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Old 30-07-2012, 10:25   #421
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
t--i dont know this lennan soul--he verbalizes negativity on this subject--is prolly not a sailor and has negativity as his mainstay.
I'm an active sailor in these waters and belong to the local yacht club. I help teach youth sailing in prams, in this poopy water. I've lived on my boat for several years in these waters. I was opposed to mooring fields in front of my beach; now I'm not.

I'm also not "thousands of miles away". I live here, I see this every day, I have to smell it, I have to show it to my friends and family that visit and I take sailing in these waters. I'm afraid of falling into the water near the beach when I take the grandkids out on the sunfish.

I find it fascinating that someone "thousands of miles away" can know, feel, or realized the impact on our small community. We still have a beach where you can park for free. You can anchor for free in front of the beach. We have a free dinghy dock, and free day slips so you can walk into town.

This is all going to go away. The community starts picking away at the city council- they don't like it.

More rules and regulations for me and my fellow sailors, who are all judged by people on an internet site far away who are wholly and totally unconnected and unaffected by any of this.

You have no right to question my soul. I was out in TS Debbie helping to rescue another sailors boat that had broken free and was against a seawall.

It's so easy to judge when anonymity and distance are your shield. I stand by what I say. People here know my boat and where to find me. I'm not hidden, my screen name is my name.

I don't like what's happening to MY wonderful little town.
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Old 30-07-2012, 11:26   #422
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by lannen View Post
...............

I don't like what's happening to MY wonderful little town.
Things are different when one doesn't have to live them.

That being said, the object is to remove the boat from the beach. Period.

The problem with the 'captain' is a whole other issue that will not be solved quickly or easily.

The joint effort of many, some local, and some, like myself who are far away but am helping with some of the communication and coordination, does speak well for the sailing community. I've seen this with other endeavors, when enthusiasts get together and present a common, responsible position, that authorities have a tendency to listen and not react with kneejerk legislation which is now being threatened in Florida.

Can you assist with this? Many hands make light work. Let's help get this immediate problem away from the beach, and work on the other issues as they occur.
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Old 30-07-2012, 12:25   #423
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Can you assist with this? Many hands make light work. Let's help get this immediate problem away from the beach, and work on the other issues as they occur.
I respect your opinion, and your desire to do this. I applaud your willingness to aid others. I do however, have a very strong opposing opinion about this.

I will not put the moniker "Capt' with Jay. This is not, in my opinion, helping the sailing community. Jay is not a sailor, nor a Capt.

I believe that putting his boat back out there without a functioning MSD has solved nothing. He keeps his boat close to the beach for ease of boarding. This is where the kids swim. We don't have big tidal changes in Boca Ciega Bay.

He has no insurance for the next time when he possibly does serious damage to others.

His boat is not registered, nor does it meet any of the maritime rules or safety standards that I, or the other boaters, are required to obey.

I believe that putting the boat back out there will provide more fuel for the city council to enact more laws and stricter regulations affecting the rest of us.

I watched y'all yesterday evening. I applaud your convictions and the willingness to actually act on them, and not just dispense advice via the internet. I do not however, agree with this method. We have just entered hurricane season again.

These are some of the reasons I support complete removal from the water on this issue.

We must however, all walk our own paths.
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Old 30-07-2012, 13:03   #424
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by lannen View Post
I respect your opinion, and your desire to do this. I applaud your willingness to aid others. I do however, have a very strong opposing opinion about this.
The aid is not so much to Jay, but to get rid, or at least make mobile, the immediate problem. The taxpayer should not have to bear that cost, if avoidable.

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I will not put the moniker "Capt' with Jay. This is not, in my opinion, helping the sailing community. Jay is not a sailor, nor a Capt.
No argument with you on that.

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I believe that putting his boat back out there without a functioning MSD has solved nothing. He keeps his boat close to the beach for ease of boarding. This is where the kids swim. We don't have big tidal changes in Boca Ciega Bay.
Do we know for sure the MSD is not working? I would suspect a quick dye test would show up a problem, and then the owner is faced with another expense.

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He has no insurance for the next time when he possibly does serious damage to others.
I suspect your right, and don't even know if he can get insurance for that hull.

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His boat is not registered, nor does it meet any of the maritime rules or safety standards that I, or the other boaters, are required to obey.
Actually, it is registered. A quick search reveals that Jay (real name John) is the owner. Vessel Documentation Query

Quote:
I believe that putting the boat back out there will provide more fuel for the city council to enact more laws and stricter regulations affecting the rest of us.
I think many who are helping are partially doing so to avoid exactly that situation of stricter regulations by showing that the sailing community can be self-regulating. Hmm.... there's a double edged sword thought... a HOA for sailors? Yikes... maybe not!
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Old 30-07-2012, 13:36   #425
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

The way I see this is:-

1) that the boat being on the beach is a problem.

2) that leaving the boat on the beach won't solve the problem - of the boat being on the beach .

3) that if a group of people (for whatever motivations) remove the boat from the beach it 100% solves the problem of....the boat being on the beach.

4) that if a group of people remove the boat for free (or as good as) that it saves the local taxpayers money - as otherwise da Gubberment will have to act.....which leads onto:-

5) we don't need no stinkin' Gubberment (albeit I appreciate that some folks prefer da Gubberment to sort out all their problems ).


Will it solve the "problem" of Capt Jay? Of course not. But leaving the boat on the beach won't either - nor will chopping it up at taxpayers expense......as he will likely simply get another cheap / free boat. back to square 1.


