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Old 27-07-2012, 07:42   #301
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by Dulcesuenos View Post
They must have nickel beers if he can drink there with only $1.25 to his name :-) maybe we need to check the bar out!!!

The food is good, and his monthly check has come. It is possible that someone has been kind enough to buy him a beer or two.
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Old 27-07-2012, 07:58   #302
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by malbert73 View Post
Sure sounds like the amount of time we've all spent reading and writing on this thread is probably orders of magnitude greater than the time Capn Jay has spent trying to get refloated....
Perhaps we have all been missing the point (for Jay). We all have boats; why - so we can sail them someplace from time to time. So we assume that this is also what Jay wants. But there is a lot of comment that he is not a 'real' sailor - and if true might account for his lack of motivation to get the boat refloated. Suppose that what Jay wants is a place to live - his home is now closer to shore and much easier to get back and forth; the boat is upright and nearly level, not rocking around; he has no worries that his ground tackle will fail as the boat is more solidly moored now than it has likely ever been; and on the psychological side he is getting attention, sympathy, financial support, and fame. Getting the boat refloated might be a personal disaster for him - much worse than the grounding. I don't see any incentive here to refloat the boat and recreate the likely scary experience of being storm tossed onto a shore. Viewed from this perspective, Jay's actions (or inaction) might make more sense than diligently working hard to recreate a more difficult living situation which he likely knows will not end well.
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Old 27-07-2012, 08:18   #303
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

How do you document a boat with no builder, no HIN, no...Half blanks?!

And as zeehag mentions, if he gets money, he can VERY easily exceed the SSI limit and not only lose his SSI but lose it for a full year--then be assessed penalties and worse.

But how did we go from the simple mechanics and economics of a salvage job to the psychology of a sailor? Isn't that another forum?

As the driver of a very famous bus once said "Ellybody crazy this bus!"

No need for speculation there, Florida actually has some good eldercare resources, that's entirely another topic.
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Old 27-07-2012, 08:24   #304
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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How do you document a boat with no builder, no HIN, no...Half blanks?!

And as zeehag mentions, if he gets money, he can VERY easily exceed the SSI limit and not only lose his SSI but lose it for a full year--then be assessed penalties and worse.

But how did we go from the simple mechanics and economics of a salvage job to the psychology of a sailor? Isn't that another forum?

As the driver of a very famous bus once said "Ellybody crazy this bus!"

No need for speculation there, Florida actually has some good eldercare resources, that's entirely another topic.
I think the man's personality is caught up in this problem and worth considering as people here very seriously consider if and how to help him. I really give Knothead a lot of credit. He's been very persistent and not easily rebuffed. It would have been really easy to write him off and walk away, but he hung in there.

There is no eldercare program that will support his efforts to live anchored on a boat, and I seriously doubt anyone who sees that as the preferred choice is interested in eldercare. I think the topic here is how to help him, and that includes finding a way to work with him effectively.
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Old 27-07-2012, 08:28   #305
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

there is no elder care on land he can afford either, raku----think about it--he is low income and written off by everyone else-- go figger he has a bad attitude.....his least expensive living arrangements are in jeopardy and he is overwhelmed and depressed. go figger. what would YOU do with same situation...and age.....
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Old 27-07-2012, 09:33   #306
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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there is no elder care on land he can afford either, raku----think about it--he is low income and written off by everyone else-- go figger he has a bad attitude.....his least expensive living arrangements are in jeopardy and he is overwhelmed and depressed. go figger. what would YOU do with same situation...and age.....

Yes, Zeehag, there is. Please read what I said. I doubt that someone that determined to live his own way and on the water will want it.

By the way, he is not "written off by everyone else." It is quite clear that he has friends, and in Gulfport no one is impressed by money, nor repelled by lack of same.

