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Old 23-02-2013, 20:11   #1
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Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

Probably an ignorant question but I'm new to sailing so here goes:

I'm sailing a Capri 22. Slip is almost directly head to wind. I walk the boat out of the slip and once perpendicular to the slip and pointed down the fairway, I step aboard.

Once on board, I am on a beam reach headed toward the fairway and my question is, how do I get enough boat speed from a dead stop to sail without slipping/drifting to leeward (where other boats are in their slips) in very light winds (2-4 knots)?

I could use the outboard motor but I enjoy the challenge of sailing into and out of the slip.

Thanks
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Old 23-02-2013, 20:25   #2
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pirate Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

Get on sooner and push off... your waiting to long
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Old 23-02-2013, 20:26   #3
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

The capri 22 is a very agile boat and reacts to movement easily.
One of two ways to gain forward movement easily is to scull the boat using your.body weight and.the movement of the rudder (tiller).from side to side. Once practiced you become very effective in moving the boat forward.
The second way is to use your body weight again rocking.the boat from side to side with the main tied to the center and tight.
I got good enough with my capri.that with the tiller tied off , I would stand forward of the mast with hands on the rigging and rocking the boat from six to side, not hard at all to keep itmoving forward at 2or better knots..
Sculling if so effective that its against the rules in racing as it will move you at a good pass when winds are lite.
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Old 24-02-2013, 07:07   #4
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

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The capri 22 is a very agile boat and reacts to movement easily.
One of two ways to gain forward movement easily is to scull the boat using your.body weight and.the movement of the rudder (tiller).from side to side. Once practiced you become very effective in moving the boat forward.
The second way is to use your body weight again rocking.the boat from side to side with the main tied to the center and tight.
I got good enough with my capri.that with the tiller tied off , I would stand forward of the mast with hands on the rigging and rocking the boat from six to side, not hard at all to keep itmoving forward at 2or better knots..
Sculling if so effective that its against the rules in racing as it will move you at a good pass when winds are lite.
Thanks for the suggestions but what if the boat were a little larger-say a Catalina 28? How does one make headway from a dead stop on a beam reach in very light winds without drifting/slipping to leeward? Is it better to start out with jib and main, or cat rigged with main alone? Do you ease the sheets/sails more than normal (normal being a well trimmed beam reach when under sail in open water) and then trim them in once underway?
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Old 24-02-2013, 13:16   #5
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

Frog, you should not be sailing out of your slip. That is why you have an outboard motor to safely allow you to enter and transit a marina. You won't impress any real sailors by your antics since a marina is not a place to practice your sailing skills where you might damage another's boat. Most marinas, mine included, have strict rules prohibiting this practice. Why not be considerate of others boats and practice your sailing skills where an accidental jibe or tack will not effect anyone but you. This practice is what we call "hotdogging" and it has the opposite effect on serious boaters who care about their boats than you might think. Why not respect your neighbors. You'll certainly be much more welcome at the dock. Good luck and good sailing.
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Old 24-02-2013, 14:10   #6
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It's a Capri 22, and he probably has insurance. People smash into each other all the time under power, I don't see this as hotdogging. People can judge for themselves whether I'm a "real" sailor or not.

Anyway, try not sheeting in so tight. You could also rig a line bow to stern that's looped around a cleat on the edge of the dock if that makes sense. So the boat will be T-boned of sorts. Might give you second to get on board and ready everything before releasing the line.

And to the above poster, warping is certainly an element of seamanship and the only place to practice it is the tight confines of docks and marinas.
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Old 24-02-2013, 14:17   #7
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

I'd have to agree -- it doesn't sound like he's trying to impress anyone or that he's hotdogging. That seemed a little harsh to me.
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Old 24-02-2013, 14:33   #8
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

It is a violation of terms of the lease at my marina to sail in or out.

BUT there are ways to do it safely.

Try running a long lead from your inshore bow cleat to the next finger pier forwars, or maybe even to the next one after that. Haul yourself briskly forward and you should get some way on, and also shear away from the dock. If you need more distance off, use a midship spring line cleat.

You could also try tossing a line to someone clear on the other side.

An oar would help too. Lots of ways to use an oar or a pair of oars to get a boat that size moving.

The best way is to just use your motor. No contest.
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Old 24-02-2013, 19:27   #9
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

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Frog, you should not be sailing out of your slip. That is why you have an outboard motor to safely allow you to enter and transit a marina. You won't impress any real sailors by your antics since a marina is not a place to practice your sailing skills where you might damage another's boat. Most marinas, mine included, have strict rules prohibiting this practice. Why not be considerate of others boats and practice your sailing skills where an accidental jibe or tack will not effect anyone but you. This practice is what we call "hotdogging" and it has the opposite effect on serious boaters who care about their boats than you might think. Why not respect your neighbors. You'll certainly be much more welcome at the dock. Good luck and good sailing.
First, I respect other people's boats as much as if they were my own. Second, I have no desire to impress anyone with my sailing skills (or lack of them). Third, the textbook for the ASA 103 exam, SAILING FUNDAMENTALS, says the ASA Basic Coastal Cruising standard states (among other things), "You should be able to anchor the boat, reef the mainsail, change the foresail, and safely negotiate the boat in and out of it's slip under sail or power."

