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Old 26-07-2012, 17:45   #271
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Rakuflames, do you ever feel like you are stairing at a blank slate? or maybe a rock?
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Old 26-07-2012, 18:22   #272
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
It's all good Raku, I just said a few things I was thinking!

The mere fact that this thread is in the seamanship forum kinda set it up for all the holier then thou to have a field day with it. Yes, I see compassion in quite a few comments, but others... well they ARE entitled to say so also....I've no idea how Knot and others will help get him off the sand. I really hope it's a better ending thne RIP M. Calabrese's boat had!

Children playing on a beach with no lifeguard? <faint>
Sixty one drownings in Ontario so far this year, the majority of them children.
A Life Guard has to see everyone. Parents have only their own to watch.
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Old 26-07-2012, 18:37   #273
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by Mike OReilly View Post
The reality is, the wealthy in both our countries are now paying, proportionally, a much smaller share of taxes than anytime in the past 50 years.
Just what does that mean????? Share??? Fairness??? To each according to his needs, from each according to his means???

Is that what you mean?? And I happen to be at the bottom of the income scale so do not think I am trying to justify/defend the income taxes I pay.

Foggy!
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Old 26-07-2012, 18:38   #274
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Boy oh boy, emotions seem to be running a little high around here.

For all the gracious and supportive posts. Thank you.

Raku and others, There is really no danger in moving the sand to free the keel and rudder. If a dangerous hole remains, it would be a simple matter to blow the sand back. Not an issue.
Believe me. This boat can be floated again. As I've mentioned, it will take a lot of work, a lot of equipment and tackle and some planning and coordination.
I am confident that with an organized effort and support from the local community that this can be accomplished.
The bay is indeed very shallow. I have sailed it for the last two decades and I know it pretty well. However, I am sure that this boat doesn't draw 7 feet. But even if it does, nothing changes.
The boat needs to be emptied, and careened and pulled and pushed into deeper water. It's no more complicated than that.

Here's the latest update. I stopped by again this evening on the way home. When I arrived, Dave, the fellow I met last night, was wading around in the water forward of the boat with the working end of a gasoline powered pump/dredge that was in a small dinghy that was occupied by an unidentified woman.
He was apparently trying to dredge a channel in front of the boat.
I called out inquiring about the whereabouts of Jay. They told me that he was at "Neptunes". A watering hole across the street.
I located and finally met Jay sitting at the outside bar.
I reiterated everything that I had said to Dave the night before. I was met with a combination of indignation, resignation and concession. Jay repeatedly would digress into stories of his misfortune and hard luck to which I responded with a rather blunt insistence that none of that mattered.
I explained that if he was serious about getting the boat afloat again he would have to empty it and lay it on it's side. He responded with excuses that he had too much stuff and no where to put it.
I can't replay the entire conversation, but when I left he had conceded that I was right and that he would call me tomorrow. He just needed to give Dave his chance.
Now I don't know if he will call or if he will cooperate. I have my doubts. I don't know if he deserves the help of the community. I have my doubts about that too.
Still, if he calls, I will help him.
I don't think it's going to make the world a worse place.
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Old 26-07-2012, 18:49   #275
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Knothead, Thanks for you helping this man ! I was willing to do the same thing before I found out it was Gulfport Fl and not Gulfport MS! I had float bags Big Danforths and a few hundred ft of one in nylon line loaded in my truck! but it's further then I can afford to travel from south Louisiana! sorry wish I could help as Ive been there and had help from others !! To bad your haveing to deal with some attitude, but sometimes helping can seem to hurt !! LOL Im with ya in thought anyway !!
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Old 26-07-2012, 18:58   #276
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
Boy oh boy, emotions seem to be running a little high around here.

For all the gracious and supportive posts. Thank you.

Raku and others, There is really no danger in moving the sand to free the keel and rudder. If a dangerous hole remains, it would be a simple matter to blow the sand back. Not an issue.
Believe me. This boat can be floated again. As I've mentioned, it will take a lot of work, a lot of equipment and tackle and some planning and coordination.
I am confident that with an organized effort and support from the local community that this can be accomplished.
The bay is indeed very shallow. I have sailed it for the last two decades and I know it pretty well. However, I am sure that this boat doesn't draw 7 feet. But even if it does, nothing changes.
The boat needs to be emptied, and careened and pulled and pushed into deeper water. It's no more complicated than that.

Here's the latest update. I stopped by again this evening on the way home. When I arrived, Dave, the fellow I met last night, was wading around in the water forward of the boat with the working end of a gasoline powered pump/dredge that was in a small dinghy that was occupied by an unidentified woman.
He was apparently trying to dredge a channel in front of the boat.
I called out inquiring about the whereabouts of Jay. They told me that he was at "Neptunes". A watering hole across the street.
I located and finally met Jay sitting at the outside bar.
I reiterated everything that I had said to Dave the night before. I was met with a combination of indignation, resignation and concession. Jay repeatedly would digress into stories of his misfortune and hard luck to which I responded with a rather blunt insistence that none of that mattered.
I explained that if he was serious about getting the boat afloat again he would have to empty it and lay it on it's side. He responded with excuses that he had too much stuff and no where to put it.
I can't replay the entire conversation, but when I left he had conceded that I was right and that he would call me tomorrow. He just needed to give Dave his chance.
Now I don't know if he will call or if he will cooperate. I have my doubts. I don't know if he deserves the help of the community. I have my doubts about that too.
Still, if he calls, I will help him.
I don't think it's going to make the world a worse place.
Knothead--

From your comments I am beginning to see a bit of Michael Calabrese's behavior in this guy so he may not be such a sympatheic figure as first assumed. (As the old saw goes, "The Lord helps those that help themselves" and, frm your description, this guy doesn't sound much interested in heping himself.)