But there is the chance (ok, maybe only 1 in a million) that the simple fact that some folks did give a sh#t about his predicament might be a part of Capt Jay finding his own way forward. or it might not ......on USD800 a month he should be living like a king, as per Indy and his $500 a month thread .

Of course I appreciate that cultural differences apply to all this - over here we may be (on average) politically to the right of Genghis Kahn ......but nonetheless we do try to look after our own as matter of pride - rather than relying on Overseas aid . But of course I don't come from a culture that invented Genocide by Healthcare........
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Old 30-07-2012, 16:41   #426
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
The way I see this is:-

1) that the boat being on the beach is a problem.

2) that leaving the boat on the beach won't solve the problem - of the boat being on the beach .

3) that if a group of people (for whatever motivations) remove the boat from the beach it 100% solves the problem of....the boat being on the beach.

4) that if a group of people remove the boat for free (or as good as) that it saves the local taxpayers money - as otherwise da Gubberment will have to act.....which leads onto:-

5) we don't need no stinkin' Gubberment (albeit I appreciate that some folks prefer da Gubberment to sort out all their problems ).


Will it solve the "problem" of Capt Jay? Of course not. But leaving the boat on the beach won't either - nor will chopping it up at taxpayers expense......as he will likely simply get another cheap / free boat. back to square 1.


But there is the chance (ok, maybe only 1 in a million) that the simple fact that some folks did give a sh#t about his predicament might be a part of Capt Jay finding his own way forward. or it might not ......on USD800 a month he should be living like a king, as per Indy and his $500 a month thread .

Of course I appreciate that cultural differences apply to all this - over here we may be (on average) politically to the right of Genghis Kahn ......but nonetheless we do try to look after our own as matter of pride - rather than relying on Overseas aid . But of course I don't come from a culture that invented Genocide by Healthcare........


YOU GOT ISSUES,,,,always loved your replies

kj
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Old 30-07-2012, 20:32   #427
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

"Will it solve the "problem" of Capt Jay? Of course not. But leaving the boat on the beach won't either - nor will chopping it up at taxpayers expense......as he will likely simply get another cheap / free boat. back to square 1."


You smart guy! You are probably right about that.
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Old 30-07-2012, 21:03   #428
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Thank you DOJ....the voice of reason! Has it been along time since you've heard that also? Lol
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Old 30-07-2012, 21:05   #429
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

If it's true that he has (for many years, as quoted earlier in the thread) been illegally dumping sewage, has none of the legal safety gear, and does not keep his boat registered; Then why is he not in jail?

Tickets can only pile up for so long. When a ticket doesn't get paid, it turns into a court date, when a court date is missed, it turns into a warrant. If this so-called suffering community has so much beef with this dude, why hasn't he been hauled away and his boat impounded yet? Is he some kind of mafioso paying off the feds or something?
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Old 31-07-2012, 07:35   #430
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by callmecrazy View Post
If it's true that he has (for many years, as quoted earlier in the thread) been illegally dumping sewage, has none of the legal safety gear, and does not keep his boat registered; Then why is he not in jail?

Tickets can only pile up for so long. When a ticket doesn't get paid, it turns into a court date, when a court date is missed, it turns into a warrant. If this so-called suffering community has so much beef with this dude, why hasn't he been hauled away and his boat impounded yet? Is he some kind of mafioso paying off the feds or something?


How would YOU prove he's dumping his waste. It's obvious it must be happening, but the court cuts a finer line than that. How would you prove it?

As we've seen from another post, the waters off Gulfport aren't exactly a police state.

I said before that IF HE MOVES BY OTHER OCCUPIED BOATS they will know it's happening, and complain. A few out there would keep their cameras ready. But where he is now -- well, there's probably a reason for that.
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Old 31-07-2012, 08:04   #431
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

avb3 wrote:

" Actually, it is registered. A quick search reveals that Jay (real name John) is the owner. Vessel Documentation Query "

The vessel is documented, not registered. Registered means that he is legally in the state of Florida and is paying taxes, which he is not.

Federal documentation does not relieve the owner from registering with the state.
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Old 31-07-2012, 08:14   #432
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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How would YOU prove he's dumping his waste. It's obvious it must be happening, but the court cuts a finer line than that. How would you prove it?

As we've seen from another post, the waters off Gulfport aren't exactly a police state.

I said before that IF HE MOVES BY OTHER OCCUPIED BOATS they will know it's happening, and complain. A few out there would keep their cameras ready. But where he is now -- well, there's probably a reason for that.
That's about as easy as it gets.. Just ask the Fla water police.. You lift the toilet lid, dump in some very bright DYE, flush. Go on deck and look around... See the DYE??? Yup case closed!!~ How hard is that??
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Old 31-07-2012, 10:31   #433
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Thank you DOJ....the voice of reason! Has it been along time since you've heard that also? Lol
Yeah, it's been a while
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Old 31-07-2012, 10:54   #434
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by callmecrazy View Post
If it's true that he has (for many years, as quoted earlier in the thread) been illegally dumping sewage, has none of the legal safety gear, and does not keep his boat registered; Then why is he not in jail?
He has received citations in the past, and paid them. He does not want to go to jail. The link to the county is way back in this thread that shows his citations.

I guess the cops just got tired of dealing with him.
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Old 31-07-2012, 11:00   #435
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
The way I see this is:-

3) that if a group of people (for whatever motivations) remove the boat from the beach it 100% solves the problem of....the boat being on the beach.
Yes, it solves it for today, maybe tomorrow, and quite possibly for a month or two.

Sooner or later we will have to use tax dollars, at a higher rate, just to do this all over again.

*SIGH*
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