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Old 24-07-2012, 17:01   #106
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by denverd0n View Post
I've seen the boat. I've met Capt. Jay. One of the nicest guys you could ever meet, but the boat really is a derelict. No, he is not a "cruiser." I'm not sure the boat would be safe to take out into the open waters of Tampa Bay, let alone anywhere else.

It is going to take way more than this boat is worth to refloat it. That is a simple and inescapable fact. I wish him luck, but honestly, at this point there is no practical way to get him back living aboard this particular boat. The only practical thing to do at this point is salvage whatever can be salvaged, and scrap the rest.

No, it's not a cruising boat, but he has the right to live on it.

However, he also has the obligation to secure it, and he did not.

It's not all black and white, bad guys vs. good guys.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:04   #107
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by rover88 View Post
I anchored near Gulfport only ten days before Debbie hit and hauled ass northwards to beat her, docking only two days before she made landfall. That could have just as easily have been me stuck on that beach had I decided to wait her out.

Somebody give me an address and I'll send the guy at least a day's fine.

I have personally seen a similar situation near Destin, Florida where a rescue was successful with some 3/4 inch rope and serious horsepower. The grounded sailboat suffered only scuffs and lost some bottom paint.

Somebody with a power boat (or two) can get this guy off.

With a 7' keel? That's really not common around here.

But here's the fundraising effort.

Grounded in Gulfport by Jim Thompson - GoFundMe
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:05   #108
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by rover88 View Post
I anchored near Gulfport only ten days before Debbie hit and hauled ass northwards to beat her, docking only two days before she made landfall. That could have just as easily have been me stuck on that beach had I decided to wait her out.

Somebody give me an address and I'll send the guy at least a day's fine.

I have personally seen a similar situation near Destin, Florida where a rescue was successful with some 3/4 inch rope and serious horsepower. The grounded sailboat suffered only scuffs and lost some bottom paint.

Somebody with a power boat (or two) can get this guy off.

With a 7' keel? That's really not common around here.

But here's the fundraising effort.

Grounded in Gulfport by Jim Thompson - GoFundMe


PS, power boats have already been tried. Boat US has tried. There have been a number of organized efforts by people I personally know here who are quite knowledgeable (and experiences -- smile) regarding groundings.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:07   #109
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
"Somebody with a power boat (or two) can get this guy off."

Dude, he's got more than half of a seven foot deep keel down in the sand. Pulling the boat sideways is, again, just gonna break off the keel, or break something else.

By him a role of primer cord and blow off the last four feet of keel, and you'll do him a bigger favor.

It's true that power boats won't work but that didn't stop local power boats from trying.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:10   #110
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by Nemo55 View Post
Surround it with air bags and a simple 12 volt air pump,,turn it on,,and wait a horrendous amount of time, but she will pop out no problem. then keep her on her side and yard her out to deeper water..
Or rail against the city and get them to lift him out and charge him for it in installments ......
Or is that to much of an effort for a multi - billion dollar state????

Maybe it is, since this "city" is actually a small town and not exactly wealthy, and since there's no reason to think this poor man, living on $800 a month disability, would have any chance of paying the debt off, and since the boat is taking up a significant chunk of the town's very small beach.

In addition, if a bigger storm comes up the Bay (it's early in the season), this boat could free itself and take out something like, say, the pier, which it is quite close to. It is a potential hazard. What if it breaks up in the next storm and the debris damages properly secured boats?
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:14   #111
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by Chartnavigator View Post
Try all these things especially the inflatable dingy either side of the keel idea. When there is sufficient water give her full astern for as long as your engine can take it, to try to blow as much silt away from the keel as you can. Tie some heavy weights to the boom, (wet sandbags etc., very cheap) and swing the boom to port and starboard while going full astern and being lifted by the rubber dinghies. Or, tie another rubber dinghy to the boom on one side, fill it with water then hoist and release it to heel and rock the yacht while she is lifting.

