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Old 29-07-2017, 22:43   #76
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

I wonder, till what speed something like this is usable and would help to avoid terrible things like OP?




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Old 29-07-2017, 22:53   #77
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

This video tells that unit will see "up to 300ft ahead". At 3 knots, there will be 1 minute for reaction... However, alarm can be set at 100ft for example, so unless it's vertical wall from 200ft to 0 ft, there will be more time for reaction.



Looks like useful thing to have in shallow waters.

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Old 29-07-2017, 23:05   #78
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

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This video tells that unit will see "up to 300ft ahead". At 3 knots, there will be 1 minute for reaction...
I don't have enough bandwidth to watch videos. I have an Echopilot FLS. They claim upto 200m forward of the boat. That's optimistic. In practice you get good info at 3kts. The distance you see ahead depends a lot on the depth. The deeper you are the more you see ahead, to a point. At 3kts perhaps not 1mins worth, but plenty of time to slow down or turn if you are alert. Either way, it is still not useful while on passage, just a good tool when poking around an anchorage.
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Old 29-07-2017, 23:34   #79
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

I can understand the desire to strip the hull if they don't have any insurance. After all the fittings with be worth thousands if they can get them to a big market. However, in FP? how many yachts are there that would want stuff like hatches?

The mast and boom must be worth thousands, but in FP?

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Old 29-07-2017, 23:46   #80
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

Pete, I would think there would be a market in either Papeete or Raiatea. The charter boats often need repairs, and sometimes even new masts and keels. Good quality bits and pieces, used, would be wonderful to find there, with the high import duty (100%) on new stuff.

***************

Booboo, tell the kids the truth. Don't frighten them, it was a navigation error. Just so's you know, at night, I never approach a reef closer than 5 n. mi. That is the distance I feel comfortable with, and it is easy to set and watch the distance on the radar as well.

GPS is very good, but it is not perfect. Our C-Maps charts are very good, but they are not perfect. The Mark I Eyeball is the greatest tropical navigation aid you'll ever have. Be conservative at night, use your eyes in the daytime. Be cautious. And, the person who is not expert in electronic navigation should carry some paper charts. I think the paper charts are easier to explain to kids. And even the tiny hazards are shown on the charts for crossing oceans. Kids can learn to use paper charts to find lat/lons. The people who ran aground did so because of a series of errors in judgment. Too close to the reef. Too fast for the closeness to a hazard. No radar watch. Don't know how dark it was, but pretty dark, because the sun goes down early in the tropics. When the Mk I E is down due to darkness one needs space from hazards. It's basic.

Those guys are in a very sad situation now, and I feel for them, but this wasn't bad luck: it was lack of seamanship. Sailing boats across oceans is different from driving an SUV all over north America.


Ann
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Old 29-07-2017, 23:55   #81
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

Ann
In addition there really wasn't a need to be there as night was falling. It would have been better, albeit in hindsight, to do the 80 mile run leaving in late day and arriving in daylight after a night passage. This is the way most people do that passage.
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Old 30-07-2017, 00:25   #82
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

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Ann
In addition there really wasn't a need to be there as night was falling. It would have been better, albeit in hindsight, to do the 80 mile run leaving in late day and arriving in daylight after a night passage. This is the way most people do that passage.
And, FWIW, the way we did it both times...

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Old 30-07-2017, 00:27   #83
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

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Ann
In addition there really wasn't a need to be there as night was falling. It would have been better, albeit in hindsight, to do the 80 mile run leaving in late day and arriving in daylight after a night passage. This is the way most people do that passage.
Yes, that was how we did it, to arrive about 10 a.m. the next morning. The second time, we had friends aboard, and so, split the night watches, with Jim and George and Mary and me. It is easier and wiser.

So sorry they lost the boat, but --- oh golly!

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Old 30-07-2017, 00:37   #84
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

Position from there blog....

https://adventuresofatribe.com/2017/...aying-goodbye/

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I took a screen shot of her location for other sailors to be aware, which is not exactly where we wrecked, as waves have pushed her much farther onto the reef.
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Old 30-07-2017, 01:23   #85
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

