Power boat accident on the Hudson

[Rakuflames]

CNN had a story today about a collision on the Hudson River. Young couple, engaged, decided to go for a boat ride at night on the Hudson. They didn't say where it happened; it was a sound bite, and I can't research it further.

But in any case, their power boat hit a barge being towed. We just talked about that problem -- of recognizing what all the signal display lights mean -- not that long ago. The unfortunate couple didn't know what they were looking at in the dark, I'm sure. According to CNN's sound bite, the bride was killed and the groom thrown free. He was knocked unconscious but somehow survived, and now someone has been charge with manslaughter. I didn't catch who (it was in the first five words or so of the small amount of information) but I'm afraid it was the groom.

Once again we'll never really know what happened. If I had teens and lived near such high-traffic commercial boating, right now I think I would make flash cards and DRILL them. They wouldn't have to own a boat. All they would need is a friend with a boat, and it could be them. Right now it looks like basic life safety in some places to know that stuff, like teaching your children to swim. We lived in an area where lots of people had pools, and my daughters tried to refuse to go to swimming classes, so I said OK, then let's list all the friends' homes I won't let you go to ...

they started cooperating. I wasn't looking for fabulous form, just the ability to save themselves.

All they needed on that power boat was ONE person who could say "Look out -- that's a a tugboat towing a barge!"

Lots of speculation possible. Someone in that area could get the facts but my point is -- in some places knowing how to interpret those boat lights can be the difference between life and death -- and in this case, possible jail time.

[nigel1]

Probably this incident.
Boat operator charged in Hudson River crash; engaged couple on board - CNN.com

The barges were anchored, possible that alcohol was involved

[Hud3]

Here's a pretty detailed account...

Boat Operator Charged

Very sad.

Apparently the barge was anchored, and had been since April. I've seen a few construction barges anchored in the Chesapeake with no lights, or at best a very dim light on one end. They're very hard to see against a dark shoreline, but that's no excuse. Running at planing speeds in the dark demands detailed local knowledge and absolute vigilance.

Of course, if you're intoxicated, like the boat driver in this case, all bets are off.

[David M]

If the barge was improperly lit and the boat operator was intoxicated then both parties share responsibility. In collisions the USCG frequently assigns fault to both parties.

[boatman61]

Another candidate for the 'Darwin Award'.... he lived but its only a matter of time....

[cappy208]

I regularly pass by these (3) barges. They ALWAYS are lit with white all around anchor lights. The barge that was hit was anchored down and illuminated by the bridge floodlights too!

Unfortunately this is truly a sad story, involving a Darwin Award, and a very sad outcome.

This particular barge has been anchored near the bridge for over a year. It does get periodically moved from location to location as the job progresses. But it has been near this particular location for months.

The barge is not the fault.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by cappy208

I regularly pass by these (3) barges. They ALWAYS are lit with white all around anchor lights. The barge that was hit was anchored down and illuminated by the bridge floodlights too!

Unfortunately this is truly a sad story, involving a Darwin Award, and a very sad outcome.

This particular barge has been anchored near the bridge for over a year. It does get periodically moved from location to location as the job progresses. But it has been near this particular location for months.

The barge is not the fault.

I was thinking about my daughters, and how carefully I taught them to drive, and how I made absolutely sure they both knew how to swim, so they could save themselves. I wonder how many boating parents (esp. power boats, I think they tend to be more casual) teach their children what they *really* need to know to be safe on the water?

It reminds me of when i was a child in Florida. We didn't have the concerns then about drunk drivers that we do now. it wasn't given much attention. I remember the man across the street (who was a Pan Am pilot) waving good bye as he pulled out of his driveway -- with an open beer in his hands. It was illegal to drive in your bare feet but not while drinking beer. Does the power boating culture encourage learning to read boat lights? Would they have the big discussion we had about it?

[cappy208]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

Does the power boating culture encourage learning to read boat lights? Would they have the big discussion we had about it?

I don't believe any boating 'culture' encourages the 'reading of the lights' as it were. This is only done upon hours of experience, when a user (you, me, other people) realize that there is something that they DON'T know. What I see is that the people who don't realize there is a knowledge vacuum are the exact problem. Most (not all!) of the people who read this forum are at least aware of the issue. (Think Scoobert) But even scoobert realized something was amiss.

