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Old 09-09-2008, 23:24   #1
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different types of genoas

Hi could someone help me distinguish the difference between
140% #1 Heavy genoa and
140% #2 genoa.
They both weigh the same, 45lbs, but I have to make the decision which genoa to bring with me on a plane when i flyback to the boat. I am gonna be doing some upwind singlehanding and would like to bring the easiest genoa to tack with and avoid tangling in the mast and the inner forestay.

I've been using 100% #3 but I can't point as good.
I've also used 140% #1 Heavy genoa, that allows me to point great, but its a nightmare to tack singlehanding, and impossible to tack when removable inner forestay is set so i brought that one back home.

Among the sails inhereted from the PO (hard core racer) are following genoas. These are the bag markings but I think the sails might have been mixed up so I ordered them by weight which I think fits the numbering and the % ovelap. If anyone has a suggestion on how to identify them I would appreciate it.

150% #1H total weight 50lbs
140% #1H total weight 45lbs
140% #2 total weight 45lbs
130% #2 total weight 40lbs
150% #1L total weight 30lbs
130% #1L total weight 25lbs

All of them can be furled up.
They are not the best cruising sails but I don't have the budget for a nice cruising genoa and untill I do I have to get by with waht I have.

Thanks,
Petar
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Old 10-09-2008, 00:18   #2
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In addition to sail area and cloth weight the sails will vary in cut. A heavy sail will be cut flatter. There is really no good way to tell 'cept by hoisting it on the boat or a visit to a lofter.

I wouldn't waste too much though on the decision. You're going to sail the boat according to what you have hanked to the forestay and your trip success will more likely depend on the quality of the wine.
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Old 10-09-2008, 01:44   #3
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Pointing ability is largely dependant on mainsail shape not Genny shape. You should be able to point with the 100% jib. If you are having trouble pointing, look to the main. Boom centered, upper battens parralel to boom or slightly closed depending on conditions.

You must get the boat moving by bearing off a bit and easing sails to accelerate, this gets the foil working. Then head up and trim for pointing. if the boat is going slow it won't point.

Your Genny is power. You don't say what winds you expect and you don't say what sail is on the boat. If you want to go fast I would definitely be carrying the 150%. If I expected less than 20kts I would carry the light one.

I would carry the 130% #2 as a back up along with the 100%.

If I was expecting 20+kts I would carry a heavier sail plan.

If your choice is strictly between the 2 140% sails I would carry the light one assuming you have the jib on board if the weather goes bad.
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Old 10-09-2008, 02:07   #4
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Take then to your lofter. Be prepared to pay for a little repair work, he/she is bound to find something. Just hope they were stored clean and dry.
If you explain to him/her what you are trying to do you'll get good advice and make a useful friend you can use in the future.
When you do have the money you've got someone who's advice has already been paid for and who understands you and your needs better.
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:00   #5
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I plan to mostly island hop and daysail with ocational overnighter. At most several days in winds less than 20kts. (I hope) Really hard to swich roller furling headsail singlehanding while under way!

ex-calf, several cruisers mentioned the same thing, but with this boat I tend to get the most power going to wind when I have a large genoa trimmed in all the way and a large overlap between main and genoa. Perhaps its because the tracks and shrouds are terminating quite a bit inboard from the rail.
I think I'll bring the 130% light and along with 100% jib that I already have down there, I think that would be good.
I thought about bringing it all to a sail loft, and giving them some money, but I know i have to give them something. And honest oppinions are hard to come by, especially if the guy wants to sell you a service or a new genoa.
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:34   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phorvati View Post
I thought about bringing it all to a sail loft, and giving them some money, but I know i have to give them something. And honest oppinions are hard to come by, especially if the guy wants to sell you a service or a new genoa.

If I had six Gennys and a jib the guy in the sail loft would have to be promising sexual favors from his sister to convince me to buy another one - LOL...

I could see it now, "Well Bob. See the thing is... You only have 6 gennys. Now some folks might think that's enough but for a smart fellah like you... see you wanna be prepared for any eventuality.... That's because you are a great seaman... What I notice you don't have, Bob, is a 120% genny... Now I just happen to have a special going on 120% genny's right now... And if you get it in both fabric weights I can really save you some money..."
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Old 10-09-2008, 09:52   #7
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The heavy 1 is cut flatter, the 2 (although the same size) is deeper. Sail progression when racing is: #1, heavy #1, #2. As the waves build you need a deeper sail for punch. Wave size dictates a change from a flat #1 to the deeper #2 although they are the same size.

Will the waves be larger where you sail? That is your answer, big waves #2, smaller waves heavy #1.

Side note: the progression of sail changes is hard on the crew. Frontier land is not the place on a racing boat if you are out of shape.
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Old 10-09-2008, 11:34   #8
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Joli, thanks for clerifying. That makes sense. It jut amazing that a #1 and #2 can be the same size and total weight. I tried googling to see if someone had that explanation but couldn't find an answer. So thanks again.

anyway, the chop in the caribbean is around 3-5' on winds lighter than 20. Thats what i pounded into last time and felt I pounded a bit too much with a #1 Heavy. Or at least I thought it was a #1 heavy. The bags are marked but not the sails, I might have swapped one or two bags, in the last 5 years or so. Back then I didn't know and didn't feel the difference. Now as I am putting in more sailing miles, I am starting to notice the small differences.

If I open the #1s and #2s on the driveway, will the "flat" vs. "deep" be obvious or I shouldn't bother.

one more question, if #2 has is depper, shouldn't it be used in lighter winds, or am I mistaking this with the main sail pocket?
Thanks again
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Old 10-09-2008, 13:42   #9
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110 to 120% somewhat high cut... a couple feet above the lifelines at the clew and about at pulpit height at the tack is a great sail and should point quite well.
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Old 10-09-2008, 15:02   #10
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So you'll be sailing the Caribbean two step, short chop on top of the swells. Gonna need power.

To check the relative draft of the sails: string the sails side by side (luff to luff, tack to tack, head to head), load the clews and look at them side by side. Do this 3-4 foot off the ground. You have to hang the sail somehow (best on the mast but that is not an option here) to see the draft. Laying them on the ground will not show you sail depth.


Quote:
Originally Posted by phorvati View Post
Joli, thanks for clerifying. That makes sense. It jut amazing that a #1 and #2 can be the same size and total weight. I tried googling to see if someone had that explanation but couldn't find an answer. So thanks again.

anyway, the chop in the caribbean is around 3-5' on winds lighter than 20. Thats what i pounded into last time and felt I pounded a bit too much with a #1 Heavy. Or at least I thought it was a #1 heavy. The bags are marked but not the sails, I might have swapped one or two bags, in the last 5 years or so. Back then I didn't know and didn't feel the difference. Now as I am putting in more sailing miles, I am starting to notice the small differences.

If I open the #1s and #2s on the driveway, will the "flat" vs. "deep" be obvious or I shouldn't bother.

one more question, if #2 has is depper, shouldn't it be used in lighter winds, or am I mistaking this with the main sail pocket?
Thanks again
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Old 10-09-2008, 15:09   #11
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You say the inner forestay is removable and makes tacking impossible with the genoa, so you took the genoa back home. Why not just remove the inner forestay when you're using the genoa?
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