Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 07-05-2012, 13:28   #346
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,777
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

my oat has a sprit which creates a different sort of problem for raising anchor in weather,as well as the fact that one sola cannot get the damnable thing up in strong winds. i need to find neighbors who help. i used a snubber 2 times, and required aid for raising anchor both times, and winds were only 25 kts . i anchor sans snubber now and make sure the neighbors are helpful, just in case.
__________________

zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 13:38   #347
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
my oat has a sprit which creates a different sort of problem for raising anchor in weather,as well as the fact that one sola cannot get the damnable thing up in strong winds. i need to find neighbors who help. i used a snubber 2 times, and required aid for raising anchor both times, and winds were only 25 kts . i anchor sans snubber now and make sure the neighbors are helpful, just in case.
Do you use a chain hook? If so, you can just lower the snubber until it drops free. Then take in the chair the same way you normally do.
__________________

__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 13:52   #348
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,777
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

is all good-- my dink doesnt row well in seas or winds over 17 kts, so is a lil limiting. i dont pole dance on sprits in seas and weather either....so i avoid roadstead anchorages now. is all good. many anchorages are protected--just not in 2 places i went so far--i look at them now to decide where i will go.

with a crew i am limitless, however.....
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 13:53   #349
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
is all good-- my dink doesnt row well in seas or winds over 17 kts, so is a lil limiting. i dont pole dance on sprits in seas and weather either....so i avoid roadstead anchorages now. is all good. many anchorages are protected--just not in 2 places i went so far--i look at them now to decide where i will go.

with a crew i am limitless, however.....
todos bien
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 14:01   #350
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,777
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

todo es perfecto...buen dia
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 19:17   #351
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bash View Post
I'm sure there is an ideal formula, and I'm equally certain that we'd all disagree on what it is.

I consider a snubber a disposable piece of gear. I use about 20' of 1/2" three-strand nylon, end-spliced with a simple galvanized chain hook. This on a boat that displaces 15 tons! The reason I use such undersize line is that I want it to stretch.

I wish I'd recorded how long ago I built my current snubber. It easily has several hundred nights of use behind it, with no evidence of chaffing.

That said, I think it's important to keep a back-up snubber aboard. Just don't be surprised if it's a long time before you get to use it.
As a rule you are less likely to need a back up (for anything) if you have one available and/or are more likely to need it if one is not available.
__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 20:05   #352
Moderator
 
sailorchic34's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: SF Bay Area
Boat: Islander 34
Posts: 4,815
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

More times then not anchor dragging is the problem in an anchorage. Poor anchoring skills and lack of scope being an issue too. While rope rode can chaff, I at least check the rode every time I deploy it for chaff.

I've seen more boats with chain drag in the anchorages I've been in. I've yet to drag in any anchorage.. BTW...
__________________
sailorchic34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 20:29   #353
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

I have seen alot of boats up on the beach here, useually it is because people put down a "lunch hook" with a light off shore breeze and not enough scope frollowed by the 180 wind shift and 20+knot wing with a long fetch and accompanying waves. Another common reason is a light anchor dropped on top of seaweed with little or no chain attached.
If you want to know the best method...look at the pros, ALL of the commercial vessels here use all chain.
__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 21:55   #354
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NW BC Canada
Boat: Dufour35 1982
Posts: 779
Images: 5
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Bash cheap, simple and effective is very appealing to my cruising aspirations. So for a 7 ton boat, lighter line for the same stretch effect? So once the snubber is attached, you have 20ft, for much slack chain to you have 4 to 5 ft say?
__________________
NorthPacific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 22:19   #355
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NW BC Canada
Boat: Dufour35 1982
Posts: 779
Images: 5
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Wolf, have you ever seen fishing vessels that use Wire as a rode tied to the anchor? On Many of the commercial fishing boats this is the preferred method. As to using commercial as an example of extolling one method over another I dont agree. I watched a tug stand by a freighter for 2 days that has being blown across Rupert Harbour this weekend. Another was constantly using his engine to take the strain.

