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Old 03-05-2012, 20:08   #331
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

My main reason for using a snubber in weather is that it gives me a quieter nights sleep. Think of the parting of your snubber as an alarm clock, and yes it works quite well. I use a 3/8" three strand nylon snubber on our little 27 ton boat. Rodes are 340' 3/8 bbb primary on a 66lb Bruce, 50' 3/8 bbb ,300' 3/4" nylon secondary on a 45# cqr, with 300' 1" nylon extra, just in case. Stern anchor/lunch hook is a 20# Danforth with 25'/250' If all this seems overkill, suffice to say I've used the length several times with 1-3 scope up north.
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Old 04-05-2012, 10:17   #332
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

As noted, how well a boat can take the additional weight of chain comes into play when deciding between chain, rope, or a mixture.

I am convinced that chain is the better option for chafe protection and sleeping well at night. It is what I would like to anchor with. But with my smaller 28', 6000# boat the weight up the in forpeak will negatively effect sailing performance and I'm not sure I am okay with that compromise. Ideally, that weight would be placed down in the bilge when sailing. The prospect of moving all this chain to the bilge by hand, everytime we sail does not sound like a sensible option. But.... what if we had a system figured out to make that transition easy.

A plastic (maybe delrin?) tube running from chain locker to bilge, down along the chine of the boat, below the V-berth could allow the chain to make that transition. I would not expect the chain to free fall down to the bilge from the forpeak, but crew could pull from the bilge end, or a wimpy windlass could do the job. Maybe a shelf is built into the bilge so that the chain doesn't sit in water?

I don't have this all figured out yet, but I think a solution may exist where we don't have to compromise between a chafe resistant rode and weight up in the forpeak.
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Old 04-05-2012, 17:26   #333
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
No, Don, not the same: if the snubber chafes and parts, you are still anchored by the chain, but if the nylon rode chafes and parts, you are adrift. Big difference.

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yes but I wasn't referring to someone using 20' chain and was refferring to people agruing about why a mixed rode had advantages over all chain

I have 350' chain with 50' of line attaching it to the boat that I can cut if needed. But in use the system becomes a mixed rode. Yesterday I anchored in 25' water with 125' of chain out, a hook with a snubber attached to the chain, the chain between the 2 lose to take load off the windlass and another snubber connected to that loose section.
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Old 04-05-2012, 17:30   #334
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

I spent alot of time figureing out how to move the wieght of my chain closer to the mast. Because I rarely put out all 300' I was thinking of stowing 1/2 in the chainlocker and 1/2 next to the mast (connected via a piece of 3" dia PVC pipe under the bunk, this meant that when I used over 150' of chain it would take 2 people feeding and recieving it to stow it properly. Then I found out the particular design of my boat does better with the wieght of the chain in the chain locker.
Most of the fishing boats here and some of the larger cruising sailboats have the chain on a hydraulically or in some cases manually cranked drum on deck....it doesn't look pretty, but is no nonsense, takes up less room than in the chainlocker and avoiods the problems that occur when chain (or rode for that matter)is stowed below decks.
I a have 1" double braided bridle and it it were to chafe enough to part that would be due to a degree of negligence not permited on my boat.
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Old 04-05-2012, 22:52   #335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfenzee

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag
i willnot use anyhting like or akin to rode for a snubber--the purpose of the snubber is to stretch and if necessary, it snaps not the chain. i do not use 30 ft of it either--my bow is only 8-9 ft above water--is no need to use 30 ft of line for bridle when i make a snubber. boats use snubber bridles to imitate waterline snubbing, or attachment of anchor chain at water line rather than at deck height to avoid stress and chafe on deck fittings and rode. .
We do the same. Regular dock line works well-stretches & long lasting with a SS hook. We have tried those rubber snubbers but they snapped. We are about 7.5 ft off water-that's 15ft to get both side to water level plus. A couple ft to tie and more to be safe. That's about 20ft. What does everybody do with the rest?


