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Old 20-07-2009, 19:19   #16
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perhaps we're talking about the same knot?

Quote:
Originally Posted by noreault View Post
full turn with two half hitches
a more secure knot is the round turn with two half hitches

Round Turn and Two Half Hitches
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Old 21-07-2009, 06:42   #17
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A series of jerks will loosen a clove hitch. I lost 20 boxes of fish in a holding net through relying on this knot/ I would go at least one turn and a couple of half hitches, or possibly two turns and a rolling hitch in jerky conditions. If you want a knot that holds tight on a line or pole the clove hitch with the extra turn works well, though we used to tar it to make sure. This is what we used to tie the nets to the float line
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Old 21-07-2009, 07:54   #18
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Traditionally, its called a round turn. Same thing as a full turn.
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Old 21-07-2009, 22:44   #19
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I actually meant two full turns. I cross the second turn over the standing part which increase friction on the turns and makes it less likely to build up so much tension on the half hitches A round turn and two half hitches can come unstuck in very jerky conditions with silver rope (polyethylene) or polypropylene from my own experience. I haven't risked using it under nasty conditions with polyester or nylon. It seemed to work OK with manila or sisal but it is a long time since I used those on a boat.
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Old 29-09-2011, 14:51   #20
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Re: Dock Knot

The OP's question was what knot maintains the most line strength. I don't believe that technicly a "Hitch" is a knot. The problems with a hitch is they have a good chance of coming lose. The problem with half hitching off a clove hitch is half hitches are a glorified slip knots and under a good load from a dock line could become a real bear to losen.

I am "Assuming" by the OP's use of the word "Pole" he is reffering to a dock piling. Another consideration when tying off to pilings is the rise and fall of the tide. Lines tied off to pilings need to be able to have a loop on the end large enough to allow the line to rise and fall with the set of the tide.

The venerable bowline retains 90% of the lines breaking strength and will not slip under load and is the knot I utilize when tying off to pilings.
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Old 29-09-2011, 14:57   #21
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Re: Dock Knot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave the Canuck View Post
Another alternative is the Constrictor knot. Essentially a Clove Hitch on steroids. Have a look.

The Constrictor Knot
A constrictor knot would have to be cut to get it off once tightened. My vote goes to the bowline.
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Old 29-09-2011, 15:01   #22
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Re: Dock Knot

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Originally Posted by cal40john View Post
From the link you provided:
" it binds so that it can be almost impossible to untie"

I don't think I like that idea.

This web link is also not a fan of the clove hitch or clove hitch with a backing hitch, the first comes loose, the second binds. He gives a list of his recommended mooring knots near the bottom of the page.
The Clove Hitch




John
The Constrictor knot reminds me of a winch override !
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Old 29-09-2011, 15:27   #23
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Re: Dock Knot

Pass line around piling, then tie a bowline around the standing part. Position the bowline knot on the opposite side of the piling so as it is pulled on the noose tightens up. Never slides, just gets tighter , and comes apart in a jiffy
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Old 29-09-2011, 15:44   #24
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Re: Dock Knot

Quote:
Originally Posted by cburger View Post
The OP's question was what knot maintains the most line strength. I don't believe that technicly a "Hitch" is a knot. The problems with a hitch is they have a good chance of coming lose. The problem with half hitching off a clove hitch is half hitches are a glorified slip knots and under a good load from a dock line could become a real bear to losen.

I am "Assuming" by the OP's use of the word "Pole" he is reffering to a dock piling. Another consideration when tying off to pilings is the rise and fall of the tide. Lines tied off to pilings need to be able to have a loop on the end large enough to allow the line to rise and fall with the set of the tide.

The venerable bowline retains 90% of the lines breaking strength and will not slip under load and is the knot I utilize when tying off to pilings.
Most knots I've seen reported decrease rope strength by about 50%, only splices keep 90+% of the rope's strength. Wiki reports 65% for a bowline.

Bowline - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Brion Toss recommends a bowline to ride up and down a piling in tidal waters.

John
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Old 29-09-2011, 16:21   #25
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Re: Dock Knot

[QUOTE=cal40john;786265]Most knots I've seen reported decrease rope strength by about 50%, only splices keep 90+% of the rope's strength. Wiki reports 65% for a bowline.


My mistake should have read 50%.
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Old 29-09-2011, 16:34   #26
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Re: Dock Knot

If securing to a piling in a big tidal area I would use a chain loop around the piling and shackle the dock line to that. I have found that rope around the piling does not slide very well, especially when loaded and will usually hang up somewhere - and if it does slide you will have chafe.

If securing to a piling and not wanting it to slide, two round turns and two half hitches is quick and bullet proof and strong and can be untied while still under load - sometimes useful.

My understanding is that the round turns and half hitches is stronger than say a bowline, because the loaded part of the line is not forces thru sharp turns inside a knot as the half hitches are after the load has been taken by the round turns to the piling and the loaded part of the rope goes straight to the piling. But I can't put my hand on any test data that says that, so I could be wrong
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Old 29-09-2011, 16:53   #27
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Re: Dock Knot

I recall seeing something like a loop of floating parrel beads to go over pilings to allow for tide changes. Anyone seen these?
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Old 29-09-2011, 17:40   #28
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You all fell for the trick question

It's irrelevant: the line will fail from chafe where it passes through a chock, or from rubbing across another boat's line on the piling. That's what I've seen. Know failure? Never, unless it was little more than a tangle with a name.
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