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Old 09-05-2010, 06:15   #16
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OK - my philosophy is in agreement with Paul's and others' who rightfully point out that you should ALWAYS have a backup plan thought out ahead of time.

In my case there was no way to maneuver into my slip (or any other for that matter) on one engine in that crosswind. Also, I had the sail covers on and the halyards secured away from the mast (no slapping) so that option was out. Not enough room to try to back hard on the port engine and get the stern up into the wind. (That's an option that leaves you with poor control anyway IMHO).

My solution took all of 3 minutes and can - make that SHOULD - be in the back pocket of anyone, cat or mono. MarkJ nearly got it...

The problem was being unable to twist into the wind. That means the pivot point of the boat was the problem. Not enough leverage to overcome the wind. So how do you change the pivot point?

I just dropped the anchor underfoot - meaning that it was just dragging the bottom and not really set. This immediately makes the bows your pivot point. Then I just waited a few moments for the wind to push the stern around and bows into the wind. Once pointed in the right direction I motored slowly into the wind, got clear of the channel and set the anchor.

This works for ANY boat - and I mean ANY boat. You can turn into the wind in less than 2 boat lengths, usually in one if done right.
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Old 09-05-2010, 06:20   #17
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I just dropped the anchor underfoot - meaning that it was just dragging the bottom and not really set. This immediately makes the bows your pivot point. Then I just waited a few moments for the wind to push the stern around and bows into the wind.

Nice trick!

Well done
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Old 09-05-2010, 06:41   #18
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Good to know.
But I'm surprised your port engine was not able to push the bows into the wind, without using the anchor. At some wind speed it wouldn't,but I'd have thought it would be higher than that.
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Old 09-05-2010, 06:48   #19
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I saw this thread yesterday and had a few ideas but what I know about handling a cat can be written on the back of a postage stamp. MarkJ's post about Med mooring had been in my mind and I'd come to the conclusion that the only good thing about Med mooring was that once you have the bouy on board, it's easier to maintain a straight line backing in using the bouy as a pivot. I'd wondered if Markpj could have done something similar with his anchor but I thought there was no way I was going to show my ignorance by suggesting it.

P.
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Old 09-05-2010, 08:14   #20
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What caused the vibration? Did it happen in an instant?

I would think given the situation there's no way until my motor blows up I'd turn it off. Dropping the anchor is a great idea but you'd have to be pretty quick about it and unless your mate is excellent, it is something you may have to do yourself.

Without actually doing it, I would think hard reverse on port to get the boat to not only stop, but start swinging transom into and through the wind, turn the wheel hard to port and full forward port engine should swing the boat into the wind and still give you headway. Effectively a 270

Great scenario for me as my harbor is exactly the same. Reef on both sides guaranteeing total destruction of vessel if the maneuver isn't preformed correctly. I'll have to practice that the next time I'm leaving or arriving.
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Old 09-05-2010, 10:16   #21
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I guess you can drop the anchor from the cockpit?

Mine is triple secured. Takes me almost a minute from cockpit to bows to cockpit.

Pretty ingenious.

It just "came to you"?
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Old 09-05-2010, 10:24   #22
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I guess you can drop the anchor from the cockpit?

Mine is triple secured. Takes me almost a minute from cockpit to bows to cockpit.

Pretty ingenious.

It just "came to you"?
Its now habitual for me to have the anchor ready for letting go in confined waters, and then to secure it once properly underway, saved me once when going into Portmadog on springs, and the donk gave out.
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Old 09-05-2010, 12:50   #23
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I'm concerned that the port engine and rudder could not bring the boat to starboard into the wind. I always assumed that the big biminis on all the Mantas I've seen would tend to let them weather-cock better than that.

I have outboards on my PDQ 36, and they do not wash the rudders. After far too many single engine landings, I now test both engines by shifting into reverse before entering a tight spot. I hope to remember the anchor trick from now on, but my principle anchor and windlass are on the starboard side only.

Even though I'm using 8 hp engines instead of 9.9s, I can get the bow into the wind, with no way on, in 30 knots, but it takes full power.
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Old 09-05-2010, 14:50   #24
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A good idea I will now keep in my pocket.