Factors of why Sailboats "sail" at anchor are varied and complex and it is wrong to casually appropriate blame to one pet peeve. Most of the Sailboats here on the North Coast of BC and South East Alaska use a combination chain and rope anchoring system. Depth of Anchorages and the inability to Sail worth a dam if you are bow heavy being too reasons that come to my mind.

In an area like ours if you overnight you are going to anchor. Within a 100 miles North South East and West I can think of only 5 docks. Yet in 25 years I can not remember a single instance of a local boat ending upon the beach. Maybe because of the remoteness of our "backyard' we use better technique or is it something in the water that makes us Northern Sailors better:-)

Now as I get ready for the South Pacific I am going to add more chain, because down in the coral heads chain makes sense. But I still need to have a balanced boat!
__________________
NorthPacific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 23:09   #356
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthPacific View Post
Bash cheap, simple and effective is very appealing to my cruising aspirations. So for a 7 ton boat, lighter line for the same stretch effect? So once the snubber is attached, you have 20ft, for much slack chain to you have 4 to 5 ft say?
Sometimes I set it so that the hook is just out of the water, and sometimes I set it so that the hook is just a bit submerged. You don't want to be too consistent in this regard because then you'll always chafe in the same spots.

The more chop/swell/surge/wake action you expect, the more snubber you put out. That said, it's always good to have a bit of reserve so that you can put out just a bit more if chafe is starting to show. However, 20' provides for plenty of reserve.
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 23:20   #357
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NW BC Canada
Boat: Dufour35 1982
Posts: 779
Images: 5
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Bash, so the chain to the windlass is just a little slack?
__________________
NorthPacific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-05-2012, 23:24   #358
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

In the late summer and fall we often have two or thre boats a weekend on the beach...a combination of noyoriously bad holding and incompitant boaters.
My paricular boat (designed by William Atkin in 1936) has alot flair to the foredeck, the intention is to keep the cockpit dry. Without the additional ballast from 300' of chain in my chain locker my boat has a tendancy to be "saucy" in heavy weather, the chain smooths things out.
__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2012, 11:29   #359
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NW BC Canada
Boat: Dufour35 1982
Posts: 779
Images: 5
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Wolf, That is amazing, the number of boats that come to grief. Having said that, fall hits early here and with a vengeance. That means that we take careful stock of the weather forecasts.

Balancing a boat is a forgotten art. My Dufour has great storage forward and a large chain locker behind the collision bulkhead, because of a fine entry too much weight forward can can make it very difficult to steer. For me adding more chain means having to lighten something else
__________________
NorthPacific is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2012, 19:24   #360
Eternal Member
 
wolfenzee's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Port Ludlow, WA (NW corner of Puget Sound)
Boat: 30' William Atkin cutter
Posts: 1,496
Send a message via ICQ to wolfenzee
Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

The boaters that have the problems are useually "weekenders", though alot of boats were taken out by a nasty winter storm a few years back...initially a cateramaran whose owners lived in Seattle and did not attend to it dragged anchor onto another boat and this ended up snowballing.
__________________

__________________
"It is better to die living than live dieing" (Tolstoy para-phrased by Jimmy Buffet)
"Those who think they know everything piss off those of us who do"
wolfenzee is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
scope

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
BBB vs High-Test Chain wind rose ll Anchoring & Mooring 75 27-06-2012 12:30
Getting Chain into the Bilge JonathanSail Anchoring & Mooring 32 15-01-2012 17:22
For Sale: 3/8" SS chain and gypsy for sale terry1 Classifieds Archive 0 14-12-2011 14:55
Windlass Chain Sleeve Cover sailorboy1 Anchoring & Mooring 3 20-09-2011 15:49
Galvanic Corrosion of Chain Galvanizing wsmurdoch Anchoring & Mooring 0 22-08-2011 12:17



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:56.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.