demand a large payout?

If that large expensive boat were yours would you insist that a fellow sailor accept such a sum despite his protestations or would you instead insist on buying him dinner?

Despite how it must seem I'm genuinely not supporting either side, just wondering out loud about the rights or wrongs of this thing while I put on the asbestos suit
btw you can call it negotiating rather than demanding if you like but a desperate person is in a poor position to negotiate.
__________________
unclemack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 08:16   #156
Registered User
 
stillbuilding's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hong Kong
Boat: Custom Freya 20m
Posts: 961
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
Maybe the insurer told them to head to another country?

Actually, this seems quite possible - even likely. If I were in that situation I would be ringing my insurer as soon as a salvage was completed or even sooner.

Could be heaps easier for the insurers to negotiate in a territory of their choice so ...


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forums lily hhrn
__________________
stillbuilding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 08:19   #157
Eternal Member
 
monte's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Australia
Boat: Lagoon 400
Posts: 3,650
Images: 1
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

I think leaving a country without clearance pretty much qualifies it as a runner ..
__________________
monte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 08:33   #158
Registered User
 
Lizzy Belle's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Netherlands
Boat: Ohlson 29
Posts: 1,522
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by stillbuilding View Post
Actually, this seems quite possible - even likely. If I were in that situation I would be ringing my insurer as soon as a salvage was completed or even sooner.
To me it seems unlikely an insurer would ask you to leave a country without clearing customs ...

Since he was sitting on that reef for a while, he had time to contact them before accepting the tow.
In that case, an insurance company can weigh the options and might even pick up the bill cos the tow would mean a lesser pay-out then letting her go down (if covered at all, obviously).
__________________
"Il faut Ítre toujours ivre." - Charles Baudelaire
Dutch ♀ Liveaboard, sharing an Ohlson 29 with a feline.
Lizzy Belle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 08:55   #159
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 429
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by monte View Post
I think leaving a country without clearance pretty much qualifies it as a runner ..
If it was leaving when it hit the reef might it have already cleared out? Obviously I don't know the area or routes.
If so and after the rescue he wasn't able to clear in again (night time?) could a skipper believe he was still cleared out and therefore legally obliged to leave - or is that nonsense?
No idea how the system works there or anywhere else, just wondering.

I don't see that an insurer advising a skipper to leave a country could make an illegal act legal or an immoral one moral though - for either party.
__________________
unclemack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 09:22   #160
Freelance Delivery Skipper..
 
boatman61's Avatar

Community Sponsor
Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK/Portugal
Posts: 20,189
Images: 2
Send a message via Skype™ to boatman61
pirate Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

From the sound of it this is a company.. if so they have crew wages to pay and commercial insurance rates.. from what I gather some damage was inflicted on the rescue vessel to boot.
Example.. in SMX I priced a basic SS solar arch made to measure from two companies Dutch side.. quotes were $4.5 to $5.5K.. got it done by a one man show French side 'with' the addition of fittings for a dinghy davit system and provision for fitting a wind gen each side.. a work of art for just $3K..
Companies cost more.. fact of life.
Something else.. in my search for a boat in 2000 in flew into Antigua to look at a Tri.. it was on a mooring and the guy who was doing the Guardianage wanted $100 to dinghy me out to it to view.. its not just companies that do this.. liveaboards try it on as well
__________________


Born To Be Wild
boatman61 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 10:23   #161
Eternal Member
 
monte's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Australia
Boat: Lagoon 400
Posts: 3,650
Images: 1
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Yes the rescue vessel had some damage. Nope he wasn't cleared out, hence customs and immigration wanting to have a word. The Rescue operator asked the chopper to take some pics of the boat on the reef to show the situation as he has had others run in the same circumstances. I guess he won't be rushing to pull any of us off the reef in the future..
__________________
monte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 10:39   #162
Eternal Member
 
monte's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Australia
Boat: Lagoon 400
Posts: 3,650
Images: 1
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Speaking of reef rescues. We pull quite a few off the incorrectly charted reefs around here. This cat hit the reef full tilt at about 7kt and actually lifted a few inches above the waterline in the process. Both keels were hard aground but undamaged. Tried pulling her off with a stern anchor and eventually managed with around 80hp of dinghies plus the cats engines. I was actually about to give up on this one but someone else's persistence paid off. This is about the 4th or 5th that have hit the reef in the same place over the past couple of months.
Click image for larger version

Name:	ImageUploadedByCruisers Sailing Forum1457887144.742587.jpg
Views:	212
Size:	80.8 KB
ID:	120597
__________________
monte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 10:44   #163
Registered User
 
Island Time O25's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,019
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by monte View Post
Speaking of reef rescues. We pull quite a few off the incorrectly charted reefs around here. This cat hit the reef full tilt at about 7kt and actually lifted a few inches above the waterline in the process. Both keels were hard aground but undamaged. Tried pulling her off with a stern anchor and eventually managed with around 80hp of dinghies plus the cats engines. I was actually about to give up on this one but someone else's persistence paid off. This is about the 4th or 5th that have hit the reef in the same place over the past couple of months.
Attachment 120597
I wonder how much would installing a nav warning stick would cost? Or would the locals rather keep charging for the rescues?
__________________
Island Time O25 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 11:56   #164
Registered User
 
malbert73's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Boat: Tartan 40
Posts: 1,032
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

What a shame for the marine life....


Sent from my iPhone using Cruisers Sailing Forum
__________________
malbert73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-03-2016, 11:58   #165
Registered User
 
Dr. Sea's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Annapolis/ BVI
Boat: Oyster 55
Posts: 194
Re: Salvaged yacht does a runner...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boathooked View Post
Dang, what is going on with this world were so little compassion remains for anyone? Especially in the sailing community?
It's not about love and compassion. It's about honor, gratitude, character, responsibility, and integrity.
__________________

__________________
Dr. Sea is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
salvage, yacht

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale: 45' Yacht ruined: parts salvaged for sale Charles S Classifieds Archive 44 19-04-2014 15:42
Luxury Yacht on Runner Runner shadow Monohull Sailboats 4 23-12-2013 20:50
Triple Stars Salvaged Blue Stocking Atlantic & the Caribbean 8 13-07-2012 09:36
For Sale: Salvaged Stuff woodymr Classifieds Archive 98 20-03-2011 16:38



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:00.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.