I agree though. Shame you live in the USA. In Aussie or the UK you would have been out of there by now. America it seems does not have 'society', social is a dirty word, and 'socialists' are the enemy. America seems just to be comprised of a lot of self sufficient individuals all out to make a buck.

I wrote a bunch of stuff and then deleted it.

It would have broken rules here and surely ruffled (plucked) your feathers.

I will only say, you do know there is no working motor right?
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:15   #112
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
Apparently there's a three-foot tidal range in the Tampa Bay area. If that applies to Gulfport as well, then depending on how he's measuring the "three feet" of water he is stranded in, it might be possible to add enough floation and excavate enouhg to get the keel lifted by the tide, leaving only one foot in the sand.

IF that were the case, kedging and pulling it out sideways could work. But if he's got four feet of keel stuck in the sand even at high tide...I'd still think any attempt at kedging would just break the keel, or the hull.

We just don't have the information.

rover, primer cord tends to make a focused blast. Used for cutting down trees and severing pipes, also for laying around door frames as a way to remove doors. The collateral damage really isn't the same as just laying out blocks of plastique. Especially if you blanket over it.

Hello, I live here. The typical tide in Gulfport is no more than 2 feet. A couple of times a year we have 3' tides, but not in the summer (except during Debby, when it was more like 4' and the bay had big waves). The only way this boat would be floated off using the tides would be if another storm came along. That of course is a real possibility, but then this unmanaged boat would be a serious navigational hazard for other boats anchored/moored in the area, not to mention the pier, and even property ashore if the storm surge were even 5 ft.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:16   #113
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by Butler View Post
Well said. How right you are!
He has no value, his sailing life is a meaningless waste of time and clearly he is nothing but a burden to the ant colony.
We here in the U.S. needn't look to the future for lost freedoms.
There will be no more of this living freely (and I don't mean money-wise) on the once robust "margins" of American society, working some little job so we can feed ourselves while doing what we love. Gathering up the "golden crumbs" as we used to call them. This used to be a wonderfully healthy aspect of our society that gave rise to all kinds of art and contributions the value of which cannot be measured in the "marketplace".
Those who have sacrificed their souls for great wealth cannot tolerate seeing people who are quite happy w/o it. That undermines the value of greed and the toll of getting more stuff than the other guy.
Best of luck to the skipper... if I weren't on another coast I'd be lending a hand.

What a bunch of assumptions that contains.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:18   #114
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by callmecrazy View Post
I remember when Donna Lange sailed her boat onto the beach in NC. The community rallied together, put their hands on the boat, and pushed the damn thing back into deep water.

I doubt if any of them even knew who she was. They didn't care how much, or how little money she had, or whether she had insurance or not. They didn't question the condition of the boat, or her life choices. Nobody thought twice about whether it was her home or not, or how she got on the beach in the first place. They just did what needed to be done because it was the right thing to do.

Kedging and dragging the boat out on her side, even if it's 1000 yards, is the way to go. It would only take a couple of borrowed anchors and a few extra hands, and maybe a few days of work.

I know there's still a few good people left in this country, but I pray I never have to ask for help from such a disgraceful community as this man has to deal with.

Did she have a 7' keel with 4' of it in the sand?
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:21   #115
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Shame you live in the USA. In Aussie or the UK you would have been out of there by now. America it seems does not have 'society', social is a dirty word, and 'socialists' are the enemy. America seems just to be comprised of a lot of self sufficient individuals all out to make a buck.--Chartnavigator

