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Old 23-04-2014, 16:25   #16
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Re: Heaving to

There was a previous thread inquiring about sailboat owners' ability to sail. I think this skill falls in that category. As several indicated, each design has its own personality for best heaving to, and it's incumbent upon the curious sailor to discover it. Also, as Albro359 indicated, the solution will change with conditions.

Over time, as we've talked to owners about their boats for sale, I've been surprised to learn how many can't articulate how they would get their boat hove to. It's become a standard question for me now gauging general competency by which I weigh their other answers.
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Old 23-04-2014, 16:26   #17
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Re: Heaving to

Quote:
Originally Posted by boatman61 View Post
I didn't know they sailed Wharrams...
Tweetie Pie knew, " I tort I taw a Pardey cat"

Coops.
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Old 23-04-2014, 16:33   #18
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Re: Heaving to

Even as day sailors, we sometimes heave to in order to have a more relaxing lunch on particularly windy days.
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Old 23-04-2014, 16:48   #19
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pirate Re: Heaving to

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coops View Post
Tweetie Pie knew, " I tort I taw a Pardey cat"

Coops.
LMAO... good one..
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Old 23-04-2014, 17:17   #20
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Re: Heaving to

It's often claimed that "Modern boats won't heave to successfully in heavy weather"

This might apply to mobile condos, but certainly doesn't apply to most modern racing hulls*, racer-cruisers, and most cruiser-racers suitable for sailing offshore.

Having said that, the techniques may be different, and it cannot be relied on to bring the boat to a virtual halt.

Very high performance underbodies require a hove-to sailplan of the minimum area to maintain control of the hull's heading relative to the wind. The old-school method of backing a headsail is a brute force, inaccurate way of preventing the boat from tacking (in a shift, or cross sea, or when fore-reaching becomes excessive), and one which applies unwarranted extra sideforce, accentuating the problem of high-speed drift and forereaching.

Many such boats heave to better under a single sail: probably a deeply reefed main (or a trisail) with the clew immobilised laterally.

This point applies equally to a storm staysail, but most masts are too far forward for this to be a good single-sail option for heaving to in really bad conditions.

With a deep reefed main, immobiling the clew means using or improvising a lee side-deck preventer acting against the mainsheet, the latter travelled to windward. The clew should be well to leeward of midships, far enough to feather the sail into the wind at an angle the hull balance can sustain, and must be far enough to smother any possibility of the boat putting itself about .... so it's partly a function of variables such as windshifts and cross-seas.

The mainsail or trisail acts like the tailvane on a weathercock, keeping the boat at a constant angle to the wind with minimal drag, but if you want to lie as close to the wind as possible, it is crucial to success that the clew must take the boat with it whenever it luffs or backwinds, even by an inch. And even this is not sufficient with a sail with a belly in it: it has to be flat as an ironing board.

Think as though dealing with a dog which is toying with running away: it has to be nipped in the bud at the earliest sign.

I've even had people say "why bother with a preventer: my boom's heavy enough to stay put"

Yeah, right!


- - -

*Racing hulls which are radically beamy, however, are effectively subject to many of the caveats applicable to multihulls, and the advice above may not be applicable, or the applicability may be limited.

If there are movable appendages, they should be raised if aft, swung forward if midships, and lowered if forrard, to help hold the head up into wind and sea.
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Old 23-04-2014, 17:19   #21
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Re: Heaving to

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coops View Post
Tweetie Pie knew, " I tort I taw a Pardey cat"

Coops.
Nice double play, guys.

The unscripted ones are always better than set-piece play!
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Old 23-04-2014, 17:40   #22
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Re: Heaving to

Quote:
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I didn't know they sailed Wharrams...
Me either!

Maybe Lyn will chime in and tell us.
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Old 23-04-2014, 19:21   #23
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Re: Heaving to

For most of the reasons people have given for heaving to, fore reaching should work as well. Same setup as heaving to, you just aren't drifting dead downwind. As long as you're not in breaking waves it would seem that remaining to leeward of your disturbed water isn't required. At least the couple of times I've hove to for a reason I was really fore reaching and it accomplished what was wanted, eased the motion, almost stopped the boat and didn't require attention.
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Old 24-04-2014, 13:27   #24
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Re: Heaving to

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Welp, ask Boaty. He owned one once me thinks.
Welp?
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Old 24-04-2014, 13:32   #25
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Welp?
He's on the West Coast...
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Old 24-04-2014, 15:13   #26
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Re: Heaving to

Troup!

