How to get off of a windward dock

[seandepagnier]

Many responses discuss "using power" which is unrealistic as it may not be available or working when you wish to leave the dock. It may foul at any time and now you are in danger!

Furthermore, it is wasteful consumption, and not actually needed. It demonstrates to everyone that you don't know how to sail off the dock. Using "power" is not going to give you sailing experience, and you will be stuck in a perpetual trap of "motoring"

I will start with some basic cases where wind is blowing onto the dock, but these do not always take into account surrounding obstructions. For that, you need a case by case basis.

1) If the wind is aft of the beam. Raise any sail, preferably main sail with reefs, and put the rudder over. Detach all but the stern line, and let it loose allowing the boat to swing out. Once at an appropriate angle, you can release it.

2) Wind forward of the beam is more difficult. If it is not too far forward, you can still use #1, while manually fending the boat off the dock. If it is very far forward, you can use a pole, to push the bow of the boat out enough to catch the wind from the other tack, and sail off.

3) As mentioned before, use anchor to pull boat out, and sail off. This nearly always will work, but is a little extra effort to get the anchor out in the right spot.

4) Use lines to walk the boat around, or flip it on the dock to give a more favorable angle. This is somewhat tricky with wind blowing the boat onto the dock, but it's possible using a spinnaker pole to gain leverage on the windward side.


I know I missed a lot of points, so if anyone has interesting techniques to sail off a dock against the wind, I would be interested to hear it.

[deblen]

TP & alexandra

You are correct. My bad! I assumed he had power available.

My choice,If I absolutely had to go to that fuel dock at that time in those conditions with a failed engine,would be to lash the dinghy to the aft port quarter & use it for a power source,which I have had to do.
Then I would attempt to maneuver the sailboat using exactly the same motions as my previous post.
I am definitely not a good enough sailor to attempt a similar situation under sail.

Len

[TrentePieds]

Len & Alexandra:

Even in a boat such as this at a pontoon such as this, DEPARTING from the lee side of the pontoon, whether under power or under sail, should not be a problem even for an inexperienced skipper in a chartered, unfamiliar boat. There is clearly plenty of room for him to depart under bare poles, wear under poles, point her up on the fore-reach, run up the appropriate sail, prolly the staysail in this boat, and depart the harbour on a port beam reach. Depending on the boat's particular handling characteristics and the “dash” of the skipper, drifting off the pontoon, unfurling the staysail on the dead run, turning to take the wind on the port quarter and then unfurling the genny while coming slowly to a port beam reach, would also work. Under power it would clearly be even easier.

If this video depicts a common or garden variety "missed approach”, the remedy is obviously just to "go around again" and do it right on this second approach. We all have to do that now and again.

Note that about 4:30 there is a hiatus in the clip. Thereafter there is a man on the port-side wheel. At about 5:15 a man has gone forward and thrown a line to the man on the pontoon. This line appears to have been set as a fore-after spring, which the man on the pontoon belays (sort- of) on a bollard. At about 6:00 we see some exhaust water. So what is the problem at this point? Surely the mucked-up approach has been salvaged, and all that remains is to come forward against the spring with the appropriate amount of RPM and the helm laid to port?

At about 6:50, when the situation has basically been brought under control, the man on the helm has left that position and appears to be giving advice to the deckhand, and the man on the pontoon casts off the spring line! Is the helmsman actually the skipper who doesn't realize that Bob's now his uncle?

The arriving RIB appears to be intending to be a good Samaritan, but appears to be waved off.

One wonders what the whole performance was all about since we saw the exhaust water, i.e. the boat has power, and there is more than enuff room on the quay-side ahead of the "super yacht" to stop 'er opposite the desired spot, and let her drift in on the wind.

There was also plenty of room at the fuel barge. I doubt that I would have attempted an approach under sail in this boat, because she is roller furled and fin-keeled. Perhaps it is hubris - we'll never know - but I fancy that if I had had to, I could have brought her to the fuel dock under sail, fin-keeled or not, provided two things obtained: 1) The boat had hanked foresails and track and slide, jiffy-reefed main. 2) I had one competent, unflappable deckhand.

TP

[waterman46]

Originally Posted by Korvessa

Come time to leave, I'm single-handing my Nauticat 40, which has a lot of windage, and the wind is 12-15 knots from the port beam and I'm tied Starboard to the dock.

Korvessa

This quote from the OP makes it clear that he is having to leave a dock which is to leeward of his boat. So many responses in this thread are dealing with the other three possibilities, two of which are complete no brainers (leaving a dock that is to windward of the boat and approaching a dock which is to leeward of your boat) and don't relate in any way to manoevering difficulties.

BTW the correct terminology for the original problem probably follows the same one you would use to describe a "lee shore" (shore downwind of boat). For the OP, he actually wants to know how to leave a *lee* dock.