FWIW, from his current position to "deep" water (i.e. 9' MLW) to the SSE is about 1200 feet. If the boat were lightened, and a good load applied to his masthead, and the fire department will come out and blast the shore-side of his keel/rudder with a high pressure hose for awhile, one could likely break him free. With a hawser to his stern and led to a winch, and a tow on his bow, it should be possible to drag him sideways to deep water at a spring tide. For example, Boca Ciega Bay will have 2.7 foot tide on the 31st at around 11:00 AM and likely a tad more given the on-shore winds we've had lately. That would give him a depth of, roughly, 5.7 feet in his current position and enough water to float his hull to avoid damage. The question is, is he willing to help himself?
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:02   #277
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Quote:
Originally Posted by knothead View Post
Boy oh boy, emotions seem to be running a little high around here.

For all the gracious and supportive posts. Thank you.

Raku and others, There is really no danger in moving the sand to free the keel and rudder. If a dangerous hole remains, it would be a simple matter to blow the sand back. Not an issue.
Believe me. This boat can be floated again. As I've mentioned, it will take a lot of work, a lot of equipment and tackle and some planning and coordination.
I am confident that with an organized effort and support from the local community that this can be accomplished.
The bay is indeed very shallow. I have sailed it for the last two decades and I know it pretty well. However, I am sure that this boat doesn't draw 7 feet. But even if it does, nothing changes.
The boat needs to be emptied, and careened and pulled and pushed into deeper water. It's no more complicated than that.

Here's the latest update. I stopped by again this evening on the way home. When I arrived, Dave, the fellow I met last night, was wading around in the water forward of the boat with the working end of a gasoline powered pump/dredge that was in a small dinghy that was occupied by an unidentified woman.
He was apparently trying to dredge a channel in front of the boat.
I called out inquiring about the whereabouts of Jay. They told me that he was at "Neptunes". A watering hole across the street.
I located and finally met Jay sitting at the outside bar.
I reiterated everything that I had said to Dave the night before. I was met with a combination of indignation, resignation and concession. Jay repeatedly would digress into stories of his misfortune and hard luck to which I responded with a rather blunt insistence that none of that mattered.
I explained that if he was serious about getting the boat afloat again he would have to empty it and lay it on it's side. He responded with excuses that he had too much stuff and no where to put it.
I can't replay the entire conversation, but when I left he had conceded that I was right and that he would call me tomorrow. He just needed to give Dave his chance.
Now I don't know if he will call or if he will cooperate. I have my doubts. I don't know if he deserves the help of the community. I have my doubts about that too.
Still, if he calls, I will help him.
I don't think it's going to make the world a worse place.

You're right. It won't make the world a worse place, but I suspect he has a lot of stuff on that big boat. I hope he can find a path to using your help.
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:06   #278
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

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Originally Posted by svHyLyte View Post
The question is, is he willing to help himself?
Indeed, that is the question of the day.
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:08   #279
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Same here Knothead, you represent the best of us at this time, and the Naysayers just need to vent a bit of their indignation i guess.
We are after all,,just flesh and bone,,trying to make our way through life,,some cause ripples,some cause waves,,some Tsunamis.
Others go placidly amongst the crowd observing all.
I wish i could be with you on this Mission i really do!!! it grinds me that i cannot.
Like Bob & Connie said ,,," I'm with ya in thought my friend" Fight the good fight.
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:12   #280
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

I would help you in a jiffy....
Although the outcome might be iffy...
If i only had a crane....

I would make this my next mission....no matter what the boats condition.....
Call on lots of helping hands.....
Don't you see its only human....so lets stop all the assuming....
If i only had a crane....

I'd happily.....
Work with thee.....
Until the boat is free.....
And then maybe....
By destiny...
Someday another would help me.....

Lol....okay just adding a little lightheartedness to a tense situation...no dork comments please...i hope everyone here has seen the wizard of oz....lol.....
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:12   #281
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Knot, SV, I've seen that behavior in a few people over the years. even my sister. I don't know if there is a clinical name is for it. They need help, won't let you, but keep dwelling on the event/s maybe it's denial, shock.. don't know, maybe a Mental health person could explain it.
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:22   #282
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Hey Goldiphlox,
now ya got that tune stuck in my head,,"If i only had a crane" hahahah very cute.. :-)
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:27   #283
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Its similar to a form of psychosis, they become so associated with their pain or trouble, it all but consumes them,,finally it becomes part of a survival mechanism when dealing with others.
A form of self destruction if you will, the person will usually adopt a very severe "Us and Them" doctrine whereby those who can should give, and those who cant should take.
Very Unhealthy mindset but we have millions of people now living on the fringes of society who get stuck into this way of life.



Quote:
Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
Knot, SV, I've seen that behavior in a few people over the years. even my sister. I don't know if there is a clinical name is for it. They need help, won't let you, but keep dwelling on the event/s maybe it's denial, shock.. don't know, maybe a Mental health person could explain it.
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:30   #284
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Thanks Nemo!
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Old 26-07-2012, 19:35   #285
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Re: Cruisers yacht stuck on Gulfport beach in 4 feet of sand

Quote:
Originally Posted by goldiphlox View Post
I would help you in a jiffy....
Although the outcome might be iffy...
If i only had a crane....

I would make this my next mission....no matter what the boats condition.....
Call on lots of helping hands.....
Don't you see its only human....so lets stop all the assuming....
If i only had a crane....

I'd happily.....
Work with thee.....
Until the boat is free.....
And then maybe....
By destiny...
Someday another would help me.....

Lol....okay just adding a little lightheartedness to a tense situation...no dork comments please...i hope everyone here has seen the wizard of oz....lol.....
Very creative and cute to boot. It brought a smile to my face. Thanks
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