Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 10-07-2010, 06:29   #1
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 3,899
Boat vs Barge: Two Dead

Here is an article about a fatal incident here in Philadelphia.

Interestingly it says the boat captain put out a distress call on channel 13.

Excite News - Duck boat, 2 bodies pulled from Philadelphia river

The Delaware is quite swift, the duck boats frequently look overloaded.

But that aside, you gotta wonder what the duck boat captian was thinking to not make a PAN call, and then MAYDAY when the tug was approaching. The barge would have been visible for over a mile in either direction.
__________________

__________________
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2010, 08:37   #2
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Santa Cruz
Boat: Boatless Again
Posts: 4,321
It will all come out in the investigation, as they should have recordings of the radio calls. I imagine the duck captain was busy with the engine breakdown and fire that was reported but if he put out a call on ch 13, the tug should have been watching out for him.
__________________

__________________
donradcliffe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2010, 09:02   #3
Senior Cruiser
 
Starbuck's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2005
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 827

Pardon this west coaster's ignorance, but is a duck boat one of those floating school bus looking things? The article said it was six-wheeled.
__________________
s/y Elizabeth Catalina 34 MkII
"Man must have just enough faith in himself to have adventures, and just enough doubt of himself to enjoy them." G. K. Chesterfield
Starbuck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2010, 09:11   #4
Moderator Emeritus
 
David M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: San Francisco Bay
Boat: research vessel
Posts: 10,150
Who knows yet what the truth is but it may be a simple case of breaking down in the wrong place at the wrong time in front of a barge that carries a lot of momentum.

From the article....
Tug pilots are also required to use radar, but the duck boat did not have a radar reflector, so it's not clear whether it would have shown up on a boat's radar.

A duck boat less than a mile away not showing up on radar? Oh please.
__________________
David

Life begins where land ends.
David M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2010, 09:13   #5
Moderator Emeritus
 
David M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: San Francisco Bay
Boat: research vessel
Posts: 10,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starbuck View Post
Pardon this west coaster's ignorance, but is a duck boat one of those floating school bus looking things? The article said it was six-wheeled.
We have one here doing tours on the SF Bay. Not all of us West Coasters are ignorant.
__________________
David

Life begins where land ends.
David M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2010, 09:14   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Napa CA USA
Boat: Piver Victress
Posts: 87
The "Duck Boat" referred to is, in fact, a 6-wheeled WW2 amphibious transport vehicle ... it's military designation was DUKW

pics & info here : DUKW - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
__________________
svtadpole is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2010, 09:39   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 294
The original ones were military surplus, but they are often now purpose-built for tourism. Don't look the same, but generally same idea - a boat with wheels.

Here's what our local tour says about their ducks:
Quote:
The Pirates Jewel and Pirates Pearl are a 2005 Trolley Boat originally manufactured in Daytona Beach, Florida. It is a far change from the old DUK boats of WWII. We really are not a duck boat, but most people recognize what that is so that's the reason we call it that. Technically, it's an amphibious vehicle that is much more comfortable than the old DUK.
__________________
Mariness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2010, 10:36   #8
Moderator... short for Cat Wrangler
 
sarafina's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: San Francisco
Boat: Cal 28 Flush Deck
Posts: 5,559
Images: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by David M View Post
We have one here doing tours on the SF Bay. Not all of us West Coasters are ignorant.
__________________
Sara

ain't what ya do, it's the way that ya do it...
sarafina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2010, 18:30   #9
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 3,899
And a little more info, if you believe the press, which I often find wrong.

AP: Mate piloting tug that hit duck boat takes 5th



Jul 12, 7:02 PM (ET)

By MARYCLAIRE DALE
(AP) - A crew member refusing to talk to federal investigators about a fatal duck boat crash in Philadelphia was piloting the tug that slammed into the duck boat, a Coast Guard official said Monday.

The mate exercised his Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination and refused to meet with investigators over the weekend, according to the National Transportation and Safety Board.


Excite News - AP: Mate piloting tug that hit duck boat takes 5th

__________________
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2010, 19:42   #10
Moderator Emeritus
 
Ex-Calif's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Singapore
Boat: Maxi 77 - Relax Lah!
Posts: 11,514
Images: 4
So the guy who wants to consult with a lawyer before answering questions is guilty of something?

I absolutely hate it when the media reports it this way. How about...

"By Some Dumass News Writer (AP) - An innocent crew member exercising his rights under the constitution to have counsel present when talking to federal investigators about a fatal duck boat crash in Philadelphia was piloting the tug involved in a collision with a duck boat, a Coast Guard official said Monday. The crew member has spent many years training and obtaining licensing. He makes his living and feeds his family with this profession and is arguably concerned about saying something in public that could be misinterpreted. When involved in legal matters it is usually a good idea to exercise your rights as an American and obtain counsel before being questioned by authorities."