Yes, his living arrangements are currently in jeopardy. We just don't know how this is going to turn out yet. He may yet be able to stay on his boat. I think it will come down to whether he wants it badly enough to overcome the barriers to getting there (accepting Knothead's LEADERSHIP as well as help, unloading the boat, etc.)

I can't say what I would do because I'm apparently more logical about living aboard than he is. I made sure I could afford it, I keep my boat secure in a storm, and when it's time to move off the boat because of age I'll move off the boat with a heart full of wonderful memories. I have older acquaintances who have had to give up sailing. They're still active in the club, welcomed on other boats and still live a full life.

But I'm not a hoarder and I clean up after my pets.

I don't think he has a bad attitude. I think he has a psychological problem.

If he cannot accept both the leadership and the help he needs, his boat will stay where it is and IMO the city will have no choice but to dispose of it. THEN he will be forced onto the land. I think it would be so much better to go willingly, but that's what I would want, and he will do what feels best to him. What I think is right for him has no bearing because it's not my life.
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Old 27-07-2012, 09:47   #307
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

" think he has a psychological problem."
Which, with respect to all, I say crosses the forum lines. Who wouldn't be embarassed to have their psychological problems discussed as the topic of a public thread by strangers?
I'm suggest it is impolite to discuss those issues here, as well as expressly against forum guidelines. Suffice to say that the man has gotten himself into a hard place, and one that is sufficiently complex that it is nothing we can or should be trying to resolve here.
If someone had a miracle way to refloat the boat and give him his home back--that would be wonderful. But I really think we should be ignoring the elephant in the drawing room here, so to speak. As a matter of courtesy.
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Old 27-07-2012, 09:49   #308
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
there is no elder care on land he can afford either, raku----think about it--he is low income and written off by everyone else-- go figger he has a bad attitude.....his least expensive living arrangements are in jeopardy and he is overwhelmed and depressed. go figger. what would YOU do with same situation...and age.....

wow, talk about assumptions..

who said he had a bad attitude? and who is writing him off, at least not everyone here is writing him off...

I just wont donate to anyone directly anymore.... a trust fund or some way to assure that the funds are going to the purpose needed/requested would be a good thing...
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Old 27-07-2012, 09:57   #309
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

"Gulfport Beach Aesthetics Trust". You start a fund to clean up the beach, send all money into that, ejecting the boat is just a major part of the cleanup and any leftover money goes to general beach maintenance till you shut down the fund.

Voila, no problems with income limits.

Which still leaves the larger problem of how expensive it would be to refloat that boat "intact". And preferably to do that in some way which includes "abandoning" several good anchor rodes on the boat when it goes.
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Old 27-07-2012, 10:06   #310
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Old 27-07-2012, 10:24   #311
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Here's the latest update.
Jay called and left a message last night. I spoke to him this morning. He has agreed to accept our help and the accompanying conditions. He was sober and apologetic about his defensiveness last evening.
I haven't heard back from the reporter yet but Jay said he is meeting with her today and will have her call me.
I spoke to the Gulfport city manager, Jim O'Riley about an hour ago and he was very receptive to the idea and intimated that a pump truck could be made available for at least an hour. He isn't worried about a hole in the sand at the swimming beach because no matter what the fate of the boat turns out to be, that will have to be dealt with. He is putting me in touch with Dennis the harbormaster who will work with me.
The target date is Wed. August 1st. High water is 11 minutes after noon. This tide is virtually the same as date suggested earlier which was the day before. Dennis in on vacation until that day.
The boat should be laying on it's side with as many anchors or anchored boats to seaward with lines under tension well before high water.
The more people that show up the better. If each one of them had a some line or come-alongs or anchors that would be even better.
We'll need a bull horn too.
The goal now must be to amass as much gear and ground tackle and commitments from boater and volunteers to show up that morning.
The mast, according to Jay is cracked just below the spreaders, so I have work to do to stabilize it so that it can be used to lever the boat onto her side.