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Anyone navigating in not-well-charted waters should seriously consider investing in 'forward looking sonar' ....read that as having a 'depth finder / fish finder' with the forward-looking capability transducer. Same for having the now extremely cost effective 'broadband' radars that have wonderful continous close-in (~200 foot) 'resolution' yet with no personal radiation hazards & drawing less power than a couple incandescent lights. No matter the cost or size of your craft, depth and/or surface radar target alarms set for alerting shallows are priceless tools, day or nighttime. And in this MAYDAY case, having a deep cycle battery dedicated (...hardwired... 'float') to the VHF, and the critical lighting in particular, is always strongly advised. Sure, using 'charts' with data dating back to the 1800's is risky at best, and of course, it also helps to even realize that inaccuracy. A little pre-trip research goes a long way. Be aware even USA coastal waters have geodetic survey bottom contour data dating pretty far back. Many decades of heavy weather & shifting sands can really distort that 'dated' bottom picture (...and is not always highlighted by NOTAM's BTW). Another good example of why standing-off until higher tide, especially after viewing the intended passage situation during low tide, is a darn good way to go. While I feel terrible for what this so serving family went through, being totally blunt, "complacency can kill." Fortunately they were experienced, strong & clever enough to cope, especially emotionally to hold together under great stress. Kudos folks, plus to all those assisting.....
THIS!

First, let me say I'll donate the first $100 to a crowd-funding effort to get this family back on their feet. So my sympathy for their plight is true and valid. But navigating in 180' of water at 9 knots in an area like that. YIKES!

If I even see 600' on my depth meter at night as I'm approaching an island or pass I start to pucker. Why? because I know it would take less than a minute for me to end up on a reef in that situation, probably more like 30 sec. Most islands and reefs in the Western and Southern Pacific are steep drops. You register nothing on the depth then suddenly 600' a few seconds later 250' and in a few seconds 80' etc.

If I don't know the area, I stay way offshore until daylight, as in 1,000+ more feet of water and I make certain that there are no reefs for miles. If I know the area I still exercise extreme caution and slow my speed waaaaay back in the pass just in case I do it. If I tap something at 2.5 kts it'll do far less damage than at 7-8 kts.

Boats can be replaced quite easily, children and spouses can't. They're fortunate that they escaped unharmed.

Last year I was anchored off our pass/ harbor entrance in 40' of water entertaining some friends for dinner. The sun had just set. As I monitored the radio I heard, "we've run aground". I lept into action, lauched my dinghies and this began a 30+ hr rescue effort. We got the kids off the boat first, the elderly gentleman, who's son was a local firefighter. The owner and skipper wanted to remain with the vessel to try and free her. I worked with them from sunset until 0100, leaving my friends and family on my trimaran. At one point one dinghy of mine tore apart in the surf. My backup dinghy got rolled with tow of us in it. as we tried to pay out 1000' feet of line to my boat offshore in an attempt to tow it. It was a moonless night, we never even saw the wave that capsized us come.

We worked until low tide then I went back out to my boat to take my passengers back to the marina and put my kids to bed. I then went back out to the boat and we worked until 0300 before we gave up to try for the next high tide at 10:30 the following morning. That effort proved fruitless as tow line after towline snapped. THe next high tide was the following evening at 22:30. I procured some lift bags to strap to the sides of the hull (5,000 lbs of lift total) and we coordinated with the USCG to help out. We started the effort at 19:00 and by 23:00 she was off the reef.

Boats can be saved. If this family can't save theirs. I hope we here in the community of cruisers can raise the funds to help them get another boat.


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Old 30-07-2017, 01:25   #86
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

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thanks for that. On our elderly CM93 charts, that is well up into the reef area, as shown on the chart. Don't have access to Navionics, but based on the CM93, I would have been at least a couple of miles south of there no matter where my destination was. If just transiting the area, five miles.

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Old 30-07-2017, 01:41   #87
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

I have Navionics but no charts for the area so plugged the Lat/Long into Google for a look, I don't use this feature so not sure how accurate it is as I have nothing to cross reference it with...

Hopefully someone will come along with charts for the area...

https://www.google.com.au/maps/place...4d-150.9947222
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Old 30-07-2017, 02:30   #88
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

Perhaps LeaseonLife (post #34), or anyone else who has the Navionics chart for Huahine, can cross-reference any identifiable spot on the chart -- say, the southernmost tip of the reef -- and see if Navionics has it at the same lat-long as the satellite images.

It's possible Navionics has shifted the entire island north by some whopping distance, but that does seem unlikely.
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Old 30-07-2017, 02:49   #89
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

Those coordinates show this spot on navionics.
Interesting that it only shows up as blue. I guess it could easily be mistaken. I also did the satelite overlay which shows it a bit more clearly.
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Old 30-07-2017, 03:49   #90
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Re: Leopard 46 lost in French Polynesia - stunning rescue pictures

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Hi Ken , you download all the imagery in advance so it can be used off line. I have approx 50gig of downloaded imagery, its a real game changer.
How about sharing? One can never have enough info.
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