These topics are the parts of sailing (whichever propulsion you use) that are more 'art' than absolute. Meaning, the fine tuning that is needed is done with practice and repetition, rather than just study by rote.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by cappy208

I don't believe any boating 'culture' encourages the 'reading of the lights' as it were. This is only done upon hours of experience, when a user (you, me, other people) realize that there is something that they DON'T know. What I see is that the people who don't realize there is a knowledge vacuum are the exact problem. Most (not all!) of the people who read this forum are at least aware of the issue. (Think Scoobert) But even scoobert realized something was amiss.

These topics are the parts of sailing (whichever propulsion you use) that are more 'art' than absolute. Meaning, the fine tuning that is needed is done with practice and repetition, rather than just study by rote.

That's a good way to put it -- knowledge vacuum.

i don't see hope for people like Scoobert because he only wanted to hear what he wanted to hear. And I don't know what the answer is. To get my driver's license I had to identify stop signs, etc. Should we be licensing boaters? Personally, I think so, but I can imagine the uproar among those who see it as over-regulation.

We actually have law to cover this particular situation, because one huge problem is that the boat operator was intoxicated. But I (and everyone else here) am at risk if i'm a anchor with idiots like him out on the loose.

[rgscpat]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

....Does the power boating culture encourage learning to read boat lights? ....

Cabin or cockpit lights can also be useful for those powerboaters who already know how to read. But, they shouldn't be on when that might interfere with the skipper's view.

Also, the motion of the boat might be too much of an additional challenge for power boaters who want to learn how to read. A quiet home setting, school, library, or tutoring program might be a better place, and natural daylight lighting can work quite nicely, as well.

It is good, though, that at least some powerboat manufacturers are supporting literacy programs and helping their boat owners become more educated by installing the learning-to-read boat lights. Perhaps they could also provide something like a McGuffey's Primer, updated for modern times and customized for powerboat owners, and with lots of nice pictures.

[evm1024]

Some people learn as a matter of course. Others need to learn by hard knocks (and the death of others). Some think that all you need to know about "the rules of the road" are listed in a piece of paper like the one in this photo. (middle right, Boat US)

Hopefully Scoobert will drop his bluff and pay attention to what others say without the attitude. It is a MYSTERY to me why anyone would not INCorporate a good attitude. Without one you just have a MEDUSA on your hands.

What do you think Josh? Time for an attitude adjustment?

Sorry for the thread drift.

[markpierce]

Originally Posted by Rakuflames

Does the power boating culture encourage learning to read boat lights? Would they have the big discussion we had about it?

Definitely. Look up "U.S. Power Squadron."

[keepondancin]

I am no way coming to the operator's defense. I pass by that area quite often, and had been wondering how difficult it would be to see the numerous barges that are anchored both north and south of the TZ Bridge. There was one that was quite a bit away from the others, on the south side. I would venture a guess that they were lit according to CG requirements. However, I would imagine it would be difficult to distinguish the barge's lights against the lights of the bridge, and the lights on shore , especially at the low angle the power boat would be at. I was coming into NY Harbor, at night, crossing the shipping channel at a ninety degree angle, focusing on the lit Aids to Navigation, only to realize I was focused on a traffic blinker on shore. That was pre chart plotters. Add in friends out for a good time, distracting the operator, and the probability of some alcohol being involved, and you could see how it happened. From the photos being shown, there doesn't seem to be a huge amount of damage to the boat, which may indicate the boat may not have been traveling at a high rate of speed. Like so many other boating disasters, they are usually a combination of events that cause the incident. Again, this is not to defend the operator.

[cappy208]

Originally Posted by markpierce

Definitely. Look up "U.S. Power Squadron."

As with the thought that 'just having' a USCG license (or AYA, RCYC ETC ETC ETC license) does NOT make one competent. Simply attending a course is not enough. It is the constant practice and repetition that hones these skills. Just attending a three week, one night a week course is not enough to maintain parity. Introduction, yes. Competence, No.