It truly is a matter of perspective. As a surfer I once described the advanges of an offshore vs. onshore wind to a landlubber office mate. From his viewpoint on land, an "offshore" wind blew in from the sea onto the land, since for him the shore was closer to the ocean than the mainland.

[deblen]

Originally Posted by waterman46

This quote from the OP makes it clear that he is having to leave a dock which is to leeward of his boat. So many responses in this thread are dealing with the other three possibilities, two of which are complete no brainers (leaving a dock that is to windward of the boat and approaching a dock which is to leeward of your boat) and don't relate in any way to manoevering difficulties.

BTW the correct terminology for the original problem probably follows the same one you would use to describe a "lee shore" (shore downwind of boat). For the OP, he actually wants to know how to leave a *lee* dock.

It truly is a matter of perspective. As a surfer I once described the advanges of an offshore vs. onshore wind to a landlubber office mate. From his viewpoint on land, an "offshore" wind blew in from the sea onto the land, since for him the shore was closer to the ocean than the mainland.

Agreed. The video in post 55 & 59 is a totally opposite situation to that of the OP.
I am guilty of "thread drift" Len

[Snore]

I did not see this posted- but you can get off without a spring line.

It all depends on the power of the thruster VS the force of the wind on the boat. The process also uses the fact that when you turn the wheel, you move the stern in the opposite direction (right rudder moves the stern to port).

The process starts with testing the thruster strength. If the thruster can move the bow to port, give a 2-3 second burst (may need to protect the stern qtr for first shot)- then apply full right rudder and put the boat into and quickly out of forward gear. Each repetition will move the boat to port with marginal forward motion. Repeating this several times should get you clearance to start motoring away from the dock. You may need 2 shots of forward to each thruster run.

This process will work on boats where the prop wash is projected at the rudder; thereby allowing the rudder to alter the path of the wash and make it a side thruster.

This is a fairly new concept for most. I would suggest practicing this skill before using it with other hard things around that you can damage or that can damage your boat.

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Captain Bill

Have I been getting it wrong all these years? I always thought that if the wind was blowing from the port side and the dock was on the starboard side it was a leeward dock.

Originally Posted by skipmac

Well, you would be on the windward side of the dock but the dock would would be to leeward. If you were referring to a land it would be a lee shore.

Originally Posted by waterman46

...........

BTW the correct terminology for the original problem probably follows the same one you would use to describe a "lee shore" (shore downwind of boat). For the OP, he actually wants to know how to leave a *lee* dock.

It truly is a matter of perspective. As a surfer I once described the advanges of an offshore vs. onshore wind to a landlubber office mate. From his viewpoint on land, an "offshore" wind blew in from the sea onto the land, since for him the shore was closer to the ocean than the mainland.

Captain Bill, you are of course, correct.

A vessel almost always only has two conditions, a windward and a leeward side and such terms only refer to vessels. They are irrelevant terms for shoreside use. The terminology regarding wind for shoreside installations is onshore or offshore or sea-breeze and land-breeze; similar to katabatic and anabatic winds.

[Lodesman]

Originally Posted by deblen

Shift to ahead & turn wheel to stbd.

If you want to ram the bow into the dock?
Maybe turn the wheel to port.

[frant]

Originally Posted by Wotname

Captain Bill, you are of course, correct.

A vessel almost always only has two conditions, a windward and a leeward side and such terms only refer to vessels. They are irrelevant terms for shoreside use. The terminology regarding wind for shoreside installations is onshore or offshore or sea-breeze and land-breeze; similar to katabatic and anabatic winds.

I think that conventional terminology is as per the OP. If you are on the Windward side of a dock ie the wind is blowing you onto the dock then it is a Windward berth, similarly the other side is a leeward berth.
An onshore wind admittedly creates a lee shore as it blows from the sea to the shore, an offshore wind blows from the shore to sea. However similar to the docking terminology an anchorage in an offshore wind position (in the lee of the land ) is a leeward anchorage and is protected. Conversely an anchorage on a lee shore is a Windward anchorage.

[deblen]

Originally Posted by Lodesman

If you want to ram the bow into the dock?
Maybe turn the wheel to port.

Nope.
Dock is to Stbd. Single screw. Leaving dock under engine power.

1.Turn wheel hard to Stbd-toward the dock.
2. Give a hard shot of Fwd & then to N.
3. Stern will kick off from dock-boat will not move Fwd. Stbd bow will not hit the dock. (pie shaped)
4. Apply Rev. smartly & strongly as soon as stern is out far enough to allow you to back straight & clear anything behind you.
5.Center rudder & back up til well clear of dock.
Use your engine's power-"drive it like you hate it when maneuvering" was what my old fisherman teacher told me.