I use a snubber/bridal for several reasons, an anchor roller can not hold up to the stresses of the chain at anchor, the brake on the windlass (which works on friction) can not be trusted to hold the boat, the cleats the bridal is connected to have a more secure backing than the windlass and a bridal keeps the boat centered.....the "shock absorber" function" is only secondary).
We have a couple cleats in the anchor locker that we tie off the chain when we don't use a bridle (one night stay -little wind). Anything I can do to taken the stress off the windless the longer I will have it and not have to pull a hundred plus feet of chain by hand.

Like everything else though we check the line and hook for wear.
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Old 06-05-2012, 20:52   #336
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

So is there idea formula for setting up a snubber?
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Old 07-05-2012, 00:03   #337
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Because of the wide variety of opinions in ground tacle it is hard to say what is ideal. That said I personally feel the ideal snubber is a bridle...two lines (1" dia braid is good) that connect to the chain useing a "bridale plate", hook, shackle, heavy duty carabiener or some such thing examples of a bridle plate can be seen below and/or purcased through Search Results
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Old 07-05-2012, 00:12   #338
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Thanks wolfe, How do you decide on the amount of rope? Also the knot to the bridle any less weakening than another? One other question. This bridle is attached each time you anchor by screwing it into the chain?

Sorry others come to mind like no chain lock.
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Old 07-05-2012, 00:35   #339
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One thing that pisses me off about the guys on nylon is that they swing all over the place. Usually they will set about the same distance as a bunch of guys on chain and almost swing into everyone else all night. Even the most well meaning guy showing up late with only nylon in a crowded anchorage is occasionally going to swing close to others why isn't swing radius in normal conditions not mentioned more often as a negative? I see the use of nylon as an unnecessary risk to fellow boaters. If it chafes and you drift free you endanger other boats.

Nylon is great for a secondary anchor or stern anchor.
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Old 07-05-2012, 00:37   #340
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

So how does this not drop off the chain?
Sea-Dog Chain Gripper Plate - Stainless Steel - Stoppers & Snubbers - Anchoring & Docking - Downwind Marine
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Old 07-05-2012, 00:37   #341
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

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Originally Posted by NorthPacific View Post
Thanks wolfe, How do you decide on the amount of rope? Also the knot to the bridle any less weakening than another? One other question. This bridle is attached each time you anchor by screwing it into the chain?

Sorry others come to mind like no chain lock.
Some of the bridle plates (like the bottom illustedtion) just hooks onto the chain...the amount of rope is a personal prefferance..it also varies on weather and water depth. A braided end w/ a thimble is ideal though a good old fasion bowline around a shackle is fine.
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Old 07-05-2012, 01:32   #342
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

Gathering the snubber's lines in preparation for retrieving anchor and chain.

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Old 07-05-2012, 08:04   #343
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

in a roadstead anchorage unprotected, i donot use a snubber---my anchor roller is on my sprit--i a have difficulty lifting anchor sola with the snubber in place. even with a windlass.
isnt easy raising a 66 pound anchor in a heavy wind with seas.....
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Old 07-05-2012, 12:52   #344
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

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in a roadstead anchorage unprotected, i donot use a snubber---my anchor roller is on my sprit--i a have difficulty lifting anchor sola with the snubber in place. even with a windlass.
isnt easy raising a 66 pound anchor in a heavy wind with seas.....
I don't understand this. Why can't you winch in the chain until the pressure is off the snubber, uncleat the snubber and then winch in the chain (removing the snubber hook when it's about a foot away from the windlass)?
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Old 07-05-2012, 13:10   #345
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Re: Chain Versus Rope Scope ?

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So is there idea formula for setting up a snubber?
I'm sure there is an ideal formula, and I'm equally certain that we'd all disagree on what it is.

I consider a snubber a disposable piece of gear. I use about 20' of 1/2" three-strand nylon, end-spliced with a simple galvanized chain hook. This on a boat that displaces 15 tons! The reason I use such undersize line is that I want it to stretch.

I wish I'd recorded how long ago I built my current snubber. It easily has several hundred nights of use behind it, with no evidence of chaffing.

That said, I think it's important to keep a back-up snubber aboard. Just don't be surprised if it's a long time before you get to use it.
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