Yup, I have had a single engine die in similar places and worse. Getting an anchor down FAST was the cure both times. My humble suggestion is that if an anchor cannot be lowered within 20-30 seconds, something is wrong with the set-up. Run. Have locks or lashings that can release quickly. Have windlass switch forward.

Twice I had a second engine running; I kept my speed up and bailed out.

Once I had both fail and had no room for any anchor trick, but I was able to get the roller jib out in moments and used that to get to safety. Luckily I had a crew member to steer while I hand-held the tack.
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Old 09-05-2010, 14:55   #25
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Neat solution, that we know worked. Most of us in a bit of panic would be reluctant to leave the controls to fiddle removing bolts/ locking wires from the anchor.
Point noted, remove prior to manoeuvring in close quarters!!!
But then you'd sheathed the sails so had lost that option, the one most of us would have gone for. I know the problem, wifey expects to tie a knot or two then get in the car and go home!!! It takes me half an hour minimum to be sure the boats safe and tidy for overnight.
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Old 10-05-2010, 06:12   #26
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I guess you can drop the anchor from the cockpit?

Mine is triple secured. Takes me almost a minute from cockpit to bows to cockpit.

Pretty ingenious.

It just "came to you"?
I have a windlass switch and chain counter right at the helm so it's easy for me. I did have to run up to the bow roller and kick the anchor off as it does not free fall from the completely stowed position.

I've used this technique in tight quarters for years - learned in the school of hard knocks courtesy of the US Navy. There's no feeling quite like being set down on the rocks and being unable to power out of the situation.

Wounded Cats - or mine at least - handle like a 300lb pregnant woman under these conditions......

Forgot to mention that the cause was a pretty big tangle of line around the prop. The channel entrance gets pretty shallow and part of this tangle was poly floating line - just my luck. Came off easy enough but I had to go swimming while the dock hands waited it out.... Gee I love boats!!!
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Old 10-05-2010, 06:25   #27
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I'm concerned that the port engine and rudder could not bring the boat to starboard into the wind. I always assumed that the big biminis on all the Mantas I've seen would tend to let them weather-cock better than that.....
With no way on, or nearly DIW, the pivot point on your boat is dead amidships. The effect length of the 'lever' you have to overcome the windage is shorter than if you are moving ahead. As boat speed increases, the pivot point moves forward to about 1/3 of the boat length (aft of the bow), thus the 'lever' is longer with way on.

I might have been able to force her into the wind in the small space I had available. In order to do that I would have needed to use heavy throttle to get her going, and then the wide arc I'd have traveled would have gotten me closer to the shallows. Then with all that way on I have to stop her one one engine, which of course does not mean backing in a straight line.

For me it was simply easier to use the hook. No roaring engine, no increased heart rate, no yelling "get out of the way..." etc.

I think the key point is that every needs a contingency plan for any close-quarters situation. You don't have time to think long & hard about what you will do if something goes wrong.

I recommend that if your boat configuration makes it logical to do so, use the anchor as I did. Worst case you get a stuck anchor and make others go around you for a while. Sure beats replacing that rub rail or repairing fiberglass.... and your insurance premium will love you for it
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Old 10-05-2010, 11:47   #28
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I have a windlass switch and chain counter right at the helm so it's easy for me. I did have to run up to the bow roller and kick the anchor off as it does not free fall from the completely stowed position.

I've used this technique in tight quarters for years - learned in the school of hard knocks courtesy of the US Navy. There's no feeling quite like being set down on the rocks and being unable to power out of the situation.

Wounded Cats - or mine at least - handle like a 300lb pregnant woman under these conditions......

Forgot to mention that the cause was a pretty big tangle of line around the prop. The channel entrance gets pretty shallow and part of this tangle was poly floating line - just my luck. Came off easy enough but I had to go swimming while the dock hands waited it out.... Gee I love boats!!!

Lesson learned here.
Thanks Mark!
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Old 10-05-2010, 19:34   #29
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If I remember correctly then 4 shorts blasts are for a pilot vessel in restricted visibility when working.
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Old 14-05-2010, 08:04   #30
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I've used this technique in tight quarters for years - learned in the school of hard knocks courtesy of the US Navy.
You just made me remember where it was drilled into me to have the anchor ready in close quarters. I now do it without thinking about it, but it all started on the restricted maneuvering checklist where I had to order "make the anchor ready for letting go."

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