To Chartnavigator,
This forum clearly states no personal attacks. I take offense to your attack and prejudicial statements unfairly criticizing the USA for the inaction of a few individuals on this site and an unknown number of others who are aware of this man's plight but have done nothing. This discussion has been fully vetted on both sides of the issue and needn't be rehashed. I have clearly stated my opinions and although I feel sympathy for the man, I believe he, nonetheless, is responsible for his life, his circumstances and his decisions. The others who have expressed the need to help but have done nothing certainly deserve your criticism but . . . not the USA. In regards to your comment that Americans believe that "socialists are the enemy," I would respond that is quite untrue since the majority of Americans in our last election elected a clearly Socialist president who has more in common with European political ideals than the core values of our unique American capitalist democracy. There is no country anywhere that has given more to the needy in the world than the U.S. and many times to our own detriment. Keep your politics to yourself and don't tarnish the fine reputation of the English and Australian people by pretending to be their spokesman.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:23   #116
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by SunDevil View Post
What good are marina's paying property taxes, cities collecting mooring fees, coast guard and army corp taking in tax money if they won't help a sailboat in trouble caused by nature?

And charging him a fee per day is just sad and kicking him when he is down.

I would like to know from the other people here who anchor out. If this had been a catamaran with a 1.5ft draft that was just anchored out here (or where ever along the coast of a city or park), whould the city or sheriff come along and demand you pay $93/day? Are there certain places in the US coastal waters where you can't anchor? (except for military and high water traffic areas?)

This problem was NOT CAUSED by Mother Nature. It was caused by the boat having inadequate ground tackle -- while living in a hurricane zone in hurricane season.

It wasn't a bad storm here. I was on my boat for the entire storm. Sometimes the tide was so high I couldn't get off my boat, but it really wasn't that bad. We have had much worse thunderstorms here.

As I said before, little more than a year ago we had a thunderstorm that drove eight boats ashore just in the vicinity of Gulfport. Many more were driven aground in other parts of Boca Ciega Bay.

NONE of the boats with well built, well maintained moorings went aground, in that storm or Debby, which by the way was barely a tropical storm, and we didn't get the worst of her.

I am very sorry for this man, but to pretend that he did not contribute to his problem is just wrong. I'm not saying don't help him, but .. one way to help would be to help him put a good mooring in.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:26   #117
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by Gene :^) View Post
Where did you guys see his ground tackle? The story said all 4 of his anchors were lost and still in the bottom somewhere.

Also, the story says he is not up on the beach, he is still in 3 feet of water but i think he is being fined because the story said he is inside the swimming buoys.

--------

Gene :^)
Http://www.Strathbelle.com/

He is "on the beach, and he's not really in 3' of water. i've seen this situation numerous times. He had three anchors, and we know they were inadequate because they didn't hold. It wasn't that bad of a storm here. He wasn't prepared for a summer thunderstorm here, much less a real TS (this one was very weak) or hurricane.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:26   #118
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Thanks for the link for donation, i vote with my wallet.

I wish i could do more,but its something more than crapping on everyone else for trying.
Zee could teach you guy's a few things about compassion.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:27   #119
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

A little off topic but as per the previous post,,,,, I have worked in private yachting over 10 years. Lots of Aussies, new zealanders, south africans like to tell us what the United States does wrong. My response is if you do not like it GO HOME, nobody asked you to come here. Funny, they all stay to work on the yachts,, go figure.
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Old 24-07-2012, 17:28   #120
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by rognvald View Post
Despite all the semantic quibbling from the esteemed members of the "Bleeding Heart" society, DenverdOn's comments (a person who knows the boat and the man) is the voice of Reason in a sea of confused compassion(sorry for the reaching nautical metaphor). As I and others have voiced, where are all these compassionate souls in organzing and implementing the recovery? Most are too busy, too far away, or there's a logistical problem in sending money since no recovery fund has been established. But, I can assure you one thing--after this man's plight has been long forgotten there will be other celebrated causes that the true of heart, the honest of soul, the standard bearers of compassion and integrity will give their support to help the needy, the downtrodden and those hard on their luck. But, there's only one problem: they never devote their time or their money. They never save the world. Now, is that how you define compasssion?
How many negative (and inaccurate) assumptions are in your post? What in the world makes you think no one has tried to help him? Just because it wasn't in the one news story you saw???

I personally know (and greatly respect) some of the people who have organized or helped in attempts to get Cap'n Jay off the sand.
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