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Old 14-02-2018, 17:36   #391
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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To answer your questions- Not a Millennial, but have kids who are. I agree the dissent is manufactured by the elites. Angst,,fair enough, defending this young couple from the unjustified mountains of hate being dropped on them by those who sit in air conditioned yachts. I especially defend how they are breaking free from the false paradigm they were brought up in and the challenges they face. You appear to be aware of their plight, but most of the older generation seem disconnected from young peoples reality and believe what methods and mores worked for them will work for young people today. Completely different circumstances.
A solid work ethic, reasonable planning, education (regarding boats and sailing) along with reasonable intelligence will always come out on top regardless of generation. After reading their newspaper interview and watching their Youtube interview, I suspect this couple would struggle in any generation.
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Old 14-02-2018, 18:06   #392
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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A solid work ethic, reasonable planning, education (regarding boats and sailing) along with reasonable intelligence will always come out on top regardless of generation. After reading their newspaper interview and watching their Youtube interview, I suspect this couple would struggle in any generation.
Their failure is our failure. We are not a community of one. They will most definitely fail if we do not allow them room to succeed. Most kids today are not just brats, but horrible brats. That is our collective failure. Ignorance does not equate to stupidity, just a lack of knowledge. They are 26 and 24, I believe they are right where they should be. I disagree, reasonable intelligence and planning does not guarantee anything. I appears these young people have stepped on your toes and now we just need to flesh out the how and why.
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Old 14-02-2018, 18:07   #393
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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That's liability, not full coverage I suppose.
Good luck getting liability only insurance here.
Also in Queensland, not sure about other states, we have legislation in place for mandatory insurance for wreck removal/cleanup on boats over 15m.
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Old 14-02-2018, 18:14   #394
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

For what it's worth, I have liability only insurance for my boat, and an umbrella liability policy on top of that. Boat policy costs $77/year and will pay salvage costs up to the average price of the boat from three databases (currently around $12k) and the umbrella costs $150/year. My liability coverage is good up to a million.
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Old 14-02-2018, 18:16   #395
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Good luck getting liability only insurance here.
Also in Queensland, not sure about other states, we have legislation in place for mandatory insurance for wreck removal/cleanup on boats over 15m.
I would dance in the street if marinas around here required boats to have liability insurance. Some boats are not worth full coverage insurance. A liability only policy is not cost prohibitive and fits the value of the boat well. Over regulation makes people cut corners.
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Old 14-02-2018, 18:21   #396
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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For what it's worth, I have liability only insurance for my boat, and an umbrella liability policy on top of that. Boat policy costs $77/year and will pay salvage costs up to the average price of the boat from three databases (currently around $12k) and the umbrella costs $150/year. My liability coverage is good up to a million.
Mine is $277/year for liability and comprehensive. Value 16K. My homeowners policy kicks in after 1M.
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Old 14-02-2018, 18:33   #397
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Good luck getting liability only insurance here.
Also in Queensland, not sure about other states, we have legislation in place for mandatory insurance for wreck removal/cleanup on boats over 15m.
I have had no difficulty in buying third party only insurance here in Oz. Not as cheap as in the States (~400 USD/year 10 million AUD coverage).

Perhaps different for m/v?

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Old 14-02-2018, 19:01   #398
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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I have had no difficulty in buying third party only insurance here in Oz. Not as cheap as in the States (~400 USD/year 10 million AUD coverage).

Perhaps different for m/v?

Jim
Who was that with Jim?
Happy to have liability only on ours.
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Old 14-02-2018, 19:05   #399
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Agree. They were going sailing. Not dealing drugs, drunk driving or shooting people.

Who hasn't ****ed up when they were young? Some of us were lucky enough to survive it.

However, when I bought my first real sailboat at 21, I was working full time, paying rent for a house, owned a car, etc. I was not expecting the world to support me if I f*cked up. These two are just lazy, not too bright, and will be a disaster statistic again, and possibly not so lucky the next time
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Old 14-02-2018, 19:05   #400
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

We gave Rebel Heart a hundred bucks straight out of our kitty after they lost their boat. When was that? Four years ago already? Man, time flies....
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Old 14-02-2018, 19:41   #401
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Who was that with Jim?
Happy to have liability only on ours.
PM sent.

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Old 14-02-2018, 20:36   #402
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

Just an FYI, to quote Bruce Krohn over at the Columbia owners group (This has been a big topic of discussion there too):

"My data indicates that the lead keel is attached with 7, 3/4" X 8" lag screws. They are probably galvanized iron. I think that the problem may be that the bolts are down in the stub keel and that forms a small bilge. If that is not kept dry, the bolt heads may have rusted. Also, with the lead/stub keel joint, if that leaks some, there is another possibility of water intrusion and rust."

I don't think they planned, or knew, back in 1967 or so these boats would last for this long, at least not without replacing the keel bolts!
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Old 14-02-2018, 20:53   #403
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Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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I'm not a big supporter of the world of insurance, but for folks without assets third party liability insurance seems the responsible thing to do.



Jim

Technically the more assets you have the more liability coverage you should have.

If you have no assets people are unlikely to come after you since it's impractical to get much in return. If you do have assets the arithmetic of filing a suit changes. If you have sufficient liability coverage they likely won't come after your personal assets.

I was recently researching how much umbrella coverage one should have. The typical advice as been at least as much as your assets. The more coverage you get the cheaper it gets (e.g. the 2nd MIL is usually 50% of the first MIL) The part I couldn't come to grips with is say someone became disabled in a car accident: If have 2 mil umbrella and 2 mil in assets, wouldn't the lawyers just go for a 4 mil judgment? But what I learned is that getting restitution from the insurance company doesn't require going to court. So when the insurance company says we'll pay 2mil, that's usually the end of it. Because the alternative would be to go get a lawyer, go to court, hopefully win a 4 mil judgement and then the plaintiff would still only get 2mil and change because the lawyers would take about 40% of the settlement.

Moral of the story is if you have assets, get liability insurance and consider an umbrella policy.

The corollary is if you are the plaintiff, BEFORE getting a lawyer (and giving up 40% of the settlement) find out what the insurance will pay. Just taking the insurance settlement without a lawyer may be far easier and more lucrative...

Also if you get a lawyer first he'll likely just push to take the insurance settlement only, because he'd earn say 750k for basically no work.
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Old 14-02-2018, 21:13   #404
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Moral of the story is if you have assets, get liability insurance and consider an umbrella policy.
+1 for the umbrella policy!
It can bail you out of an expensive pickle you didn't even know existed.
(Lamborghini + scam artist = expensive pickle)
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Old 14-02-2018, 21:28   #405
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Re: Another Keel Lost; Another Capsize

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Please show me where they are begging for money or have a YT channel. Or did you just a$$ume they did? And before you get too smug Baby Boomer, Millennial kids have to face challenges you never dreamed of. Lets see if you can make it in their world. Doubt it.
OK, here it is: https://www.gofundme.com/new-sailing-life. Up to nearly $16,000.
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