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Old 21-10-2014, 10:12   #16
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

it is good to practice when alone and not around other boats,sailing off anchor and sailing into harbour, without engine on ,should only be done in emergencies. Remember other boaters can get either;
at best a heartattack,at worst a damaged boat, not good form Ole
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Old 21-10-2014, 10:34   #17
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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I'm with Sailorboy, you have an engine... use it. Why complicate things?
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Old 21-10-2014, 10:47   #18
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

First break out the anchor. This can take some time.

When the anchor is broken out you can lower it back down to the bottom. Adjust the scope so that it just holds. In most wind conditions it will need little scope. At a very short scope the anchor will dig in very little.

If the boat does not swing the right way by adjusting the lead point with a rope and rolling hitch will solve the problem.

At this very short scope the anchor will not set well and can be easily picked up as the sails fill.
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Old 21-10-2014, 11:10   #19
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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First break out the anchor. This can take some time.

When the anchor is broken out you can lower it back down to the bottom. Adjust the scope so that it just holds. In most wind conditions it will need little scope. At a very short scope the anchor will dig in very little.

If the boat does not swing the right way by adjusting the lead point with a rope and rolling hitch will solve the problem.

At this very short scope the anchor will not set well and can be easily picked up as the sails fill.
Nice. Good idea. This way I won't drift back as far as I would by backing the jib, etc. to swing the bow around.
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Old 21-10-2014, 12:49   #20
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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Nice. Good idea. This way I won't drift back as far as I would by backing the jib, etc. to swing the bow around.
My thought is that there would be less backward motion by backing the jib by hand to make the desired tack. There is no point further away from the vessel's pivot point than the jib and I don't see anything making the turn faster, certainly not anchoring twice. In addition, there would be no reason to reset the anchor to wait for the desired swing of the bow. You can choose the timing to break free the anchor from a vertical position of the rode and backing the jib to augment an already favorable moment.

The best thing for you to do is to try a few of these different plans when you are not in a confined space and choose what suits you best. Part of the anwer will be related to wether you have a manual or electric windless; how "hands free" and how "mud free" your hands are when raising your anchor.

I have a manual horizontal windlass that allows me a good feel for the remaining grip that I have on the bottom and I can backwind my jib with free hands before I complete raising my anchor out of the water. l also have my very experienced wife at the helm with excellent hand signals which rarely includes a single raised center digit!

All of my participation with this question has been assuming a crew of two. My plan would be different if I am alone or of the anchor is raised from the cockpit.
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Old 21-10-2014, 13:58   #21
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

Thanks, HF. You're right that we should play with things a bit. Yes, we're a crew of two and my wife is usually the one back in the cockpit. She's skilled and has a keen sense of when things are going pear shaped while I've got my head down fiddling with the anchoring gear.
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Old 21-10-2014, 14:27   #22
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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You can choose the timing to break free the anchor from a vertical position of the rode and backing the jib to augment an already favorable moment.
Well, I'm not so sure about that, Hudson. The OP was talking about the situation where the anchor is very well dug in, and quite hard to break out. We experience this fairly often, and can't time the actual breakout moment well at all. One gets the rode vertical and taught and waits for the rise and fall of the bow to break it out... and who knows when that will happen! In such conditions, the idea of then dropping the hook back down to await ideal positioning of the bow makes good sense to me, for then it IS possible to time things closely.

An interesting idea that is new to me!

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Old 21-10-2014, 14:30   #23
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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Thanks, HF. You're right that we should play with things a bit. Yes, we're a crew of two and my wife is usually the one back in the cockpit. She's skilled and has a keen sense of when things are going pear shaped while I've got my head down fiddling with the anchoring gear.
It's just that, back at the helm, we can see a lot of stuff that you guys can't when you're concentrating on something else. The one on the helm has to pay attention to EVERYthing! It isn't just a keen sense of thing going pear shaped, Mrs. Wyckham is totally knowing it is about to--absolutel certainty!

Cheers,

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Old 21-10-2014, 14:54   #24
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

The Danforth will have the same problem after being on the bottom for quite a while... or in Mud. I've had them just pull the bow further into the water with the windlass instead of coming out. Usually takes motoring over and past the anchor with the chainstopper on to break free...
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Old 21-10-2014, 15:03   #25
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

Hmmm.... 'thinking about the Cates' responses and more variables. I'm considering my own anchoring along the US East Coast & Bahamas. This adds another variable to the timing. Ninety percent of my anchoring is in water 12 to 15 feet deep and the remaining ten percent stretches to a maximum of 35 feet with most all of this being in sand or mud.

There's no doubt that if I followed my plan and things went wrong, I would be quick to re-anchor and try again; however, this has not been my experience. I guess once you put the factor of not being able to know well that you are breaking free and time the event, then my experience is lacking. Could it be that it's easier to sense your impending point of breaking your anchor free when you are in relatively shallow water? I don't know, but I suspect that either this is the case or I've just been lucky.

What do you think?
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Old 21-10-2014, 15:19   #26
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

I'm not sure what anchor you're using HF, but for me the difference came with moving to a Manson Boss. It's the first time I'd ever had to break out an anchor by powering forward with the engine.

Usually, as the Cates say, I can just bob up and down over top of it, continually tweaking the chain up a bit with the windlass and it will slowly work its way up out of the mud.
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Old 21-10-2014, 15:41   #27
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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I'm not sure what anchor you're using HF, ..........................
This is another variable and I should say that most frequently I get underway from anchor under power. As of yet, I have not sailed off from anchor with my Mantus. This takes me one step further from posting to the specific topic of this thread; however, over the 43 years that we have been liveaboard cruisers we have most often sailed off a Bruce preceded by a Harborfast Hi-Blade, CQR, North-Hill and back in 1971-2 a Danforth. ...times do change!
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Old 21-10-2014, 16:28   #28
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

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Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
I'm with Sailorboy, you have an engine... use it. Why complicate things?
I also agree. We are 37 tons; Rocna 54; all 7/16 chain rode. I always use the engine, if for no other reason - I want power on while I operate the windlass. I want no surprises when we become free. You can get away with manual backwind & jib on a light vessel but the down side risk is too great if you are heavy.
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Old 21-10-2014, 16:38   #29
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

IMO, the OP's 35 ft. Niagara is fully capable of being sailed off its anchor safely, and also think keepiing the skills to do so is prudent.

For those with less nimble boats, maybe this doesn't apply, usually maintenance is done well enough that the oil filter gasket doesn't fail. The time that happened was with a 3rd world made filter, and we were unprepared for it to fail.

Incidentally, another cause of engine unavailability can be fish line, and floating line, of course, then it's the prop that's stopped, with the loss of control, but is an example of another time when having practiced will give you skills to fall back on, rather than panic, which although it may not be a factor for CF members, may be for newbies.

Ann

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Old 25-10-2014, 03:00   #30
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Re: New Gen Anchor Problem- Sailing off Anchor

My anchor winch sucks a hell of a lot of amps so I just about always run the engine while retreiving the anchor.All they are is a starter motor.My bruce anchor usually wont break out until I am right on top of it usually the boats momentum pops it out as I travel over it.
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