You can't "drive" a boat off a dock like a car: ie: by turning wheel away from dock & driving Fwd. You will tear the Stbd aft qtr to shreds as it scrapes along the dock.
Think of a boat like a forklift. You can only steer the back end. The bow cannot be moved-The bow can only be pointed-by shoving the stern sideways.
You could not drive a forklift Fwd off a wall to it"s stbd either.

Len

[deblen]

Originally Posted by deblen

Nope.
Dock is to Stbd. Single screw. Leaving dock under engine power.

1.Turn wheel hard to Stbd-toward the dock.
2. Give a hard shot of Fwd & then to N.
3. Stern will kick off from dock-boat will not move Fwd. Stbd bow will not hit the dock. (pie shaped)
4. Apply Rev. smartly & strongly as soon as stern is out far enough to allow you to back straight & clear anything behind you.
5.Center rudder & back up til well clear of dock.
Use your engine's power-"drive it like you hate it when maneuvering" was what my old fisherman teacher told me.

You can't "drive" a boat off a dock like a car: ie: by turning wheel away from dock & driving Fwd. You will tear the Stbd aft qtr to shreds as it scrapes along the dock.
Think of a boat like a forklift. You can only steer the back end. The bow cannot be moved-The bow can only be pointed-by shoving the stern sideways.
You could not drive a forklift Fwd off a wall to it"s stbd either.

Len

This post relates to inboard "shaft & prop" boats.
Inboard/outboard & outboard boats are handled differently,since you can turn the propeller & pull the stern of the boat any direction needed-much easier to handle than shaft driven boats.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by deblen

Nope.
Dock is to Stbd. Single screw. Leaving dock under engine power.

1.Turn wheel hard to Stbd-toward the dock.
2. Give a hard shot of Fwd & then to N.
3. Stern will kick off from dock-boat will not move Fwd. Stbd bow will not hit the dock. (pie shaped)
4. Apply Rev. smartly & strongly as soon as stern is out far enough to allow you to back straight & clear anything behind you.
5.Center rudder & back up til well clear of dock.
Use your engine's power-"drive it like you hate it when maneuvering" was what my old fisherman teacher told me.

You can't "drive" a boat off a dock like a car: ie: by turning wheel away from dock & driving Fwd. You will tear the Stbd aft qtr to shreds as it scrapes along the dock.
Think of a boat like a forklift. You can only steer the back end. The bow cannot be moved-The bow can only be pointed-by shoving the stern sideways.
You could not drive a forklift Fwd off a wall to it"s stbd either.

Len

A good explanation!

Yes, and Snore's post illustrates Bow Thruster 101 technique for moving the boat sideways. One of the most useful functions of a thruster. With the helm over to starboard, the thruster counteracts rotation of the bow into the dock, and if you balance it right, you can make the boat move directly sideways -- very handy for getting out of a really tight spot.

However, few boats have a thruster powerful enough to do this against a strong wind. My thruster is a big one -- 10 hp -- but will not move the bow against a wind over maybe 20 knots. If you are pinned onto the dock in such a wind, then you will need one of the other techniques discussed in this thread.

[Korvessa]

Well this thread has been informative. Thanks to all contributors so far. I feel like I've got a few new tricks to try next time I'm dumb enough to pin myself on the starboard side of a leeward dock.

Some of the spring line techniques, especially with bull rails seem risky for a single hander to me. Useful with a crewmember but high risk for the solo sailor. What about, instead of using a fwd spring to pull the bow in and stern out, if I untied all lines and used the thruster to move the bow into the dock? That seems like I could accomplish the goal of getting the stern out a little without having exotic dock line evolutions. The thruster would be working with the wind too, so it would work for lower powered thrusters. What do you think?

I appreciate the discussions and new tie up techniques for bull rails as well. I've seen the Easy Docker in use before at a boat show. The salesman had a bull rail section of dock set up and would repeatedly (like every 5 seconds) casually toss it onto said dock and catch the rail with seeming ease. I want one, but I'm not sure if I want to spend 1.5 boat dimes on one...

Originally Posted by Smokeys Kitchen

And in that thread, Bill Wakefield had a link to a "wonder product" that is made to grab bull rails when tossed onto the dock:

Easy Docker

Spendy - but look they would work ok

One bit of kit that I own, use and really like is the Docking Stick. (Look up their YouTube video as I can't link it from my work computer) It does what it says on the tin, does it well, and is affordable. It isn't good for bull rails but works for pilings and cleats.

If one didn't want to buy the purpose built product, one could replicate what they're achieving by securing the bowline to the boathook (which is what the docking stick does) using masking/painter's tape instead. This would keep the loop attached and open on the boathook and would release with a tug.

Korvessa

[deblen]

Here is a video of vessel leaving dock by turning toward dock. / Len

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyJuhUozS-c

[TrentePieds]

This boat appears to be twin screw, as almost all fishing vessels of this tonnage are, and possibly even twin Kortz-nozzles, so that makes life a whole lot easier :-)!

TP