__________________
Relax Lah! is For Sale <--- Click
Click--> Custom CF Google Search or CF Rules
You're gonna need a bigger boat... - Martin Brody
Ex-Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2010, 19:50   #11
Moderator Emeritus
 
David M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: San Francisco Bay
Boat: research vessel
Posts: 10,150
From what I have seen, most journalists are pretty clueless when it comes to maritime related news. They seem totally in over their heads about the subject matter.
__________________
David

Life begins where land ends.
David M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2010, 20:11   #12
Moderator Emeritus
 
Ex-Calif's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2007
Location: Singapore
Boat: Maxi 77 - Relax Lah!
Posts: 11,514
Images: 4
Quote:
By law, either the captain or mate must be at the wheel at all times, said Dady, president of the National Mariners Association and a member of the Coast Guard's Towing Safety Advisory Commission.


A real advocate for professional mariners.

Quote:
Typically, tug captains and mates rotate six-hour shifts, with one person on duty and the other on break, Dady said. The deckhands also rotate shifts, and the NTSB said one was asleep at the time.
"It's 90 percent boredom and 10 percent sheer terror," Dady said of a tug captain's job.



This guy is a real gem idiot.


Quote:
Dady, who operated The Caribbean Sea decades ago when it bore a different name, said the vessel has good maneuverability. He believes the pilot could have changed course in about a minute and come to a full stop in about three minutes, if he knew of the looming peril.
"If there was a proper lookout posted - I'm not saying there was or there wasn't - I would find it hard to believe that he wouldn't have seen that duck boat in time to alert the captain or mate and divert course and prevent the collision," he said


Typical "news" media. You don't have a clue what is going on so talk to any idiot who will give a quote, make up a factless article populated with incorrect information from someone who wasn't there.

This is why I don't read newspapers any more.

BTW - Isn't the better story the 18 y/o part timer operating the unseaworthy duck with the failed engine anchored in the middle of the channel - Oh my God! We need better regulations for tour operators. Quick call a politician.

__________________
Relax Lah! is For Sale <--- Click
Click--> Custom CF Google Search or CF Rules
You're gonna need a bigger boat... - Martin Brody
Ex-Calif is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-07-2010, 01:10   #13
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Seattle
Boat: Work: Ships/Tugs Play: Grand Banks 36
Posts: 76
Indeed, maritime stories are rarely presented accurately in the media (like when the Cosco Busan was referred to repeatedly as an 'oil tanker' - presumably just for the simple fact that oil spewed from it).


Judgment before all the facts are in is never good and of course the mate (just like every other American) has his rights and he should not be vilified for exercising them.
I absolutely do not blame him for doing what he is doing. I would probably be doing the same thing. In today's blame-game society, everything can be stretched into criminal negligence. Lots of people like to point out that the Cosco Busan incident "changed everything" in terms of the criminalization of maritime accidents, but it is my belief that the change happened much earlier and John Cota was the unlucky individual who was made an example of... and he "didn't even kill anyone."


I'm just waiting for the VDR requirement to trickle down to tugs and ferries soon... That'll be fun.
__________________
Watermann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-07-2010, 02:04   #14
********* Emeritus
 
SaucySailoress's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 8,236
I think it is very tragic that the two girls died, and very lucky that the rest of these school children didn't.

I do not wish to cast judgment, but I do believe that there should be no excuse for a barge ramming a pleasure boat. Common sense should surely have dictated that you keep a closer watch when passing through city areas which are frequented by pleasure boats and other such craft - especially if you have limited vision due to your tow. There have been sufficient cases of deaths caused by riverboats colliding to make this obvious.

I personally believe that ramming a disabled craft is negligent. If I ever kill someone due to negligence I really don't know how I would handle. Therefore I really do try to take care and follow safety guidelines, and may 'God' protect me from ever inflicting this pain on another family.
__________________

SaucySailoress is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-07-2010, 03:42   #15
TEE
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 139
I think its too early to place blame in the absence knowing all facts. However, I am a psychic and have the ability to see into the future. I see the Coast Guard investigation, after spending a bunch of tax dollars, and taking intense testimony, coming to the conclusion that both skippers were at fault. That seems to be what the CG always does. I live in Charleston, SC, and a while back in an announced regatta, we had a tour boat run through the announced race course and mow down a becalmed laser with one on board. Then the boat continued on without waiting for the authorities to show up. The CG went so far as to place some of the blame on the skipper of the laser. I guess the laser skipper was at fault for not trying to paddle out of the way of a two hundred foot tour boat roaring toward him.
__________________

__________________
TEE is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Three Dead, Four Hurt in Power Boat Grounding on LI CalebD Powered Boats 18 10-10-2009 05:00
The Sail boat on Dead Calm movie johnar Off Topic Forum 19 23-09-2008 18:01
Giant Barge Drags Onto Us yachtrodney Liveaboard's Forum 10 08-09-2008 01:12
Not dead, just in boat buying hell. MarkJ Off Topic Forum 25 25-04-2008 06:12



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 22:10.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.