I interpret this to mean that sailing in and out of a slip is a skill worth mastering.
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Old 24-02-2013, 19:42   #10
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

Good question and I used to sail in and out with a Catalina 22 fin keeler all the time. Lucky you have the wind on your beam once you slide out of your slip.
I found that the more I sheeted in the more I slipped sideways. Both main and jib are needed to keep the tendency to slip from happening. If your headsail is too large then it will also make you slip more. I'd try a few times using the working jib and full main in light air and make certain they both are sheeted all the way out and just drawing enough to move you. Push the boom out by hand until it hits the shrouds. Once you get moving then you can haul the sails in a bit when they just start to luff.
Good luck in your experiment. Each boat handles a bit differently and its good you are figuring this out in a non-emergency situation.
Everyone should be practicing landings under sail. If your marina outlaws it I'd find a new marina that caters to sailors.
kind regards,
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Old 24-02-2013, 19:58   #11
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

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Good question and I used to sail in and out with a Catalina 22 fin keeler all the time. Lucky you have the wind on your beam once you slide out of your slip.
I found that the more I sheeted in the more I slipped sideways. Both main and jib are needed to keep the tendency to slip from happening. If your headsail is too large then it will also make you slip more. I'd try a few times using the working jib and full main in light air and make certain they both are sheeted all the way out and just drawing enough to move you. Push the boom out by hand until it hits the shrouds. Once you get moving then you can haul the sails in a bit when they just start to luff.
Good luck in your experiment. Each boat handles a bit differently and its good you are figuring this out in a non-emergency situation.
Everyone should be practicing landings under sail. If your marina outlaws it I'd find a new marina that caters to sailors.
kind regards,
Thanks for the suggestions and support. Fortunately (or unfortunately), our club and marina(s) here in southern California have no such prohibitions, but we do have insurance.
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Old 24-02-2013, 20:47   #12
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

I would simply get on the boat, let the wind ease me back out of the slip, and then fall off and catch the wind as the stern swung around. In a light responsive boat that's not should not be a problem.
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Old 25-02-2013, 10:04   #13
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

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It's a Capri 22, and he probably has insurance. People smash into each other all the time under power, I don't see this as hotdogging. People can judge for themselves whether I'm a "real" sailor or not.

Anyway, try not sheeting in so tight. You could also rig a line bow to stern that's looped around a cleat on the edge of the dock if that makes sense. So the boat will be T-boned of sorts. Might give you second to get on board and ready everything before releasing the line.

And to the above poster, warping is certainly an element of seamanship and the only place to practice it is the tight confines of docks and marinas.
Rebelheart, I am not aware of any marinas in the continental U.S. that do not require insurance for a slipholder. If that were the case, I doubt there would be many boats in that marina. Secondly, I don't know what marinas you have kept your boat in the past but I have never seen "People smash into each other all the time under power." It sounds like some mad hatter manipulating a pin ball machine with boats as pinballs. I would certainly avoid that marina at all cost. However, I have seen my share of dock encounters which even the best of us will at one time succumb. Thirdly, I don't think it is prudent for a boat owner to be practicing his warping skills in a busy marina with a steady stream of boats coming and going in the fairways. Perhaps that is one of the marinas you speak about with "people smashing into each other all the time under power." Unfortunately, what we are losing today in our society is respect for others. It is the calling card of the "me" generation of people who believe the world and its people exist for their benefit. I don't think that is the case with OldFrog since he is a new sailor anxious to learn the art of sailing but for those of us who have been doing this for awhile I think it is our responsibility to pass on the values of courtesy, consideration and respect to those learning the sport. I guess I might call someone like that a "real" sailor. Good luck and good sailing.
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Old 25-02-2013, 13:34   #14
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Re: Need advice for sailing out of a slip in light winds

It is pretty hard to envision severe damage being caused by a Capri 22 in 2-4 knots of wind, even if the OP really screws up. I think that most of us who have sailed for a long time would applaud his efforts to become a more rounded sailor, and few who would castigate him for being a selfish, me-first boor.

And while many marinas do have anti-sailing rules, many of the same ones host fleets of race boats which have no engines... things like Etchells 22's, which are far larger than the subject vessel. These guys always sail in and out of the marinas because they have no choice. I for one do not think that the OP is doing anything wrong, and encourage him to continue to improve his sailing skills. He just might need them some day...

Cheers,

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Old 25-02-2013, 14:36   #15
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I think that most of us who have sailed for a long time would applaud his efforts to become a more rounded sailor, and few who would castigate him for being a selfish, me-first boor.
+1
Very useful skills and confidence are learnt by leaving the motor off sometimes.

One way to get out of that slip an get some way on would be to hang back 3 meters or so, on a long line head to wind. Pull hard on the line with the main eased right out and the helm steering out the way you want to go. this should give you a slingshot effect to get the keel working properly. throw the line back onto your pen. Or rig it doubled and slip it.

good sailing
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