Please, if you have suggestions on how to advertize this so that we can have enough people show up that morning. Post them.
I'm thinking flyers, obviously the follow up newspaper article, phone calls to my customers and colleagues. What else? A web site maybe? Perhaps the donor site could help get the word out.
And lets not forget the forums. PM's, emails.

I do know a good community organizer, but I think he's a little busy these days.

What do you say sailors? Lets get this done.
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Old 27-07-2012, 11:05   #312
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

I was going to go fishin....
But i will join the expedition.....

If i only had a crane
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Old 27-07-2012, 11:19   #313
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Originally Posted by knothead
Please, if you have suggestions on how to advertize this so that we can have enough people show up that morning. Post them.
I'm thinking flyers, obviously the follow up newspaper article, phone calls to my customers and colleagues. What else? A web site maybe?
Craigs List, facebook, twitter

You need a snazzy title and pic and hope it goes viral. You needanpower as well as boats.

"help save an old salt". or some such.

If you come up with a title, pic, date/time location and contact info post it here and i will forward to everyone i lnow and ask them to put it up on facebook amd tweet it. Maybe everyone else here ahould do the same.

Post on all the sail forums and see if the local press will do it. Call the local television news and inform them, it is a good human interest story. When speaking to the news feel free to exagerate. Make sure you have already got everyone tweeting and posting and then tell them there is international interest and support for this event.

Good on ya for making this a cause. There is nothing so powerful as direct action. I wish i was still in the states id come over there just to see the event and lend a hand...
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Old 27-07-2012, 11:20   #314
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
Here's the latest update.
Jay called and left a message last night. I spoke to him this morning. He has agreed to accept our help and the accompanying conditions. He was sober and apologetic about his defensiveness last evening.
I haven't heard back from the reporter yet but Jay said he is meeting with her today and will have her call me.
I spoke to the Gulfport city manager, Jim O'Riley about an hour ago and he was very receptive to the idea and intimated that a pump truck could be made available for at least an hour. He isn't worried about a hole in the sand at the swimming beach because no matter what the fate of the boat turns out to be, that will have to be dealt with. He is putting me in touch with Dennis the harbormaster who will work with me.
The target date is Wed. August 1st. High water is 11 minutes after noon. This tide is virtually the same as date suggested earlier which was the day before. Dennis in on vacation until that day.
The boat should be laying on it's side with as many anchors or anchored boats to seaward with lines under tension well before high water.
The more people that show up the better. If each one of them had a some line or come-alongs or anchors that would be even better.
We'll need a bull horn too.
The goal now must be to amass as much gear and ground tackle and commitments from boater and volunteers to show up that morning.
The mast, according to Jay is cracked just below the spreaders, so I have work to do to stabilize it so that it can be used to lever the boat onto her side.

Please, if you have suggestions on how to advertize this so that we can have enough people show up that morning. Post them.
I'm thinking flyers, obviously the follow up newspaper article, phone calls to my customers and colleagues. What else? A web site maybe? Perhaps the donor site could help get the word out.
And lets not forget the forums. PM's, emails.

I do know a good community organizer, but I think he's a little busy these days.

What do you say sailors? Lets get this done.
I wish you well and hope it works to get the boat free, Plenty of hands, it should work, Do you have a big flat air bag to lay the boat on, It might make it easier to float it free,
Bit far for me, As I am in OZ,

Cheers.
Brian.
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Old 27-07-2012, 11:25   #315
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
Please, if you have suggestions on how to advertize this so that we can have enough people show up that morning. Post them.
I'm thinking flyers, obviously the follow up newspaper article, phone calls to my customers and colleagues. What else? A web site maybe? Perhaps the donor site could help get the word out.
And lets not forget the forums. PM's, emails.

I do know a good community organizer, but I think he's a little busy these days.

What do you say sailors? Lets get this done.
Be sure TowBoatUS and SeaTow know about it. Tell each one the other will be there helping and the newspaper will be taking pictures!!!
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