I'm going to try that method next weekend. I expect a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth from my crew when I start giving the orders.

I'm not expecting a lot, the boat I happen to have next week has in-mast furling, and when you reef, the center of effort moves forward so fast that the sail might not have enough leverage to control the boat.

I always knew you were a Brit, because of all the whining you've done about the waters there.
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Old 24-04-2014, 15:13   #27
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Re: Heaving to

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Read the Pardey's book.
I'm pretty sure even the Pardeys don't share your faith in the Pardeys.
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Old 24-04-2014, 15:16   #28
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Re: Heaving to

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I'm pretty sure even the Pardeys don't share your faith in the Pardeys.
I'm pretty sure you're right. But it's a good place to start, and they give a pretty good description of the goal.
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Old 24-04-2014, 16:00   #29
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Re: Heaving to

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Troup!

I'm going to try that method next weekend. I expect a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth from my crew when I start giving the orders.

I'm not expecting a lot, the boat I happen to have next week has in-mast furling, and when you reef, the center of effort moves forward so fast that the sail might not have enough leverage to control the boat.

I always knew you were a Brit, because of all the whining you've done about the waters there.
Good luck. Start with the main outboard of the toerail. Reach along with it just drawing, then once you have the preventer set, gradually wind the helm to windward (or tiller to leeward) as the speed bleeds off, until it's hard over, and lash it there ...

Don't fiddle with it; let the boat settle down, while you observe the behaviour.

Then get try bringing the boom in, by degrees and in stages, while hove to, adjusting the preventer each time to keep the clew immobilised. Take note of how this affects the heading relative to the wind.

Modern boats won't generally hold their bow up as high as we might hope them to, but it's instructive finding out how high you can get boats of different types, under different sea conditions.

You might need to use less helm angle when the boom is close to the midline. This will also stand you in good stead if you get too close to the limit, and the boat puts itself onto the other tack.

I wouldn't worry about the centre of effort moving forward: with slab reefing or boom furling (unless you have a truly prodigious roach) the C of E moves forward about the same amount. Popular misconception.

Try sketching a diagram.

The unreefed and reefed sails meet the definition of "Similar triangles" in both cases, with the same corner angles.

However it IS hard to immobilise the clew laterally, when an in-mast furling sail is well furled.

To get an idea of viability, try the manoeuvre with the sail full sized, assuming the wind is not too much to handle when hard on the wind with full main (and no headsail). Even if it was somewhat over that level, you'd get away with it, if you had the method sorted.

I look forward to your detailed report. Please cc any photos of injuries to my lawyers.

- - - - - - -

As for my nationality: I think you have me confused with some other whiner.

My first hand experience of British waters is limited to swimming in them once*, off the confusingly named "Isle of Purbeck".

I found the waters surprisingly warm (well, not cold, compared to my stamping grounds) and clear and very pleasant.

*Actually that's not entirely true, on sober reflection, but the last time I sailed in British waters was a couple of times when I was nine. And the 'boats' each displaced over 20,000 tonnes. And on that occasion, too, I did not find the waters gave me any cause for my whining.
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Old 24-04-2014, 16:49   #30
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Re: Heaving to

Quote:
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With a deep reefed main, immobiling the clew means using or improvising a lee side-deck preventer acting against the mainsheet, the latter travelled to windward. The clew should be well to leeward of midships, far enough to feather the sail into the wind at an angle the hull balance can sustain, and must be far enough to smother any possibility of the boat putting itself about .... so it's partly a function of variables such as windshifts and cross-seas.

The mainsail or trisail acts like the tailvane on a weathercock, keeping the boat at a constant angle to the wind with minimal drag, but if you want to lie as close to the wind as possible, it is crucial to success that the clew must take the boat with it whenever it luffs or backwinds, even by an inch. And even this is not sufficient with a sail with a belly in it: it has to be flat as an ironing board.
Andrew,

Maybe this is a dumb question, but if the goal is to flatten the main as much as possible, why set the traveller to windward, and then drop the boom well to leeward. In my limited experience, I thought that dropping the traveller to leeward, and easing the sheet less, would help flatten the main, the sheet helping the vang to keep the boom down.
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